your 6.5 CM/elk experience

[SouthPaw]

How did the TMK compare to the ELD-M?

They both performed well, and had the same result: an elk down within 30 yards. Keep in mind, sample size of 1 each...

The TMK was at 1900fps impact to the lungs and the ELDM was 2300fps impact to the shoulder, so wounds were different (expected) given the different scenarios: TMK held together more and penetrated deeper, ELD fragmented faster and the combo of bullet and bone fragments generated a pretty remarkable wound to the chest cavity and vitals. Both had immediate upset, which is what I've come to prefer. I'll continue to use both.

 

[SteveAndTheCrigBoys]

There's no replacement for displacement!

What proof is there that larger bullet = more displacement (assuming this means permanent tissue damage)?

The Fackler 1987 report that's referenced often includes diagrams that show how a smaller caliber/weight bullet can create more "displacement" than a larger caliber/weight bullet.

 

[IDVortex]

For magnum lovers, is there a special number you're needing to think it's a ethical caliber/kill? And if so, if you can achieve the same numbers in a lighter/smaller round, what's wrong on using a smaller caliber? Because realistically, most elk shot are what, no more than 300-400 yards tops? Or is the old saying of you can never have to much gun the thought process? Or is it due to that's what you've always used so nothing else can be good enough?

 

[S.Clancy]

I agree, I think that the movement to 6.5 or less rifle calibers for elk isn’t going away, but doesn’t mean I agree with it. I do believe that with the newer bullets, heavier bullets and faster twist calibers out now that one caliber down from below works just as well. So if you used a 30 cal regularly on elk before, I believe you would get the same performance from a 7mm now. Myself personally I wouldn’t go any smaller than a 7mm caliber on elk.
In my opinion I think the craze for going to light calibers for elk came from all the new hunters that showed up the last few years, that never shot a rifle before, and didn’t have a mentor to tell them to grow a set of balls and don’t flinch like a bitch from recoil and noise!!!
Respect the animal and learn how to toughen up, as the elk deserves a higher possibility of a quick death from a well placed bigger caliber than a 6.5 or smaller.

 

[thinhorn_AK]

Well gents, lock the thread. In the meantime, I’m gonna go buy a 300 win mag and put another round through the big 6 point I’ve got shoulder mounted in my front room that I killed with a 6.5 creed. He was a “pressured, public land” full rut bull that was full of adrenaline, so I’m pretty sure he’s probably not quite dead even though he’s been hanging up since 2020.

All joking aside, how many animals have you killed/seen killed with the 6.5 creedmoor and all its adjacent brothers/predecessors (6creed, 243, 25-06, 257 Robert’s, 260 Remington, 270 Winchester, etc.)? Animals die ONLY through 1 of 2 ways: oxygen deprivation, or central nervous system interruption. And if a guy can put a properly constructed KILLING bullet through either the heart, lungs, or the central nervous system (high shoulder/spine/head/neck) through his 6.5 creedmoor, the animal won’t know the difference. Foot pounds of energy don’t matter if you “dump all the energy” into the grass bag or into the spinous process, there’s no “margin of error” that will make up for poor shot placement. There’s not a person on this planet, again contrary to popular belief, who shoots a 300 RUM or Win or 7 rem mag or [insert magnum cartridge here] as well as they’ll shoot a lower recoiling round. A guy may shoot them well, but they’ll ALWAYS shoot less recoil better. On top of that, the vast majority of hunters don’t shoot enough to be anywhere near as proficient as they think they are every year, which further exacerbates the issue.

So, no, more gun isn’t more better. It doesn’t kill them better, it doesn’t give you “the ability to punch through the dreaded elk shoulder” any better, and it doesn’t allow you better “margin of error” for bad shots. In fact, the single worst kill I’ve ever witnessed was my dad’s moose in 2003, which soaked up 9 rounds of 165 grain partitions from his 7 mag at 250 yards. Dad was digging through his backpack looking for any more ammo after round 9 because the bull just wouldn’t drop, and about a minute after the last shot (and about 5 after the shooting commenced), the bull finally tipped over. It’s only an example of 1, but to me it shows that magnums are not the “end-all be-all” that Elmer Keith wanted everyone to believe. They’ll kill for sure, but they kill stuff the same way that any other cartridge does: by putting holes in the front half of animals.



To the OP, I’ve seen multiple elk and mule deer killed in 2 different states over several years from 25 to 500-ish yards with a 6.5 creedmoor and its adjacent brother, the 270 Winchester, all with 140-143 grain projectiles from both Hornady and Berger. Only 1 required a follow up shot, none of them traveled further than 25 yards or so, and one of the mule deer (shot at 225 yards with a 143 grain ELDX) exhibited the single most impressive exit wound I’ve every seen, a 5 inch diameter hole with daylight visible all the way through as he ran 25 yards from left to right in the snow on Colorado 3rd season in 2022 before dying. Left a blood trail so impressive that Ray Charles could’ve followed it. I would happily carry a 6.5 creedmoor for everything until the day I die, and don’t regret dumping my own 7 mag to do so.

I’ve been part of a moose hunt where something like that happened too. It was terrible. Still not sure exactly why it happened but it did.

 

[brockel]

I agree, I think that the movement to 6.5 or less rifle calibers for elk isn’t going away, but doesn’t mean I agree with it. I do believe that with the newer bullets, heavier bullets and faster twist calibers out now that one caliber down from below works just as well. So if you used a 30 cal regularly on elk before, I believe you would get the same performance from a 7mm now. Myself personally I wouldn’t go any smaller than a 7mm caliber on elk.
In my opinion I think the craze for going to light calibers for elk came from all the new hunters that showed up the last few years, that never shot a rifle before, and didn’t have a mentor to tell them to grow a set of balls and don’t flinch like a bitch from recoil and noise!!!
Respect the animal and learn how to toughen up, as the elk deserves a higher possibility of a quick death from a well placed bigger caliber than a 6.5 or smaller.

Two of these are 6.5 and two of these are 7mm all pulled from elk. What is what

 

[wind gypsy]

Two of these are 6.5 and two of these are 7mm all pulled from elk. What is what
View attachment 680725

Easy. The ones that had more energy are the bigger ones.

 

[IDVortex]

Two of these are 6.5 and two of these are 7mm all pulled from elk. What is what
View attachment 680725

Trick question. Only 30 cal can kill elk. So you sir are fake news.

Top two are 6.5, bottom 2 7mm?

 

[brockel]

Easy. The ones that had more energy are the bigger ones.

I remember the details of all 4 but I couldn’t tell you from the picture what all 4 are anymore without digging them out of the jar and doing some measurements

 

[brockel]

Trick question. Only 30 cal can kill elk. So you sir are fake news.

Top two are 6.5, bottom 2 7mm?

I know the top left is 7mm 160 accubond 3250fps. Other three are 7mm 168 long range accubond 2900fps, 6.5 140 Berger at 3000fps and 6.5 Berger at 2700fps

 

[dusky]

Shot a cow at 311 yards with 143eldx. She never ran. Bullet expanded very well and ended inside the far shoulder. Browning x bolt long range, 6.5cm.

 

[Wyohunth]

Adult cow. 50 yards frontal shot. Bullet found in rear ham. dropped right there. 140 grain Accubond and ~ 2700 muzzle fps

mature bull. 417 yards, lung shot. Travelled maybe 20 yards. Bullet passed through. Same bullet and velocity as above.