1911’s in general, 9mm versions specifically

[zdc1775]

I disliked the grips on the Girsan greatly. Went to put some grit grips on and-

View attachment 884697


I had no idea that the magwell wasn’t attached to the mainspring. But that meant that the grips had to be relieved inside to fit the hooks from the magwell. So, plan b.


The factory grips were too wide, beveled/shaped wrong, and the texture sucks.

First the width-
View attachment 884698


Width fixed-
View attachment 884700


Then honeycomb removed and reshaped-
View attachment 884701


Much better.


A bit of Rustoleum Multicokor texture as glue-View attachment 884702


For the silica carbide-
View attachment 884703



This is the way-
View attachment 884704

View attachment 884706

When you say the grips are too wide, are you saying they are too wide front to back or that they are too thick and make the grip too wide when installed?

If the latter, I think I've seen that on basically every import 1911 I have ever held, but luckily easily fixed. If the former I don't think I have seen that before.

Also I can't remember seeing a magwell that installed over the grip bushings like that since I first started USPSA 20 years ago. Definitely makes swapping grips a pain in the ass.

 

[Formidilosus]

When you say the grips are too wide, are you saying they are too wide front to back or that they are too thick and make the grip too wide when installed?

If the latter, I think I've seen that on basically every import 1911 I have ever held, but luckily easily fixed. If the former I don't think I have seen that before.

Too wide front to back. You can see how much wider they are than standard grips in the second picture. I think it is due to them trying to hide that the front strap isn’t beveled/rounded.

Look at the edge of the front strap- you can see how square it is compared to a normal front strap on the Springfield-



Girsan-



Professional-

Also I can't remember seeing a magwell that installed over the grip bushings like that since I first started USPSA 20 years ago. Definitely makes swapping grips a pain in the ass.

I’ve seen versions of it, but none done as well. The grip thing is annoying
though.

 

[Formidilosus]

Swapped the long trigger for a short one I had. Paid $41 for a last year.

The difference between a long and short trigger-





Sharpied-



Just a bit of contact-



A few swipes with a file and it fit well.


This however was a bit much-



Bent that back to normal and reassembled. The hammer and sear pins were way tight so a cleaned them up with some sandpaper.


Much better-




With Hornday Critical Duty 135gr +P, POI is the tip of the front sight rather than the dot as it is with the 124hr FMJ.




Trigger is still way too heavy, but the short trigger does make shooting easier. It needs new sights and trigger work. The groups aren’t great, and a new bushing might help.

Future work:

1). Sights
2). Roll Trigger kit
3). GI plug and short guide rod
4). Wilson BP Extractor

Maybe a new fitted barrel bushing.

 

[rabbithuntr]

This is interesting, I’m looking forward to more of this. Between this and the 22 mag Kel tek it does make me wonder if a 22tcm 1911 is a good idea? Is it just because of RIA

 

[zdc1775]

Too wide front to back. You can see how much wider they are than standard grips in the second picture. I think it is due to them trying to hide that the front strap isn’t beveled/rounded.

Look at the edge of the front strap- you can see how square it is compared to a normal front strap on the Springfield-
View attachment 884948


Girsan-
View attachment 884949


Professional-
View attachment 884957





I’ve seen versions of it, but none done as well. The grip thing is annoying
though.

Wow, the close up really made the square-ness of the frame stand out. It looks about like the unfinished Caspian frame I bought for my first 1911 build, but that one was supposed to me like that so I could profile and checker it.

I know the point is to "test" a cheap 1911, but, if it is a forged frame like the Tisas, I would be really tempted to reprofile that grip, undercut the trigger guard, and add some aggressive checkering to the front strap. But if I did that, I would probably upgrade everything else and basically end up building a 2k dollar pistol that would really only be worth a few hundred at best.

 

[WMelbgator]

@Formidilosus, just now seeing this post. So many questions, but first one should be what price point to you want to start at? I went with a Chambers Custom from Joe Chambers. Hell of a gun! Took over a year to get it but, haven't had any issues with it. Yes, it's very pricey, but it works and if anything happens, you can call him up and it will get fixed.

 

[Formidilosus]

I know the point is to "test" a cheap 1911, but, if it is a forged frame like the Tisas, I would be really tempted to reprofile that grip, undercut the trigger guard, and add some aggressive checkering to the front strap. But if I did that, I would probably upgrade everything else and basically end up building a 2k dollar pistol that would really only be worth a few hundred at best.

“Worth” is relative. If the goal is to make it maximized for shooting, what’s it’s worth to sell isn’t a factor. While I agree on the frame- I don’t like it, I don’t think I will do any frame modifications to this one, but it isn’t because of cost. I wouldn’t hesitate to modify a Tisas.

I think a new trigger, sights, extractor, GI Plug setup, and maybe a new bushing for this one will be it. Should end up at sub $1,000 and be perfectly shootable.

 

[Formidilosus]

@Formidilosus, just now seeing this post. So many questions, but first one should be what price point to you want to start at?

Not sure what you are asking here?

I went with a Chambers Custom from Joe Chambers. Hell of a gun! Took over a year to get it but, haven't had any issues with it. Yes, it's very pricey, but it works and if anything happens, you can call him up and it will get fixed.

He certainly builds good pistols.

 

[mills0713]

Great thread! Interested in getting into the 1911 game.

What is the general consensus regarding 9mm in government vs commander. If well-made, is there a difference in reliability? Is the shootability of the government worth the extra length even if you’re going to carry? Any thoughts?

 

[Formidilosus]

Great thread! Interested in getting into the 1911 game.

What is the general consensus regarding 9mm in government vs commander. If well-made, is there a difference in reliability? Is the shootability of the government worth the extra length even if you’re going to carry? Any thoughts?

Well done commanders are very reliable. The shootability difference isn’t going to be noticed by most.

 

[zdc1775]

“Worth” is relative. If the goal is to make it maximized for shooting, what’s it’s worth to sell isn’t a factor. While I agree on the frame- I don’t like it, I don’t think I will do any frame modifications to this one, but it isn’t because of cost. I wouldn’t hesitate to modify a Tisas.

I think a new trigger, sights, extractor, GI Plug setup, and maybe a new bushing for this one will be it. Should end up at sub $1,000 and be perfectly shootable.

Completely agree that what a gun is "worth" is completely irrelevant if you are making the gun shoot best for you, but the gun being perfect that doesn't change it's market value. That's all I was saying.

Hell, the 1911 that I used to make master in IDPA ECP *edit I meant CDP* started life as an ATI GI that I bought used for $200. Over the course of its life, I quite literally replaced every part except the actual frame itself. In the end I had probably dropped well over 3k in various parts into it and the only reason I don't still have it is that the frame cracked at the slide stop hole after somewhere in the neighborhood of 125k rounds and one of the guys I was competing with wanted the frame to try welding and repairing it so I stripped everything and gave it to him to practice with. Most of the other parts where stuck in an old Springfield frame and are still being shot by my little brother.

That being said, I'm happy to follow along on this thread and maybe it'll even get me to buy another budget 1911 to turn into a full custom one part at a time.

 

[Formidilosus]

Completely agree that what a gun is "worth" is completely irrelevant if you are making the gun shoot best for you, but the gun being perfect that doesn't change it's market value. That's all I was saying.

Hell, the 1911 that I used to make master in IDPA ECP started life as an ATI GI that I bought used for $200. Over the course of its life, I quite literally replaced every part except the actual frame itself. In the end I had probably dropped well over 3k in various parts into it and the only reason I don't still have it is that the frame cracked at the slide stop hole after somewhere in the neighborhood of 125k rounds and one of the guys I was competing with wanted the frame to try welding and repairing it so I stripped everything and gave it to him to practice with. Most of the other parts where stuck in an old Springfield frame and are still being shot by my little brother.

That being said, I'm happy to follow along on this thread and maybe it'll even get me to buy another budget 1911 to turn into a full custom one part at a time.

Ha! I did the same except in CDP with a Llama. Actually one of the most reliable pistols I’ve ever used.

 

[zdc1775]

Great thread! Interested in getting into the 1911 game.

What is the general consensus regarding 9mm in government vs commander. If well-made, is there a difference in reliability? Is the shootability of the government worth the extra length even if you’re going to carry? Any thoughts?

I don't have as much experience with 9mm 1911's as I do with 45 ACP models, but since all of my non collector handguns are working handguns I personally prefer the commander size models over government size due to the shorter barrel/slide making them easier to carry.

As far as reliability, government models might have a very slight edge but that's really only because they are almost all oversprung from the factory and the mass of the slide can help overcome some other issues like bad magazines, extractor/ejector tuning, and bad feed ramps. Most manufacturers due the same with commanders as well but they will occasionally show those other issues before a government model.

As far as shooting them, a person would need to have significant time behind several different 1911's before they would ever notice the difference in my opinion. If assembled to the same standards, both of them will shoot roughly the same size groups from a rest. Though the government will likely give a shooter slightly smaller groups due to the increased sight radius, but it's doubtful that would even be noticeable.

 

[zdc1775]

Ha! I did the same except in CDP with a Llama. Actually one of the most reliable pistols I’ve ever used.

Yeah that was supposed to be CDP but for some reason I was thinking of ESP where I was using a CZ 75 and combined the classes somehow.

Edit: That ATI eventually became my most reliable handgun too, thoughthe first 1,000 or so rounds were a bit rough until I figured out a frame/feed ramp misalignment issue. After that, it beat out any of the Glocks I've owned in that regard.

 

[RockAndSage]

Agree with what was said above on reliability, shootability, sight radius, etc. Would only add that commanders are a bit more convenient for concealed carry.

 

[4th_point]

However, the last few years has seen that change it seems. In the last couple of years I am aware of 5-6 Turkish 1911’s- specifically Tisas that have worked very well for relatively serious shooters with several thousand rounds a piece on the guns. Of those 5-6, only one needed an extractor adjustment out of the box to work. That they are all 9mm is way more surprising.

Good thread.

Were the 9mm Tisas all carbon on carbon?

Not sure if they offered anything else in 9mm, but I recall some issues with stainless 45 slides breaking.

 

[Formidilosus]

Good thread.

Were the 9mm Tisas all carbon on carbon?

Not sure if they offered anything else in 9mm, but I recall some issues with stainless 45 slides breaking.

Yes, standard blued carbon or Ceracoat.

 

[nm.otter]

Anything between $400 and $3k that would make sense to start with?

 

[Formidilosus]

This is interesting, I’m looking forward to more of this. Between this and the 22 mag Kel tek it does make me wonder if a 22tcm 1911 is a good idea? Is it just because of RIA

A well built gun in 22TCM would make an excellent field pistol.

 

[Trevor96]

A well built gun in 22TCM would make an excellent field pistol.

The fireball from a 5" barrel is really fun