2022 Oregon Archery Elk Proposal

[Flyjunky]

there are plenty of draw units and states if that's the experience you are after, if you don't like otc crowds, find a place that isn't crowded or don't participate, it's pretty straightforward. i think some are just disgruntled who don't do well here.... need something to blame.... any otc elk areas are going to have areas of over crowding and time periods of over crowding... many draw units are the same. it has become more popular, it will never be like it was 30yrs ago (but it's not because of lack of elk numbers) there are just more people out there.

Look at your last sentence above...."there are just more people"....ah, yeah, that's the point.

 

[Flyjunky]

I think alot of guys get to Wenaha after 20 years and don't know how to hunt Elk either. Idk the success rate but doubt its 100%

I've hunted draw units. And there not that much better imo

There is no such thing as a unit that is 100% success.

I've been lucky enough to hunt a few different draw units, and yes, they are better most of the time.

Once again I'll ask you, if they are not better then why do so many people put in for the top 3 NE units? Which would you rather hunt, a general unit or draw, if you had the option?

 

[Flyjunky]

I totally agree man. I’ve sent lots of feedback regarding this. Western Oregon archery hunting will be worse than it’s become the past few years. I swear hunter numbers have doubled.


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You think the hunter numbers have doubled. @roosiebull says "there are just more people out there", and yet you wonder why they are thinking about going draw? C'mon, seriously?

So, to help with numbers of animals and quality of the hunt, we should just keep things where they are even though numbers of hunters are increasing? OBH, I realize you are most likely talking about Western Oregon but with the amount of people moving into this state do you really think the numbers of hunters are going to go down? Even if the total amount of hunters is not increasing, the places to hunt and access to land is getting worse. This creates more competition because people are crowded into more confined areas. We see this all the time fishing. There used to be fish in catchable numbers in many different systems but with the fish numbers declining all the fisherman are congregating to the fewer places that have fish....same principle.

I'm lucky enough to work in the outdoor industry (fishing side) and I honestly can't tell you the number of brand new people who are looking at getting into fishing and some even talk of hunting. Most of these people are brand new to our state. Our shop has been in business for 27 years and we haven't seen numbers like this EVER.

 

[BRTreedogs]

Which would you rather hunt, a general unit or draw, if you had the option?

Imo this is a scewd question, they are not the same thing.
Yes a draw unit is or can be slightly better.
But will I get a tag every year?
Yes I would rather hunt every year in a crappy draw unit vs wait 3 years.

Every one keeps saying ohh you'll draw every other year. Well thats a guess. And if hunt numbers keep increasing point creep will go up.
Make us pick a unit sure.
1st come sure.
A draw no way, this is just a path to hopelessness and never getting to go imo

Sure I can cycle through some other states.
But honestly if I can't get an elk tag somewhere every year I'll quit hunting. I spend tons of time and money on it and I won't, if I can't go

 

[BRTreedogs]

All I really see with my own 2 eyes is way more elk then people when I actually get out of the truck.
Which leads me to believe that everyone complaining about crowding road hunts and expects to hear bugles from the front seat of the truck.

 

[roosiebull]

Look at your last sentence above...."there are just more people"....ah, yeah, that's the point.

there is still a lot of good hunting, a lot of places that aren't overcrowded, we also have good elk numbers.... could certainly be better, but going to draw won't change that.... you want something that isn't realistic.... how mad are you going to be when you get your way (for no actual biological reason) and everything goes draw, and it looks exactly the same? what will your next silver bullet be?

let's say everything goes draw, but it wasn't because of elk numbers, it was pressure on odfw from the hunters.... since in most areas, elk numbers aren't the factor, why would they limit tag numbers a whole bunch? they wouldn't. i do think everything will eventually be a draw, but i certainly don't think it will look or feel like it in Sept.

people want their cake and eat it too.... if tag numbers are limited to the point that it changes the "quality" then you won't be hunting very much. what we do have in Oregon is a lot of good habitat we can't hunt and the elk stay unpressured relatively.

yeah, it can be frustrating seeing dudes everywhere, if you are just hell bent on going to some spot, it may be crowded..... all over the state there are places to get away from that..... i don't ever have a problem getting away from people, and i live in a area that gets beat up for elk..... might take a little extra effort, but it's doable

 

[Oregon Bow Hiker]

You think the hunter numbers have doubled. @roosiebull says "there are just more people out there", and yet you wonder why they are thinking about going draw? C'mon, seriously?

So, to help with numbers of animals and quality of the hunt, we should just keep things where they are even though numbers of hunters are increasing? OBH, I realize you are most likely talking about Western Oregon but with the amount of people moving into this state do you really think the numbers of hunters are going to go down? Even if the total amount of hunters is not increasing, the places to hunt and access to land is getting worse. This creates more competition because people are crowded into more confined areas. We see this all the time fishing. There used to be fish in catchable numbers in many different systems but with the fish numbers declining all the fisherman are congregating to the fewer places that have fish....same principle.

I'm lucky enough to work in the outdoor industry (fishing side) and I honestly can't tell you the number of brand new people who are looking at getting into fishing and some even talk of hunting. Most of these people are brand new to our state. Our shop has been in business for 27 years and we haven't seen numbers like this EVER.

I am just saying the effects this may/will cause on western Oregon archery elk isn’t even mentioned in these proposals and I believe it should be...


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[PNW bow hunter]

ODFW states they are wanting to go to the draw because of low bull to cow ratios in almost half of these units, or people will be pushed to a neighboring unit causing a decline e there.


Look at the huge drop in bull to cow ratios in many units. The populations have remained stable, while the number of bulls has dropped by nearly 50 percent.

THERE WERE HALF AS MANY BULLS IN 2019 AS THERE WERE IN 2015.

 

[BRTreedogs]

ODFW states they are wanting to go to the draw because of low bull to cow ratios in almost half of these units, or people will be pushed to a neighboring unit causing a decline e there.
View attachment 274983

Look at the huge drop in bull to cow ratios in many units. The populations have remained stable, while the number of bulls has dropped by nearly 50 percent.

THERE WERE HALF AS MANY BULLS IN 2019 AS THERE WERE IN 2015.

Wolves target bigger bulls that stay in steep drainages in deep snow and can get away when they are found.
Yeah let's give um what they wanted all along when they introduced wolves illuminate hunting from humans.

 

[PNW bow hunter]

I am a bow hunter, and hunt in one of the new proposed controlled units. I don’t want to lose opportunity to hunt there, but if the bull populations are hurting this bad I don’t see any other option than limiting tags. Rifle tags are already controlled, archery is over the counter. They have no way to control bull harvest in archery season.

Look at Desolation. There were 130 bulls in the unit winter count for 2015. It has decreased to just 66 bulls in 2019! These counts are taken in the winter after all hunting seasons.

Bow hunters killed 104 bulls and 66 cows in 2019 in Desolation

I don’t disagree about wolves killing the bulls. I think all of the units that the bull numbers are way down in are in the high wolf areas.

ODFW had ZERO control over wolf bull harvest. The only thing they can manage is us.

The trend in some of these units is very concerning.

If the ODFW statistics are at all accurate, they have to control the numbers of bulls being killed ASAP.

 

[PNW bow hunter]

ODFW claims there are 1100 elk total in that unit. In 2019 1562 bow hunters hunted that unit.

 

[541hunter]

I am a bow hunter, and hunt in one of the new proposed controlled units. I don’t want to lose opportunity to hunt there, but if the bull populations are hurting this bad I don’t see any other option than limiting tags. Rifle tags are already controlled, archery is over the counter. They have no way to control bull harvest in archery season.

Look at Desolation. There were 130 bulls in the unit winter count for 2015. It has decreased to just 66 bulls in 2019! These counts are taken in the winter after all hunting seasons.

Bow hunters killed 104 bulls and 66 cows in 2019 in Desolation

I don’t disagree about wolves killing the bulls. I think all of the units that the bull numbers are way down in are in the high wolf areas.

ODFW had ZERO control over wolf bull harvest. The only thing they can manage is us.

The trend in some of these units is very concerning.

If the ODFW statistics are at all accurate, they have to control the numbers of bulls being killed ASAP.

Since ODFW does winter time surveys, I would think you can’t base the survey numbers on how many elk are actually there during September due to migration.

 

[BRTreedogs]

Just shut the units down completely for 3 years.
Then open it back up.
At least then there is light at the end of the tunnel.

 

[PNW bow hunter]

Look at the trends in bull/cow ratios over the 2015 to 2019 time periods.

Also the success rates have trended down significantly in the same units the bull ratios are down over that same time period

Maybe some of the elk move to different units to winter, but the trend is down in several of the ones they want to control.

In desolation there are only 16 calves per 100 cows. That means only around 170 new elk being born in the unit.

What else can they do beside cut tag numbers across all weapon types to try to get the herds back to health?

 

[PNW bow hunter]

Most of the units under the last proposal were going to have tag numbers set at, or very close to the amount of people that hunted the unit the previous year. It’s not going to be a huge reduction in tag numbers.

So most would probably still draw every year, by yes there will be changes.

I like the current tag system, but if there’s almost no bulls left 5 years from now, who cares if it’s unlimited over the counter on the east side.

 

[BRTreedogs]

Most of the units under the last proposal were going to have tag numbers set at, or very close to the amount of people that hunted the unit the previous year. It’s not going to be a huge reduction in tag numbers.

So most would probably still draw every year, by yes there will be changes.

I like the current tag system, but if there’s almost no bulls left 5 years from now, who cares if it’s unlimited over the counter on the east side.

They may get it if they select it as 1st choice.
But the amount of people I think will do that is about 1%

Unless they get the wolf plan to a point that allows harvest there won't be any bulls anyway even with zero tags.

 

[Extrapale]

They may get it if they select it as 1st choice.
But the amount of people I think will do that is about 1%

Unless they get the wolf plan to a point that allows harvest there won't be any bulls anyway even with zero tags.

Put it 1st choice if you actually want to hunt. Isnt that what you have been asking for is a tag every year? Just put it 1st choice and go hunting.

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[BRTreedogs]

Put it 1st choice if you actually want to hunt. Isnt that what you have been asking for is a tag every year? Just put it 1st choice and go hunting.

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And then what after it point creeps? Cause it will.

 

[wapitibob]

go hunt one of the otc general units

 

[Smokeslider]

I don’t see how it won’t affect the over crowding issues that already are here on the west side.

My guess is that most (80%?) of east side residents that hunt elk currently on the east side aren’t going to the west side to make up for it under the proposed regulation changes.