Anyone shooting a 460 Rowland conversion?

[TauPhi111]

Anyone here shooting a 460 Rowland in a 1911 or 5" XD? I've been thinking about doing one of these for a woods defense pistol. Looking for any insight or opinions from those who have shot one.

 

[go4thegusto]

I had one once and it worked fine in an XD. Now running a 40 Super in an FNX. Look at Fire Dragon barrels.

 

[thinhorn_AK]

Net yet but have a project in the works. I have a Glock 21 and the 460 kit. However, I dont have any ammo and I havn't put the thing together yet due to being busy and some unforseen circumstances that have kept me away from home for the past few weeks. Eventually, I'll get some ammo and put it together and check it out.

 

[Yellowknife]

I've been around several XD conversions quite a bit and have a Glock version myself. Have seen most of the kits out there. Honestly, not a recommended project unless you really like tinkering with guns. I have yet to see one run 100% without a fair amount of work. Biggest issue with the XD's is the magazine and feed ramps. They almost always require magazine modifications allow the rounds come up faster and feed smoother and the feed ramp has to be absolutely polished and perfect or the case will jam in at an angle. Essentially the issue is that the slide comes back fast and for lack of a better term "bounces" off the stop and slams forward again with too much speed. Makes for a really tough feeding situation that seems to require tuning to get right. Stiffer springs will slow the recoil of the slide but doesn't help with speed of return since now are adding more spring behind it.

My Glock is a basic conversion with a 6" LW barrel and a heavy recoil spring. It shoots great if I hold it with reasonably relaxed grip, but if I stiff arm it I get the same slide speed issues and it gets feeding jams also. That one is un-ported, but I suspect that ports might help slow everything down and improve things for that piece. Haven't got there yet.

Also know one guy that blew one to pieces handloading for it. There is very little safety factor left and he ended up with a smoldering pile of parts when he went just slightly too high. Caution recommended if you go that route.

For a Glock, I'm pretty much a 10mm fan for ease of ammo acquisition and high reliability. In an XD I'd probably stop at .45 Super and call it good.

 

[blackovis]

10mm. Cheaper, safer, you can push some 220 grain hard casts out at 1300-1400 fps. Serious power and penetration with 15-16rds on tap. Too me the Rowland conversion is just too finicky to rely on in a situation when it matters.

 

[thinhorn_AK]

10mm. Cheaper, safer, you can push some 220 grain hard casts out at 1300-1400 fps. Serious power and penetration with 15-16rds on tap. Too me the Rowland conversion is just too finicky to rely on in a situation when it matters.

This is more or less my line of thinking and another big part of the reason I havn't put mine together yet. I already had a glock 21 laying around that I hadn't shot for several years and I got the conversion kit off a buddy for about 1/2 the regular price so really, I have very little $$$ or sweat into it. It will be a range toy at most.

 

[TauPhi111]

I had one once and it worked fine in an XD. Now running a 40 Super in an FNX. Look at Fire Dragon barrels.

A buddy of mine runs that exact gun. Pretty wicked round.

So has anyone tried the round in a 1911? Seems that might be more reliable than a glock or XD. And yes, I like tinkering with guns

 

[TauPhi111]

10mm. Cheaper, safer, you can push some 220 grain hard casts out at 1300-1400 fps. Serious power and penetration with 15-16rds on tap. Too me the Rowland conversion is just too finicky to rely on in a situation when it matters.

where did you find load data for this? That seems a little hot. Even buffalo bore's hottest load only does 1200 with 220's

 

[Clarktar]

Timely thread. I have a Rowland conversion kit for a XDm compact but haven't bought the pistol yet. Got the kit in a trade.

Wondering about 10mm and 45 super...

Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk

 

[Buglebrush]

I've been around several XD conversions quite a bit and have a Glock version myself. Have seen most of the kits out there. Honestly, not a recommended project unless you really like tinkering with guns. I have yet to see one run 100% without a fair amount of work. Biggest issue with the XD's is the magazine and feed ramps. They almost always require magazine modifications allow the rounds come up faster and feed smoother and the feed ramp has to be absolutely polished and perfect or the case will jam in at an angle. Essentially the issue is that the slide comes back fast and for lack of a better term "bounces" off the stop and slams forward again with too much speed. Makes for a really tough feeding situation that seems to require tuning to get right. Stiffer springs will slow the recoil of the slide but doesn't help with speed of return since now are adding more spring behind it.

My Glock is a basic conversion with a 6" LW barrel and a heavy recoil spring. It shoots great if I hold it with reasonably relaxed grip, but if I stiff arm it I get the same slide speed issues and it gets feeding jams also. That one is un-ported, but I suspect that ports might help slow everything down and improve things for that piece. Haven't got there yet.

Also know one guy that blew one to pieces handloading for it. There is very little safety factor left and he ended up with a smoldering pile of parts when he went just slightly too high. Caution recommended if you go that route.

For a Glock, I'm pretty much a 10mm fan for ease of ammo acquisition and high reliability. In an XD I'd probably stop at .45 Super and call it good.

What would be required to turn my XD 5" Tactical into .45 Super? I was definitely planning on getting the Rowland Kit this year, but you're making me think twice.

 

[Colby]

Also just as an FYI you can safely run .45 super out of a stock Hk USP.

 

[Brendan]

Also just as an FYI you can safely run .45 super out of a stock Hk USP.

Tried this briefly, and had some failure to feeds... Didn't try much after that.

Have done a lot of research, and you can get the same velocities out of 45 super as compared to the Rowland if you reload. But, to really take advantage of both over the 10mm, you need to have a compensator in addition to upgraded springs, in order to get the slide speed down. But, I've seen some tests where people were getting low level 44 mag energies out of a G21 45 Super with a comp... That's complete with looking at how fast / far the shells eject as a proxy for slide speeds.

I personally have a G21, with barrels to run 10mm, .45, .45 super, including a custom compensator that I have yet to try...

 

[Wapiti1]

My 460 conversion is a Glock 21 that I did myself. I also did one for my dad on his XD. Both got heavier recoil springs, but to really get these right, you need a compensator. I tried a ported barrel, and didn't think it was the way to go, so I cut it down and threaded it for a comp. The comp is the best way to get the slide speed right. Has to have a fully supported chamber barrel.

No issue getting 230's to 1350-1400fps. My stoutest load is a 265gr hardcast at 1250fps.

These do take some work to make them reliable, but ours have been perfect after we worked the bugs out. Have to change out the mag springs. May need to resize lead bullets to .451".

I've not seen 45 Super data that was equivalent to the Rowland.

Jeremy

 

[Himark]

I have a xd tatical that I run 45 super in you can use the factory 18lb spring. I bought a 1911 style guide rod think it was from wolf and a 22lb recoil spring, tried 24 but was to heavy had some malfunctions. I hand load there is a slot of data out there that will out run a 10mm. I have found for me when you start getting hot loads the split trigger starts biting my finger. My main load is a 185 grain Barnes at a little over 1400fps.

 

[Downeaster]

Ive got an XD just sitting in the safe doing nothing. This project has been floating around for a while since theres a few in line in front of it. Just for giggles, whose barrel/comp and spring combos have you all tried and what ones worked best?
Thanks

 

[Clarktar]

I have had a Rowland barrel for a XDm 3.8 for a few years now, but have been on the fence and haven't bought the pistol yet. Seems like it takes a fair amount of work to get one to function properly

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[Brendan]

I've not seen 45 Super data that was equivalent to the Rowland.

Not my loads or testing, but some .45 Super load data points from a large thread over on GlockTalk, didn't look too long but these are the ones that come up:

1100 fps with 335 gr cast in 45 SUPER G21.

260 cast at 1275 fps, 215 and 240 cast at 1330-1340 fps

265 CP WFN bullet to 1240 fps/904 ft lb .

Glock 21 longslide, 6.6" LW barrel, custom comp 185xtp @ 1530fps / 961lbs energy.

 

[Wapiti1]

Brendan, those are pretty wicked loads. Much higher than any data that I have seen for 45 Super. I'll have to do some more looking at that cartridge.

We used a 20 pound Wolff spring on my dad's XD 5" with an EFK barrel. I made the comp for it so it matched the slide profile. 2 top ports on the comp. On the Glock, 22 pound spring, Storm Lake barrel, homemade 2 port comp for it as well.

Jeremy

 

[Brendan]

Brendan, those are pretty wicked loads. Much higher than any data that I have seen for 45 Super. I'll have to do some more looking at that cartridge.

We used a 20 pound Wolff spring on my dad's XD 5" with an EFK barrel. I made the comp for it so it matched the slide profile. 2 top ports on the comp. On the Glock, 22 pound spring, Storm Lake barrel, homemade 2 port comp for it as well.

Jeremy

Want to be very clear none of those are my loads or my experience. I do have the comp, and aftermarket barrel to start experimenting. This is the (very long) thread, over the course of years, but some good data and some good testing going on here:

45 Super? | The Leading Glock Forum and Community - GlockTalk.com

 

[TauPhi111]

Thanks everyone for your input. I've actually decided to go with a Glock 20 in 10mm, and I'll get an aftermarket 6" barrel for it to shoot the heavy casts and gain some FPS. I actually went and shot a 1911 and a G21 side by side at the range this weekend, and although I have kinda disliked Glocks my whole life, I must say I was converted that night. I love love love the 1911, but I just shot the Glock better. The wide frame dissipates recoil less, and I was no less accurate with it than the 1911. As for 10mm vs 460, I was really only interested in the 460 if I was going with a 1911 platform. I don't like that you have to remove a threaded on compensator every time you want to field strip the gun if using a Glock or XD. With the ported versions, you need to add a weird weight to the slide to slow your slide velocity and I don't want that. That said, with the 10mm I'll have better load data, and I can achieve similar velocities with similar weight bullets (220 vs 250) that have a better SD and should pennetrate better. 460 has about 200 more FPE, but but also more recoil. I think when facing down a bear, accurate pennetration to the CNS or major bones is going to win out over a little more mass and energy.