22 Creedmoor for Scimitar Oryx?

[Reburn]

View attachment 752360View attachment 752362View attachment 752363View attachment 752364View attachment 752365View attachment 752366I wish formidilosus could get off his ego trip , but this seems very unlikely!
A heavy for caliber frangible .223 may be ok ( ?) for NA anatomy game @ marginal range shots , African & Asian game has a complete different anatomy ( aoudad are a African imported invasive specie sheep )
With the heart and lungs protected by heavy bone and more forward in the body ( nilgai heavy bone and 1+ inch thick dermal shield) & muscle, I believe his principle of using frangable / soft unbonded bullets have merited application in a heavier caliber to explode Both metal and bone fragments though the vitals of an African game animal @. 200 +/- meters
Example a unbonded 180gr 7mm has has laid out millions of food staple game since the late 19th century, 257weatherby in 20th century as a hot explosive PG caliber
A small caliber argument has merit in a culling operation where head and neck shots are taken. But shooting a African or Asian animal like a deer or elk will result in a gut shot
Kevin Robertson wrote a book for traveling sportsmen on African game
The Perfect Shot with diagrams and text on caliber choice and shot selection
For both trophy and meat hunting here are some photographic examples from the book

I know a dozen South Africans using 6mm creeds sith 108 eld-m on all plains game short of the ones that they are LEGALLY required to use something else.

The aim points on the shoulder on mule deer vs Kudu look pretty similar to me. Straight up the front leg on either in the bottom half works great. Notice if your bullet goes though the shoulder blade the shot was too high. All you have to do is stay on the shoulder and not in the crease for African game.

 

[sturner88]

View attachment 752360View attachment 752362View attachment 752363View attachment 752364View attachment 752365View attachment 752366I wish formidilosus could get off his ego trip , but this seems very unlikely!
A heavy for caliber frangible .223 may be ok ( ?) for NA anatomy game @ marginal range shots , African & Asian game has a complete different anatomy ( aoudad are a African imported invasive specie sheep )
With the heart and lungs protected by heavy bone and more forward in the body ( nilgai heavy bone and 1+ inch thick dermal shield) & muscle, I believe his principle of using frangable / soft unbonded bullets have merited application in a heavier caliber to explode Both metal and bone fragments though the vitals of an African game animal @. 200 +/- meters
Example a unbonded 180gr 7mm has has laid out millions of food staple game since the late 19th century, 257weatherby in 20th century as a hot explosive PG caliber
A small caliber argument has merit in a culling operation where head and neck shots are taken. But shooting a African or Asian animal like a deer or elk will result in a gut shot
Kevin Robertson wrote a book for traveling sportsmen on African game
The Perfect Shot with diagrams and text on caliber choice and shot selection
For both trophy and meat hunting here are some photographic examples from the book

idk man.. I just dispatched a few african game in short order with a frangible .224 bullet, an OG just told us he’s killed 20 oryx this year with small bullets and in the past week i’ve had to call in dogs twice for oryx shot with a 28 nosler and 300 win.

 

[omicron1792]

Ya know I didn’t realize how common this was in the Alaskan bush. I called my companies dealer in Anchorage to talk about my moose hunt in two and half weeks as I’m going DIY and solo.

I talked to two lifelong Alaskans on speaker phone, one of whom is married to a native; and her family has hunted for generations. We chatted for about 30 min of work stuff and ended up talking for over a hour on general moose stuff, the possibility of bears, how they hunt these days, etc.

Basically everyone in their immediate circles (30-40 hunters every year) hunts moose and grizzlies with ARs shooting 223s. They mentioned they would never go back to lever action and bolt action .30 cals of any kind. Very eye opening conversation for me.

Same for Africans too. Most poachers or locals use 223 or similar. How I would guess 99% of all African game has ever been taken.

I used 308 165 fusions and everything dropped like a rock. I wouldn’t hesitate to use smaller good projectiles on my next trip.

 

[omicron1792]

I know a dozen South Africans using 6mm creeds sith 108 eld-m on all plains game short of the ones that they are LEGALLY required to use something else.

The aim points on the shoulder on mule deer vs Kudu look pretty similar to me. Straight up the front leg on either in the bottom half works great. Notice if your bullet goes though the shoulder blade the shot was too high. All you have to do is stay on the shoulder and not in the crease for African game.

View attachment 752414
View attachment 752416

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The double lung shot is more hidden on African game. Your picture shows that

 

[mxgsfmdpx]

African & Asian game has a complete different anatomy But shooting a African or Asian animal like a deer or elk will result in a gut shot

This is one of the most laughable things I’ve seen posted on Rokslide in quite a while. “Completely different” actually translating to, barely any different at all. A gut shot with your preferred 7mm or .30 Cal is still a gut shot buddy, you think a “gut shot” with well constructed .224 bullet is somehow “worse”.

Silliness, Sadness, Sucky Advice -S3 Ranch

 

[JGRaider]

The double lung shot is more hidden on African game. Your picture shows that

And the heart of African game is a little lower and a little more forward than NA game.

 

[Reburn]

The double lung shot is more hidden on African game. Your picture shows that

And the heart of African game is a little lower and a little more forward than NA game.

Are we looking at the same pictures?

 

[omicron1792]

Are we looking at the same pictures?

I’m on your side with bullet selection.

And

Their vitals are more forward and tucked in under bone. I have actually processed (helped) the animals and seen it with my own eyes. Just is.

If you aim where you would on NA animals behind the shoulder, and miss a little posterior, you might never recover the animal.

 

[Reburn]

The aim points on the shoulder on mule deer vs Kudu look pretty similar to me. Straight up the front leg on either in the bottom half works great. Notice if your bullet goes though the shoulder blade the shot was too high. All you have to do is stay on the shoulder and not in the crease for African game.

Their vitals are more forward and tucked in under bone. I have actually processed (helped) the animals and seen it with my own eyes. Just is.

If you aim where you would on NA animals behind the shoulder, and miss a little posterior, you might never recover the animal.

But thats exactly what I wrote. To stay on the shoulder and out of the crease.

 

[omicron1792]

But thats exactly what I wrote. To stay on the shoulder and out of the crease.

Sorry. Missed that. Yes.

Why the “word” is to use “tougher” bullets and not frangible ones. But I think that’s fuddy

 

[Reburn]

Sorry. Missed that. Yes.

Why the “word” is to use “tougher” bullets and not frangible ones. But I think that’s fuddy

Yea that was s3 that said that about needing tougher bullets and I quoted his post.

All the guys I speak with in South Africa use smaller caliber ELD-M. They only use bonded bullets on big 5 stuff.

 

[omicron1792]

Yea that was s3 that said that about needing tougher bullets and I quoted his post.

All the guys I speak with in South Africa use smaller caliber ELD-M. They only use bonded bullets on big 5 stuff.

I think the younger folks are moving that way.

Your experience though is the minority not the rule. You should see the fudd on the Africa sites. Ha

 

[JGRaider]

Are we looking at the same pictures?

Your pics are irelevent to reality.

 

[wind gypsy]

Your pics are irelevent to reality.View attachment 752602

So the heart isn’t basically straight up the front leg just above the bone as is shown in nearly every picture illustrating where African game animal vitals are? Just like on NA ungulates?

I get it, lungs don’t go as far back.

 

[JGRaider]

So the heart isn’t basically straight up the front leg just above the bone as is shown in nearly every picture illustrating where African game animal vitals are?

If your intent is to argue that African game and NA game's heart is in the exact same place, then you're 100% mistaken, which is what I said in the first place in post #107.

 

[Reburn]

If your intent is to argue that African game and NA game's heart is in the exact same place, then you're 100% mistaken, which is what I said in the first place.

Thank you for coming late in the conversation and telling us everything was wrong and you are right. Glad you abandoned your bridge and showed up. This topic was getting boring without you.

 

[wind gypsy]

If your intent is to argue that African game and NA game's heart is in the exact same place, then you're 100% mistaken, which is what I said in the first place.

I’m not arguing anything. It’s just that there was a bunch of photos shown to educate us how the vitals are in different spots but the heart appears to be straight up the front leg on all but one. If they are wrong, we should let @S-3 ranch know his pictures are erroneous.

 

[TxxAgg]

Some of yall should go read Post #96 a few more times.

 

[mxgsfmdpx]

@S-3 ranch @JGRaider

Post in thread '22 Creedmoor for Scimitar Oryx?'
https://rokslide.com/forums/threads/22-creedmoor-for-scimitar-oryx.368870/post-3763426

 

[Billy Goat]

Your pics are irelevent to reality.View attachment 752602

Do those percentage points somehow pertain to how they kill?