Bear vitals aren’t protected by muscle, it’s thin hide, fat, and ribs unless you take a hard quarter to shot, but a broadside shot on any bear, where the lungs sit, there is hardly any muscle, if you are shooting through a lot of muscle, you shot too far forward
O thought you were the expert? I’ve cut up many deer and skinned a number of grizzlies. I’d estimate at least 3 times as much muscle on a griz than a whitetail minimum.
What does that have to do with cartridge choice? The popular combo is a big cartridge and hard bullet for max penetration
Is the point of this to try to say grizzlies are not significantly different than whitetail as far as killing them? I mean if you shot both with even a 30-06 you’d know. That’s not to say the 223 can’t do the job, it can.
I think what roosiebull is saying is that if you're heart/lung shooting a bear broadside, you're not shooting through much muscle. You're shooting through the ribcage, further back than you would a deer.
Did I say that had anything to do with cartridge selection? It has to do with the shooters ability to make aimed, accurate shots under pressure, regardless of cartridge selection. Essentially any rifle round out there with a proper bullet choice will kill a bear, and will penetrate the venerable grizzly skull, that many folks think is the equivalent to an Abrams tank. I was saying people need to change their mindset when hunting an apex predator. They're aggressive, fast, and dangerous. Don't go out with the mindset like you're hunting whitetail. Practice shooting quickly and efficiently under stress. If you never do that, and find yourself needing to do that during a hunt you are gonna be in a bad spot. Be familiar with bear anatomy, as has been said many times, you need to aim differently for bear vitals vice deer vitals.
Are you saying that’s authoritative what those two guys are saying for those few minutes? It’s clearly not in line with this thread24 minute mark.
Ron Spomer Outdoors: Bear Advice With A Master Alaskan Guide on Apple Podcasts
Show Ron Spomer Outdoors, Ep Bear Advice With A Master Alaskan Guide - Apr 16, 2024podcasts.apple.com
I’m sure Spomer is a nice guy, but what he does is distribute dogma and opinion that is rarely based on rigorous testing.24 minute mark.
Ron Spomer Outdoors: Bear Advice With A Master Alaskan Guide on Apple Podcasts
Show Ron Spomer Outdoors, Ep Bear Advice With A Master Alaskan Guide - Apr 16, 2024podcasts.apple.com
I don’t know the answer to this but I’d like to. I’m guessing 4 inches to get from hide to inside of the chest cavity broadside. Not through the shoulder, which would be more, but apparently not enough more to matter to hornady black 62s.
Nope, no appeal to authority at all. I’m a 223 lover stirring the pot for entertainment purposes.
Yeah, I listened to that one last week. Phil is the guy who killed a coastal brownie with a compact 9mm. If I remember right, he was talking about how Alaskans kill bears and moose all the time with 223s and FMJs. I think he went on to say he didn’t recommend that and his top recommendation for rifles to bring to AK was a 30/06 or whatever you use at home and shoot a lot. My point about Ron is just that he spends so much time talking about kinetic energy in every darned video and about the 1000/1500 foot pound rule. That said Ron has also talked about taking deer with a 22-250 AI with big bullets, so he isn’t all bad.
I was waiting for this.
Coastal Alaskan Brown bear. 223 2 shots
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