Ac unit suggestions

[Poeschel]

One thing I’d caution you about. If you DIY and have a problem down the road that you can’t fix, most contractors won’t want to touch it. In most cases you’re better off to hire a pro, get a 10 year warranty and have a reputable company that will fix you up when shit goes bad.

 

[S.Clancy]

Just had our furnace replaced and AC installed. I looked at doing it myself, but it just wasn't worth it when DIY means you void manufacturer warranty.

For a price comparison, we did AC and 97% Eff furnace, plus install, for 10K. The AC only quote was 4200$. So 13K sounds insane.

 

[trazerr]

Just had our furnace replaced and AC installed. I looked at doing it myself, but it just wasn't worth it when DIY means you void manufacturer warranty.

For a price comparison, we did AC and 97% Eff furnace, plus install, for 10K. The AC only quote was 4200$. So 13K sounds insane.

Dang that’s so so cheap. I just got quotes from 4 companies last week ranging from $6.5k for the absolute most basic AC unit(nothing else) to $27k for basic 2 stage 80% furnace and 15 seer heat pump. Oregon is so freaking expensive.

I ended up going with a leftover 2023 18 seer variable/modulating heat pump and keeping my old single stage gas furnace (hopefully). About $8k installed (not including permits and filter upgrade). Same exact one but 2024 model would have been about $10.5k. 10 year labor and part warranty via manufacturer which is nice.

Most were $15-18k for new basic single stage ac and 80% basic gas furnace. Hoping old furnace holds out.

Edit: my house is 1,600 square ft and only needs a 2.5-3t max. Most companies said average install for my area is $20-23k for AC and furnace.

 

[S.Clancy]

Dang that’s so so cheap. I just got quotes from 4 companies last week ranging from $6.5k for the absolute most basic AC unit(nothing else) to $27k for basic 2 stage 80% furnace and 15 seer heat pump. Oregon is so freaking expensive.

I ended up going with a leftover 2023 18 seer variable/modulating heat pump and keeping my old single stage gas furnace (hopefully). About $8k installed (not including permits and filter upgrade). Same exact one but 2024 model would have been about $10.5k. 10 year labor and part warranty via manufacturer which is nice.

Most were $15-18k for new basic single stage ac and 80% basic gas furnace. Hoping old furnace holds out.

Edit: my house is 1,600 square ft and only needs a 2.5-3t max. Most companies said average install for my area is $20-23k for AC and furnace.

Damn, I feel for you guys out there. Those prices are nuts

 

[Wiley coyote]

I'll be installing my own system from scratch. Going with a ducted heat pump. Just spent 1500 on the ducting, boots, registers. Going with a Mitsubishi hyper heat as Winter temps in my area can easily dip below 0 for extended periods. Materials alone when complete will be about 12k. This is one of the most efficient units on the market and built by the most reputable company in the industry. Have a friend that does HVAC so that helps with charging the system. Remember there are strict regulations requiring high efficiency units and those units are very spendy. Yes some contractors are way out of line with prices and yes prices fluctuate by region. Just look at what service and materials are being provided before scoffing at the price.

 

[ODB]

Been thinking about replacing my ac unit and looking at DIY ing it and wondering if folks on here have ever done it?
I’m descently handy and trying to get an idea on how to do this

Last quote we got was north of 13k for a replacement with install

Not about to pay that

Was that a full HVAC - heat and air or just the AC? In the treasure valley?

 

[hunterjmj]

In Idaho you don’t have high humidity and won’t have freeze up issues if you’re a little oversize, but I don’t know that 3.5 ton is too much overkill unless the house is quite small.

My hvac buddy has a 5 ton in his 1,700 sqft house, and that’s almost exactly what we have in a climate very similar to southern ID.

A very basic low SEER is less problematic and easier to fix. I think Goodman fits in that category. Watching repair videos on YouTube, repair guys are always making fun of how unreliable and how designed to fail high SEER models are. Refrigerant valves are designed to fail - the old orifice controlled evaporators never fail.

In Europe R22 units are simply run with new oil and R134 - it’s the American hvac industry lobbying $$$$$ that have had laws passed that require complete new units that also require a higher pressure lineset. Legalized robbery and most Americans don’t know how badly they are being screwed and simply say, “Thank you, can I have another.” My R22 unit has run on R134 for a decade with zero issues - I get the same delta T with lower pressures than R22, so it’s even easier on the compressor. It would benefit from the next lower size orifice, but works as good as R22 ever did. Gauges are just the same old R22 model.

The hvac lobbying $$$$ have also passed regulations that make no sense other than to put money in the pocket of installers and dissuade diy installs - like requiring brazing the lineset. It passes a building inspection to use flare union that has been soldered at the seat where copper tubing meets brass flare - it’s technically a flare connection, but is as leak free as a silver soldered or braised connection - stupid to have to work around stupid regulations.

The refrigeration installers are allowed to use low temp silver solder like Harris Stay Bright 8 on line sets, but magically it’s too low pressure for residential hvac?! Total horse schitt - a Stay Brite 8 joint is stronger than the copper tubing. Thank you big corporate greed, can I have another!

Corporate donations to elected government officials are costing us all a bunch of money in all aspects of our lives and all we say is, “Thank you can I have another.” Horse schitt.

Been doing refrigeration for many years and have always brazed, piping, with 15% silver. Most commercial jobs you can't use sb8 because of its low melting point which could release refrigerant in a fire. I'll stick with flowing nitrogen and brazing. Also, r-22 and r-134 are two totally different refrigerants with completely different capacities. R-134 will work in an r-22 compressor but with a major loss in capacity/performance. Always follow compressor manufacturer guidelines when changing refrigerants in a compressor. R-22 and R-134 have different displacement requirements which is why they are not compatible in a given compressor.

 

[IDVortex]

Dang that’s so so cheap. I just got quotes from 4 companies last week ranging from $6.5k for the absolute most basic AC unit(nothing else) to $27k for basic 2 stage 80% furnace and 15 seer heat pump. Oregon is so freaking expensive.

I ended up going with a leftover 2023 18 seer variable/modulating heat pump and keeping my old single stage gas furnace (hopefully). About $8k installed (not including permits and filter upgrade). Same exact one but 2024 model would have been about $10.5k. 10 year labor and part warranty via manufacturer which is nice.

Most were $15-18k for new basic single stage ac and 80% basic gas furnace. Hoping old furnace holds out.

Edit: my house is 1,600 square ft and only needs a 2.5-3t max. Most companies said average install for my area is $20-23k for AC and furnace.

What part of Oregon? Sounds like portland pricing , and even then. That's high as the local pot head.

 

[TaperPin]

Been doing refrigeration for many years and have always brazed, piping, with 15% silver. Most commercial jobs you can't use sb8 because of its low melting point which could release refrigerant in a fire. I'll stick with flowing nitrogen and brazing. Also, r-22 and r-134 are two totally different refrigerants with completely different capacities. R-134 will work in an r-22 compressor but with a major loss in capacity/performance. Always follow compressor manufacturer guidelines when changing refrigerants in a compressor. R-22 and R-134 have different displacement requirements which is why they are not compatible in a given compressor.

Yes, the industry has all sorts of literature on why r22 can’t be replaced with r134, the sky will fall, bla bla bla. Other countries don’t have any problems with it and after years in service all the industry scare tactics in the US just don’t hold water. Before and after switching we saw no increase in electrical use, nor a decrease in our deltaT, so the lower capacity of r134 or different compressor requirements doesn’t make as large a difference as many would lead us to believe.

Older catalogs showed a scroll compressor rated for R134 with specifications very very close to the scroll in our system - after R22 was phased out that part number was dropped, but it wouldn’t surprise me if it was the same compressor with different oil and label.

I’m not even saying for anyone to believe me - plenty of European literature is more detailed with results obtained over decades of use after conversion.

 

[hunterjmj]

Yes, the industry has all sorts of literature on why r22 can’t be replaced with r134, the sky will fall, bla bla bla. Other countries don’t have any problems with it and after years in service all the industry scare tactics in the US just don’t hold water. Before and after switching we saw no increase in electrical use, nor a decrease in our deltaT, so the lower capacity of r134 or different compressor requirements doesn’t make as large a difference as many would lead us to believe.

Older catalogs showed a scroll compressor rated for R134 with specifications very very close to the scroll in our system - after R22 was phased out that part number was dropped, but it wouldn’t surprise me if it was the same compressor with different oil and label.

I’m not even saying for anyone to believe me - plenty of European literature is more detailed with results obtained over decades of use after conversion.

You do what you will. There are refrigerants that better match R-22 and are cheaper for replacement.
Now, if you have an R-12 system, R-134 would be a great replacement refrigerant as long as you replace the oil. I'd love to read the literature on replacing r-22 with r-134. I read a lot of industry articles and I've never read what you claim. I believe you may be confusing R-22 with R-12?

 

[Gobbler36]

Was that a full HVAC - heat and air or just the AC? In the treasure valley?

Just A/C
From one company
Another did come out last week and gave me 8k for very basic new outside unit.

 

[ODB]

Just A/C
From one company
Another did come out last week and gave me 8k for very basic new outside unit.

Holy crap man. We had to replace ours two years ago and we did both furnace (2-stage) and AC since they were original to the house and it was 10k. My two neighbors also had their systems replaced within a year and price was also 10k. Still too much, especially with the not-so-great service we got at setup. I did end up getting a good tech (turns out he was a competitive archer) and he thankfully got us going. The inside coils were the V type and they had some issues getting the condensation to flow correctly.

 

[jjohnsonElknewbie]

I had new furnace and ac installed last year for around $13k. Granted we live out in the middle of nowhere IA, but the compnay came out of DSM and did and excellent job.

$13k just for the AC unit sounds insane.

EDIT: I got $2000 credit for my old AC unit from the 80s due to a promotion they were running. Our furnace was also from 1998.

The units they put in required new PVC intake and exhaust pipes to be installed through the wall. The amount of flow is incredible and the efficiency has enabled me to run the AC at 73 vs. 76 in the old unit and I'm still saving around $40 per month on my electric.

Our house was built in 1919, has a stone foundation and is not "tight". We have vinyl siding and double pane HE windows, but she's still a little drafty.

 

[trazerr]

What part of Oregon? Sounds like portland pricing , and even then. That's high as the local pot head.

I am about 20-25mins SW of Portland so close enough. Oregon is one of the most expensive states to live in so its not too surprising.

 

[TaperPin]

You do what you will. There are refrigerants that better match R-22 and are cheaper for replacement.
Now, if you have an R-12 system, R-134 would be a great replacement refrigerant as long as you replace the oil. I'd love to read the literature on replacing r-22 with r-134. I read a lot of industry articles and I've never read what you claim. I believe you may be confusing R-22 with R-12?

It was 10 years, actually 12 years ago, when I was reading about it and changed our system. Google is not the same google today that it was then - duplicating the rather simple search didn’t turn up any documents from that time period, but a huge amount of stuff talking about the EU phasing out R134a completely for more environmentally friendly gasses with lower global warming potential to meet some 2016 international agreement. There are some abstracts from retrofitted chillers going from R22 to R134a, but the articles weren’t downloadable to an iPad, and probably aren’t that useful.

It’s a mute point today - nobody is going to purposely set up or retrofit a system for r134a, except a tinkerer like me, and we are a dying breed. I do feel better for ranting about it though. Our neighborhood was built in the 1970’s and there are a number of little old people that can’t afford a complete new system, and at least in this town nobody will retrofit a R22 system with anything, other than a complete new system. Our favorite little old lady spent her last few years in a hot house with a window mounted AC - doesn’t seem right.

This discussion reminded me our system is getting up there in years and I should line up a source for a new compressor. Low and behold Copeland has a 5 ton model rated for R22 or R134a or R407c under the same part number for air conditioning applications. It’s funny this was taken out of their catalog for a while and now it’s back.

Buying ten lbs of r134a for $2/lb at Walmart didn’t seem expensive a dozen years ago - definitely not worth buying a bulk tank for one residential system.