25-06 and Elk

KurtR said:
A small fast bullet zips through steel that’s why there are fps limits at matches. A ballistic expert as your self should know that. You didn’t answer Ryan how much energy do you need to kill an elk?
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Yep. I’ve shot a 17 HMR 17 grain bullet through 1/4” steel. Pretty sure it was a mild steel. So type of steel matters, as does velocity.
 
LoggerDan said:
How many lost animals? How many one shot kills? What kinda tracking jobs? The truth now….


who would take it grizzly hunting?
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If you make a bad shot on the critter - who's fault is that? The gun? the bullet? It's the dweedle behind the scope that did it and it happens with all calibers.

Folks shoot elk and moose all the time with 100 gr 243. It works, wouldn't be my choice but if that's all a guy has, and he's got some semblance of control to wait for an optimum shot, have at it. Same for 25-06.

They kill grizzlies with 9mm handguns (there is an article somewhere), why not a 243 or 25-06? Put a copper bullet in there and shoot em dead. Nothing is invincible.

Don't get me wrong, I'd prefer a heavier bullet. Maybe he just wants to use what he's got, or it is the after season doldrums around here. Trolled him up some takers.
 
For the naysayers, how many elk have you killed? How far are you comfortable shooting and why are those numbers what they are?

There's a component of deadlyness that lies in experience. Shooting, killing, stalking, bullet and headstamp choices....etc, experience pays.
 
I've been hunting elk successfully for 20 years. Pretty succesfuly. I got my first trad elk this fall, which I was pretty jacked about.

A lot of the bullet of choice recommended on here is not recommended for anything over varmints, 333 ft/lb is the same energy at the muzzle of a 22 WMN, with prior recommendation as a hip shot to anchor animals (which I have a hard time with if you even pretend to care about meat). Pretty sure I said we are all adults and can make our own decisions. If this hurts your feelings I apologize.
 
We discuss smaller calibers for elk because they are not dangerous. If a wounded elk could jump you like a brownie, we would all up are calibers. I think the biggest thing is bullet choice. Much like caliber, bullet selection is important. Oh and nobody talks about the ones that get away. Will it work, yes, is it the best choice?
 
Energy numbers on paper don't kill animals, tissue upset does.

500ft/lbs on a 1" diameter ball is not going to penetrate skin....swap over to a needle and it's going through 3 miles of tissue.

I just recovered my 308 cal 225gr bullet from an elk I just killed and while it is heavier than the 140gr pills I have killed so many elk with....it did no better tissue upset nor penetration.

That's not a guess, it's experience.
 
Billy Goat said:
I know of piles of whitetail that survived the 'ol 300 win mag. So maybe first we should decide minimums for deer, then we can move upto elk.
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People talk about elk being tough, but I unfortunately lost a nice whitetail quite a few years ago, that I hit too far back with a 125 gr Partition. He went a long, long ways. Most people don't hunt whitetails in wilderness setting so it's not an apples to apples comparison, but really any animal hit badly can go a long ways.
I've always wondered how that one would have turned out had I been shooting a softer bullet.
Placement, placement, placement.......
 
woods89 said:
People talk about elk being tough, but I unfortunately lost a nice whitetail quite a few years ago, that I hit too far back with a 125 gr Partition. He went a long, long ways. Most people don't hunt whitetails in wilderness setting so it's not an apples to apples comparison, but really any animal hit badly can go a long ways.
I've always wondered how that one would have turned out had I been shooting a softer bullet.
Placement, placement, placement.......
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Seems to be a mindset that if you get over 200gr on a whitetail you just hafta hit hair.


Don't use match bullets either, they are terrible for killing. They just blow up.


Forget the fact that there's a surprising majority that are happy with pie plate at 100, it's all you need.
Then they pop off a shot @ 3x that because their gun shoots a long ways.
 
littlerhorner said:
A lot of the bullet of choice recommended on here is not recommended for anything over varmints, 333 ft/lb is the same energy at the muzzle of a 22 WMN,
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And not recommended by whom? Manufacturers that are in business to sell bullets? Over decades they’ve convinced the masses that you need different bullets to effectively kill varmints vs big game vs paper targets. That way they can get customers to purchase 3x the amount of ammo vs using one load for everything.

You are a newbie on this site but an experienced (indoctrinated) hunter. I’m happy for your success, but it pays to have an open mind and to learn from the experiences of others. There is a crap ton of real world information on Rokslide that can help both new and veteran hunters. Just because something challenges your beliefs, doesn’t mean it isn’t true.

Shoot whatever you like and have had success with in your experience. However, don’t ignorantly discount the effectiveness of “non-traditional” smalller caliber rounds, because you’ve been drinking the same gun writer tea from the 80s.

My God, the .25-06 is literally using the same parent cartridge as the renowned .30-06. It has the same powder capacity and with a fast twist barrel and heavy bullets shoots dramatically flatter, deflects wind better, and carries more velocity and “energy” further than the .30-06.

To answer the “why?” question somebody posed before, I will answer with a question. Why wouldn’t I use a .25-06 that can shoot flatter, is less deflected by wind, and carries more velocity and energy vs a .30-06 or other .30 cal magnum? The .25-06 recoils significantly less than the .30 cal and this fact makes it an excellent choice for me as well as my smaller statures daughters.

If I want to get my shoulder kicked off at a range session I can take my .35 Whelen out to prove I’m a man (insert eye roll).
 
I have seen a whitetail carcass that was shot with a 50 bmg. the projectile had originally been an fmj, but the tip was cut off, drilled out slightly, and the cavity filled with plastic prior to the shot. The impact appeared to be in the gut/hindquarter/loin region, the shot was reportedly through a small tree (2-3" diameter), deer was <100 yards from the shooter.

The deer looked like it had been cut apart with a chainsaw. only a small portion of the abdominal wall and hide held the hind legs onto the front half. Most of the flesh from the ribcage to the knees was completely missing, includng the hide and bones. It was truly an astonishing thing to see, what remained was only about 40% of a deer.
 
ResearchinStuff said:
I have seen a whitetail carcass that was shot with a 50 bmg. the projectile had originally been an fmj, but the tip was cut off, drilled out slightly, and the cavity filled with plastic prior to the shot. The impact appeared to be in the gut/hindquarter/loin region, the shot was reportedly through a small tree (2-3" diameter), deer was <100 yards from the shooter.

The deer looked like it had been cut apart with a chainsaw. only a small portion of the abdominal wall and hide held the hind legs onto the front half. Most of the flesh from the ribcage to the knees was completely missing, includng the hide and bones. It was truly an astonishing thing to see, what remained was only about 40% of a deer.
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Sounds like a rather efficient gut job. Remember anything worth doing is worth over-doing.
Did that deer look like this mouse?

20200407_171154.jpg
 
that mouse is relatively intact compared to the deer. the deer was missing about half it's spine, the entire pelvis, and at least most of both femurs.
 
Ha. I'll try and get one with the 223 next time. That one waited in the same corner of the barn for far to long. Let me walk back to the house and grab the 22 pistol.
 
223 and something like a 40 gr hollowpoint might replicate what happened to that deer. The next closest thing I've ever seen was a groundhog absorbing a head shot from a 75 gr vmax out of a 25/06 at about 20 yards. The hide remained attached to the carcass, but the entire skull and brian were liquified/ejected from the hide.
 
ResearchinStuff said:
I have seen a whitetail carcass that was shot with a 50 bmg. the projectile had originally been an fmj, but the tip was cut off, drilled out slightly, and the cavity filled with plastic prior to the shot. The impact appeared to be in the gut/hindquarter/loin region, the shot was reportedly through a small tree (2-3" diameter), deer was <100 yards from the shooter.

The deer looked like it had been cut apart with a chainsaw. only a small portion of the abdominal wall and hide held the hind legs onto the front half. Most of the flesh from the ribcage to the knees was completely missing, includng the hide and bones. It was truly an astonishing thing to see, what remained was only about 40% of a deer.
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Did they have to track it very far?
 
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