.223 for bear, mountain goat, deer, elk, and moose.

[Pharmseller]

Don’t hammer him overmuch, he’s polite.




P

 

[mt terry d]

My opinion may be conventional but it is based on 30+ years of hunting experience. The dead deer “evidence” photos are certainly interesting. Any bullet can kill with a good shot but IMO using a small caliber un-bonded cup core target bullet for hunting big game is not ideal. Sierra recommends against it. My point is not “can” you use it but “should”.

I think the whole point of the thread, and the evidence backs it up, is that not only can this combo kill with good shots but that most hunters probably should use the 223/77 TMK over other/larger calibers for North American big game animals. Ive about 60 years hunting experience and shooting this combo for only a short time has proven more lethal and ethical for me than using larger calibers.

Evidence to the contrary is more than welcome but yet to be provided.

 

[Leinad]

I have a couple smiths that don’t care because they understand how/what will stop the suppressor moving. But, as you said most won’t. And on a 223, I would absolutely do a 1/2-28 to 5/8-24 adapter. It’s simple and easy.

While I’m not saying that someone should, or should not do it- you in fact can get 5/8-24 on a T3 lite barrel-

6.5cm cut to 20”, and threaded 5/8-24-
View attachment 734560

View attachment 734561


View attachment 734562


That rifle has somewhere above 4,500 rounds on that barrel in that configuration. I have had others threaded 5/8-24, and have shot a lot of them like that. These days I mostly have them threaded 9/16-24 with an adapter.

What is your preferred method for keeping your suppressors from moving/loosening? I run direct thread and am reflexively checking for tightness after having my can loosen up a few times. I see something on the threads there.....something that will withstand the heat? Thanks!

 

[Formidilosus]

What is your preferred method for keeping your suppressors from moving/loosening? I run direct thread and am reflexively checking for tightness after having my can loosen up a few times. I see something on the threads there.....something that will withstand the heat? Thanks!

Screw them on tight, and shoot a lot. Carbon is a great thread-lock.

 

[Fartrell Cluggins]

Actually I did follow the thread. I am surprised as to some of the oddly defensive reactions from the 77grain 5.56 crowd when offered other points of view. I have seen lighter caliber shots big game animals go poorly resulting in loss or a drawn out track. Certainly use the legal caliber of your choice. It’s your hunt not mine.

While we are sharing anecdotes, I'll add this. I have been involved in far more protracted searches because of poorly placed shots than ineffective tissue damage from a smaller bore rifle. In all cases the poorly placed shots came from heavier recoiling rounds.

The cool thing about this thread is that it takes readers past the anecdotal.

 

[DJL2]

My opinion may be conventional but it is based on 30+ years of hunting experience. The dead deer “evidence” photos are certainly interesting. Any bullet can kill with a good shot but IMO using a small caliber un-bonded cup core target bullet for hunting big game is not ideal. Sierra recommends against it. My point is not “can” you use it but “should”. I certainly don’t require to anyone to agree with me.

The "...but Sierra says..." thing has been beat to death. I'm not a .223 hunter, but you can bet that if an "un-bonded cup and core target bullet" is an option, it's what I'm using. I'd add "tipped" to that list - goes a long way towards alleviating the issue with a small cavity/meplat and a jacket potentially drawn thicker at the tip/nose. A fully or partially frangible "match" bullet is what I want. They simply cannot be beat for emphatic terminal performance across a broad range of impact velocities AND contribute to actually making the shot in the first place (less wind drift).

 

[dombo3]

My first post here. Apologies if misplaced ...
Read some of the many pages on this thread and listened to the experience project podcasts with @Formidilosus.

...had been going down the bigger is better path.

I'm now looking to embark on a project to acquire a 5-600yard, low recoil, lightweight deer hunting rifle. Had the .223 in my sights until the 22 creedmoor reared its head with the 88 eldm.

Pros/cons?

Currently shooting Tikka's - 6.5x55 and 6.5 PRC.

 

[atmat]

My first post here. Apologies if misplaced ...
Read some of the many pages on this thread and listened to the experience project podcasts with @Formidilosus.

...had been going down the bigger is better path.

I'm now looking to embark on a project to acquire a 5-600yard, low recoil, lightweight deer hunting rifle. Had the .223 in my sights until the 22 creedmoor reared its head with the 88 eldm.

Pros/cons?

Currently shooting Tikka's - 6.5x55 and 6.5 PRC.

Either of your current rifles are fine.

But you don’t even need a 22cm, the 223 is plenty and super cheap component wise.

 

[WIDrake]

From my understanding, which is limited, the 22 creedmoor should do that.

My first post here. Apologies if misplaced ...
Read some of the many pages on this thread and listened to the experience project podcasts with @Formidilosus.

...had been going down the bigger is better path.

I'm now looking to embark on a project to acquire a 5-600yard, low recoil, lightweight deer hunting rifle. Had the .223 in my sights until the 22 creedmoor reared its head with the 88 eldm.

Pros/cons?

Currently shooting Tikka's - 6.5x55 and 6.5 PRC.

But we need to be honest with our selves on the ranges we can shoot and make ethical hits. I do a lot of shooting out to 600 yards shooting PRS, a few further, and I don't have the skill to shoot an animal that far. A 12-16" steel circle, yep I can do that! A deer or elk, not a chance because I can't keep the group size to half of the vital area.

If you can do the practice and confidently make the shots, then the 22 creed is probably the one you want. Other options could be 223AI or 22arc depending on velocity you get and making sure to keep impact velocities above 1800fps.

 

[dombo3]

From my understanding, which is limited, the 22 creedmoor should do that.



But we need to be honest with our selves on the ranges we can shoot and make ethical hits. I do a lot of shooting out to 600 yards shooting PRS, a few further, and I don't have the skill to shoot an animal that far. A 12-16" steel circle, yep I can do that! A deer or elk, not a chance because I can't keep the group size to half of the vital area.

If you can do the practice and confidently make the shots, then the 22 creed is probably the one you want. Other options could be 223AI or 22arc depending on velocity you get and making sure to keep impact velocities above 1800fps.

I hear you. My longest shots to date are around 450 yards, prone, steady rest, no wind.

 

[199p]

I hear you. My longest shots to date are around 450 yards, prone, steady rest, no wind.

88 kick ass man, the 22x47lap is really good as well,
Terminator products in Nelson has both reamers. Mine is build on a t3

 

[mt terry d]

I hear you. My longest shots to date are around 450 yards, prone, steady rest, no wind.

Not trying to talk you out of the 22 Creed ; more guns is always better, can I gat an AMEN! brothers ?
Just saying I don't believe anyone is under-gunned with the 223/77TMK for elk further than that.
1 1/2" group at 100 = 9" at 600. Prone, steady, no wind. That'll fit in the vitals of a deer.

Yeah, I hear those in the cheap seats. Maybe I should change my name to
223/77TMK Fanboi.
Man, I'm so loving this combo.

 

[Big_wals]

My first post here. Apologies if misplaced ...
Read some of the many pages on this thread and listened to the experience project podcasts with @Formidilosus.

...had been going down the bigger is better path.

I'm now looking to embark on a project to acquire a 5-600yard, low recoil, lightweight deer hunting rifle. Had the .223 in my sights until the 22 creedmoor reared its head with the 88 eldm.

Pros/cons?

Currently shooting Tikka's - 6.5x55 and 6.5 PRC.

Do you reload, or shoot factory ammo? If shooting factory, I would buy a 223 just for the abundance of lower cost ammo. I think everyone needs a 223 though, so I might be a bit biased…

Either one would work great. I would never try and talk someone out of a 22 creedmoor

 

[SBR Sarge]

…more guns is always better, can I gat an AMEN! brothers ?

Amen!

 

[3one5]

I've been in and out of this thread over the years and decided I'd go ahead and create an account. I have a quick question. For those of us who are unable to hunt with .22 caliber bullets, what do you suggest? I have a 6.5 Grendel AR with 18" barrel that's light and handy compared to my 308 and 6.5 Creed AR's. This past weekend I shot the Grendel and my 5.56 AR that's built almost exactly the same and they both have about the same recoil. I was shooing 77gr BTHP out of the 5.56 and 123gr Hornady ELD-M in the Grendel.

Listening to the podcasts a page back, it sounds like the ELD-M fragments / penetrates well to about 1800 FPS which should put me out to about 500 yards. I'd be curious to hear thoughts as I'd love to try hunting with my 5.56 with 77gr TMK but it's not legal here. I'm wondering if the Grendel would be an OK alternative with the ELD-M or if I should look at loading up something with a Sierra TMK?

 

[clperry]

I've been in and out of this thread over the years and decided I'd go ahead and create an account. I have a quick question. For those of us who are unable to hunt with .22 caliber bullets, what do you suggest? I have a 6.5 Grendel AR with 18" barrel that's light and handy compared to my 308 and 6.5 Creed AR's. This past weekend I shot the Grendel and my 5.56 AR that's built almost exactly the same and they both have about the same recoil. I was shooing 77gr BTHP out of the 5.56 and 123gr Hornady ELD-M in the Grendel.

Listening to the podcasts a page back, it sounds like the ELD-M fragments / penetrates well to about 1800 FPS which should put me out to about 500 yards. I'd be curious to hear thoughts as I'd love to try hunting with my 5.56 with 77gr TMK but it's not legal here. I'm wondering if the Grendel would be an OK alternative with the ELD-M or if I should look at loading up something with a Sierra TMK?

What you have will work beautifully.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Big_wals]

I've been in and out of this thread over the years and decided I'd go ahead and create an account. I have a quick question. For those of us who are unable to hunt with .22 caliber bullets, what do you suggest? I have a 6.5 Grendel AR with 18" barrel that's light and handy compared to my 308 and 6.5 Creed AR's. This past weekend I shot the Grendel and my 5.56 AR that's built almost exactly the same and they both have about the same recoil. I was shooing 77gr BTHP out of the 5.56 and 123gr Hornady ELD-M in the Grendel.

Listening to the podcasts a page back, it sounds like the ELD-M fragments / penetrates well to about 1800 FPS which should put me out to about 500 yards. I'd be curious to hear thoughts as I'd love to try hunting with my 5.56 with 77gr TMK but it's not legal here. I'm wondering if the Grendel would be an OK alternative with the ELD-M or if I should look at loading up something with a Sierra TMK?

I have no personal experience with a grendel and that weight of eldm, but I bet it’ll kill critters just as dead as anything else.

 

[3one5]

Thanks for the quick response, I was leaning that way last year after reading Mark Larue's 6.5 Grendel Elk story but chickened out. Going into this season with more confidence.

 

[WIDrake]

I've been in and out of this thread over the years and decided I'd go ahead and create an account. I have a quick question. For those of us who are unable to hunt with .22 caliber bullets, what do you suggest? I have a 6.5 Grendel AR with 18" barrel that's light and handy compared to my 308 and 6.5 Creed AR's. This past weekend I shot the Grendel and my 5.56 AR that's built almost exactly the same and they both have about the same recoil. I was shooing 77gr BTHP out of the 5.56 and 123gr Hornady ELD-M in the Grendel.

Listening to the podcasts a page back, it sounds like the ELD-M fragments / penetrates well to about 1800 FPS which should put me out to about 500 yards. I'd be curious to hear thoughts as I'd love to try hunting with my 5.56 with 77gr TMK but it's not legal here. I'm wondering if the Grendel would be an OK alternative with the ELD-M or if I should look at loading up something with a Sierra TMK?

I was going to build a grendel until I found this thread. It would still be my go to if 223 wasn't legal here. I forget where but I found a grendel animal kill thread similar to this one that was a good resource.

 

[Big_wals]

Thanks for the quick response, I was leaning that way last year after reading Mark Larue's 6.5 Grendel Elk story but chickened out. Going into this season with more confidence.

Let us know how it goes! Don’t forget to take photos. Roksliders love a good necropsy.