.223 for bear, mountain goat, deer, elk, and moose.

[doc holiday13]

Those noggin shots are great til you're off 2" and disable their jaw.

Still lethal, just takes a lot longer.


The volume of deer stacked with damage permits and 40-55 gr bullets in .223, there's no real reason to not be able to use them as far as I can tell.

But he'll, just everything I heard today alone has my head hurting. 270 minimum? Don't use match bullets, they are only for paper?

Our big deer are 230# on the hoof, but due to the years of road hunters using .22 cal, their hair/hide has evolved to Kevlar material.....
Genetic selection

Min .270... bwaaa.. ... clearly someone somewhere is a very poor shot. 6ARC isn't a barrel burner and its PLENTY bullet enough. I can't even wrap my head around thinking 270 is a min caliber

 

[ElPollo]

We're restricted to .23 caliber.....

That’s unfortunate and uninformed.

 

[Schmo]

It’s old hat here, but just another data point. First big game animal that I’ve taken with a .223. Hand loads with 77TMK. Whitetail doe, broadside at 353 yards. Upon impact, she folded like a $5 tent. She was dead before she hit the ground. Roughly 2100 fps impact velocity. Destroyed top of the lungs.

 

[MEwaters]

Pretty stoked, this is my first harvest of any kind and second year out hunting.
73 Eldm from 1-7 16”
20 yards and dropped

 

[Chris_in_Idaho]

Pretty stoked, this is my first harvest of any kind and second year out hunting.
73 Eldm from 1-7 16”
20 yards and dropped


View attachment 791797View attachment 791799

Nicely done!!

 

[BasicUtahrd95]

Pretty stoked, this is my first harvest of any kind and second year out hunting.
73 Eldm from 1-7 16”
20 yards and dropped


View attachment 791797View attachment 791799

First of many I hope! Way to go! First kill is a big deal!

 

[MEwaters]

First of many I hope! Way to go! First kill is a big deal!

God is good! Many 3am mornings before work and many a miles walked in 800 acre woods. Dragging 2.2 miles out now

 

[sierracharlie338]

Pretty stoked, this is my first harvest of any kind and second year out hunting.
73 Eldm from 1-7 16”
20 yards and dropped


View attachment 791797View attachment 791799

Awesome work dude. Big congrats!

 

[omicron1792]

First time to add some data to this thread.

My young boys shot two small bucks with 223 with 77TMK yesterday. Both were their first bucks and I’m proud of them both.

First was 110 yard shot with my 10 year old. Deer dropped on shot, got up and ran. Was found 30 yards away dead. Shot was a little low but the wound channel was massive all the way through. Minimal blood trail but again shot could have been several inches higher.




The second was 60 yard shot with my 8 year old. The deer jumped high on the shot, fell to ground, got up and ran off. I found no blood and brought in a dog. We found a blood trail starting 100 yards from shot. The dog jumped the deer alive about 200 yards from the shot, chased the deer about 600 yards into a large pond. We found the deer carcass this morning. The coyotes had gotten to it so couldn’t tell where the shot was.

Very happy with first deer. Hard to know with second but obviously not a boiler room hit. I don’t think a larger caliber would have made a difference. Bloodied my one son good, the other one will have to get bloodied on his second deer!

 

[buffybr]

There are MUCH better cartridge choices!

 

[Machingeaneer]

There are MUCH better cartridge choices!

Did someone ask?

 

[Taudisio]

There are MUCH better cartridge choices!

Ah yes, jumping into a forum conversation without reading what has already been discussed over 462 pages and 9,250 comments, so the world can hear your thoughts.

 

[buffybr]

Did someone ask?

I didn't read all 463 pages of this thread.

On page 1, the OP wrote "Based on my sample of one, the 77 TMK out of a .223 is truly a lethal combination well suited to a dedicated lower 48 big game rifle."

I saw further posts showing pictures of animals killed with .223s.

Yes, if all things are perfect, a .223 will kill any of the animals that he listed.

I've had friends that used their .22-250 or .220 Swift to kill a black bear every year, multiple elk, 3 mountain goats that I knew of, and at least 4 buffalo. They were all excellent shooters, and they only talked about the animals that they had killed, they never said much about the ones that they wounded and got away.

My Eskimo guide on my Musk ox hunt told me he killed a polar bear with his .223. When I asked him how many shots it took, he just smiled.

I have 2 rifles chambered in .223, and another in .22-250 that I used to make one shot kills on at least 4 deer and pronghorn antelope. I have also killed around a dozen deer with a .22 LR (and not wounded or lost any), but I don't recommend it as a deer cartridge either.

I have also successfully DIY hunted all of the animals listed in the OP's first post, so my opinion is based on my first hand experiences and not on internet posts. Many new and inexperienced hunters look to the internet for advice for their own hunting.

Not all shots in hunting situations are perfect, and I hate to see animals being wounded and suffer after being shot, so I stand by my opinion that a .223 is lethal, but it is NOT truly well suited to a dedicated lower 48 big game rifle.

Ah yes, jumping into a forum conversation without reading what has already been discussed over 462 pages and 9,250 comments, so the world can hear your thoughts.

So can I only repy if I agree with the OP's post?

 

[Machingeaneer]

Not all shots in hunting situations are perfect, and I hate to see animals being wounded and suffer after being shot, so I stand by my opinion that a .223 is lethal, but it is NOT truly well suited to a dedicated lower 48 big game rifle.

And you're fully entitled to this opinion but this thread isn't asking for opinions on the viability of .223 or any .22 cal on big game. It's a place to share facts and evidence of it's viability on big game. Clearly plenty of folks are very successful with it. Bad shots aren't any better because the boom was bigger.

 

[Formidilosus]

I didn't read all 463 pages of this thread.

Start by admitting that you haven’t read the thread, then prove that you don’t understand what the thread is about by giving an incorrect and ignorant opinion of something you didn’t read- ok.

I have also successfully DIY hunted all of the animals listed in the OP's first post, so my opinion is based on my first hand experiences and not on internet posts. Many new and inexperienced hunters look to the internet for advice for their own hunting.

How many game animals have you killed using the 77gr TMK, 75/80/88gr ELD-M, Federal Fusion ir Speer Gold Dot 62 or 75gr, or the Hornady 73gr ELD-M?

If it is “none”- then you don’t have first hand experience about what this thread is speaking on.

Not all shots in hunting situations are perfect, and I hate to see animals being wounded and suffer after being shot, so I stand by my opinion that a .223 is lethal, but it is NOT truly well suited to a dedicated lower 48 big game rifle.

Neat.

So can I only repy if I agree with the OP's post?

No. Anyone can comment ignorantly if they want.

 

[PNWGATOR]

@buffybr, not discounting your experience as I know you’ve successfully killed a lot of animals, but I’d encourage you to take some time this winter and read the entire thread.

The correct bullet delivering an optimal wound channel with the desired depth of penetration put in the right spot out of an optimized delivery system achieving the highest hit rate possible is all I desire. Precisely why this thread was created.

 

[Mish-pop]

I didn't read all 463 pages of this thread.

On page 1, the OP wrote "Based on my sample of one, the 77 TMK out of a .223 is truly a lethal combination well suited to a dedicated lower 48 big game rifle."

I saw further posts showing pictures of animals killed with .223s.

Yes, if all things are perfect, a .223 will kill any of the animals that he listed.

I've had friends that used their .22-250 or .220 Swift to kill a black bear every year, multiple elk, 3 mountain goats that I knew of, and at least 4 buffalo. They were all excellent shooters, and they only talked about the animals that they had killed, they never said much about the ones that they wounded and got away.

My Eskimo guide on my Musk ox hunt told me he killed a polar bear with his .223. When I asked him how many shots it took, he just smiled.

I have 2 rifles chambered in .223, and another in .22-250 that I used to make one shot kills on at least 4 deer and pronghorn antelope. I have also killed around a dozen deer with a .22 LR (and not wounded or lost any), but I don't recommend it as a deer cartridge either.

I have also successfully DIY hunted all of the animals listed in the OP's first post, so my opinion is based on my first hand experiences and not on internet posts. Many new and inexperienced hunters look to the internet for advice for their own hunting.

Not all shots in hunting situations are perfect, and I hate to see animals being wounded and suffer after being shot, so I stand by my opinion that a .223 is lethal, but it is NOT truly well suited to a dedicated lower 48 big game rifle.


So can I only repy if I agree with the OP's post?

For the situation with young kids I would say that starting them out with a .223 would be a great way to get them into hunting. With their ages and distances deer were shot at I would say there probably isn't a better suited gun.