Wyoming proposal to slash Non-resident hunters

[BuzzH]

Thing is many with good jobs in today’s market can work from anywhere, no need to have a job from a WY company. Great thing tech has brought us is this ability to not be locked into an office or location. I think in time you’ll see more people move there that retain their employment from where they moved from. Heck in my office I have co workers that live all over the world working from home.

Covid has really shown that there is less of a need to house people in an office and that with that comes savings. Heck I haven’t been in my office but a handful of times in the last year.

Land prices aren’t too crazy high yet either, a million will buy a lot in WY.

Maybe....like I said, come on. If hunting is a priority for some to move to WY I'm actually fine with that and would encourage it.

I didn't move to Wyoming 20 years ago from Montana by accident. Hunting is important enough to me that I never have left or considered living in a State where I couldn't have at least an OTC rifle bull elk and buck deer tag every year. Never will live anywhere there doesn't and I've paid the price for that choice.

Exactly why I intend to keep advocating wayyyyyyyy more for Resident opportunities than NR. Not only does that make sense, its the right thing to do.

 

[sneaky]

Well, if they are no longer in California they aren't Californians, they're now Wyomingites. Might be time to start blaming your own residents instead of blaming where they moved from. Just a thought...

Easy to say except every damn conversation they start goes like this "where I'm from in California". No one cares. For every California transplant I talk to that doesn't want to change anything, I talk to a half dozen that are bitching that things aren't like where they came from.

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[Burkkus]

Half the tags at twice the cost to non-res???
Thankfully the bill got shot down... two years in a row.
See y’all next year.

 

[tdhanses]

This whole discussion really revolves around whether one believes in states's rights or not, and an individual state to hold its wildlife resources as a public trust for its residents. Fed law is clear that state's do have the right to manage their own wildlife and to limit nonresidents and charge higher fees to nonresidents. Even on fed lands states have the right to set seasons and bag limits and allocations etc that favor residents. It's understandable there will be differences of opinion among residents of a state and nonresidents, but in the end the state's do have the right to do what Wyoming is doing.

I don’t think anyone is saying WY doesn’t have the right, just not rolling over and saying well we can’t do a thing so let’s just take it. NR have a right to their voice, heard or not. I’m not sure about AK but NR contribute a lot of $$ to local economies and game depts in the lower 48. I feel we are getting close to a point where NR are tired of propping up states game depts, so emotions and voices get louder.

In reality there will be a tipping point but it’ll be a combination of things, not just tag prices or allocations that truly turn the tide to how will states continue to fund wildlife management with resident funding being the major contributor. I’m sure when fuel is $8 a gal we’ll see far fewer traveling to hunt.

Someday only the very wealthy will travel to hunt, could be 30 years from now, could be 10, hard to say but if we stay quiet it’ll be sooner then later and in the end it will effect the resident hunter as well. Hunting is not a feed your family activity in the eyes of the majority, look at how states are looking to make more trophy opportunities every year by reducing opportunities, more unit’s going to draw, tages being reduced, prices jumping to doubling, etc.

Doubt my kids have the opportunities I/we have had, resident or not. Some focus on a small ideals and alienate the larger picture which is preserving our hunting heritage long term, it is decaying away each year. We can’t focus on our own house when the neighborhood is slowly falling apart.

 

[Billinsd]

Easy to say except every damn conversation they start goes like this "where I'm from in California". No one cares. For every California transplant I talk to that doesn't want to change anything, I talk to a half dozen that are bitching that things aren't like where they came from.

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If you talked to me I'd be saying. "I've gone back in time!! This place is fantastic, reminds me of the small, rural town I grew up in, 20 miles from Disneyland, in the 60s and 70s, when you could leave your door unlocked".

 

[TexasCub]

There aren't many people that can move to Wyoming and make it home forever, one winter with above average winds will drive most people back out! Driving from Riverton to Wheatland in the winter is more treacherous than driving in remote Alaska or the Yukon!

 

[CorbLand]

But in retrospec, don’t they have that right? They have equal rights to vote on their own desires. People born and raised have no more rights then those that move to said state. Can’t say move here if you want to hunt but leave all your other bs where you came from. Fact is nothing residents can do when other residents have different beliefs and ideals, eventually one will overrule the other.

They do have that right and I will stand for people’s rights any day of the week. Still pisses me off though.

 

[dukeball33]

If I had to guess, 90/10 will be in WY by 2024 draw/hunting season if not 2023. The introduction and discussion over time (two years shot down but growing support) gives folks warning to use points if at all possible (but that's just assumption and 2024 is my opinion). Unfortunate for some but overall just makes sense... if you look at it objectively.

NR opportunity is still there through general hunts and 10% LE, residents are happier there are more premium tags and little if no economic impact is felt (demand is just too high).

If NR want to boycott WY, for opportunity or price qualms, there are thousands in line to take your place... just nature of the beast.

 

[tdhanses]

If I had to guess, 90/10 will be in WY by 2024 draw/hunting season if not 2023. The introduction and discussion over time (two years shot down but growing support) gives folks warning to use points if at all possible (but that's just assumption and 2024 is my opinion). Unfortunate for some but overall just makes sense... if you look at it objectively.

NR opportunity is still there through general hunts and 10% LE, residents are happier there are more premium tags and little if no economic impact is felt (demand is just too high).

If NR want to boycott WY, for opportunity or price qualms, there are thousands in line to take your place... just nature of the beast.

Yes but that’s based on assumptions nothing else changes, disposable income continues to grow etc. Eventually there will be a ceiling and it will be a combination of things not just tag prices or difficulty in drawing.

 

[dukeball33]

Yes but that’s based on assumptions nothing else changes, disposable income continues to grow etc. Eventually there will be a ceiling and it will be a combination of things not just tag prices or difficulty in drawing.

I'm guessing there will still be enough demand to meet the limited supply... a ceiling may be looming but it's tough to say; disposable income (or desire to use credit), time off and interest in hunting seem to be off the charts.

 

[BuzzH]

Yes but that’s based on assumptions nothing else changes, disposable income continues to grow etc. Eventually there will be a ceiling and it will be a combination of things not just tag prices or difficulty in drawing.

There's more than enough flexibility to make changes if, when, and where they happen.

Everyone acts like everything in regard to wildlife, allocations, and tags prices should stay static.

I can assure you that in 1978 when Wyoming was issuing over 2,000 moose permits and over 600 sheep permits when the license allocations were being discussed, things would look a lot different if they would have known that in 2021 there would be less than 400 moose tags and less than 200 sheep tags issued.

Things change and license allocations and tag prices should change accordingly.

 

[tdhanses]

There's more than enough flexibility to make changes if, when, and where they happen.

Everyone acts like everything in regard to wildlife, allocations, and tags prices should stay static.

I can assure you that in 1978 when Wyoming was issuing over 2,000 moose permits and over 600 sheep permits when the license allocations were being discussed, things would look a lot different if they would have known that in 2021 there would be less than 400 moose tags and less than 200 sheep tags issued.

Things change and license allocations and tag prices should change accordingly.

Oh I get that but sometimes once somethings lost it’s lost, none of us have a crystal ball but one thing is for sure, we better all work together before we have nothing.

 

[Trial153]

Flexibility means taking even a bigger percentage of the tags in the future.

From the resident comments on this subject, I have no doubt they would happily have a zero allocation of NR tags. The only thing that holds them in check is the money coming in and the fact they don't want to foot the whole bill.

 

[BuzzH]

Oh I get that but sometimes once somethings lost it’s lost, none of us have a crystal ball but one thing is for sure, we better all work together before we have nothing.

I think the best thing we can do is keep Resident opportunities abundant in the States we all live in. That's the most important thing as its what a majority participate in and also what we all have the most control of.

Even though I apply for lots of tags in other States, I realize that Resident opportunity has to be the priority and if something has to give, it should be my opportunities as a NR that should be cut first.

I'm fine with that, Residents first, every time.

 

[BuzzH]

Flexibility means taking even a bigger percentage of the tags in the future.

From the resident comments on this subject, I have no doubt they would happily have a zero allocation of NR tags. The only thing that holds them in check is the money coming in and the fact they don't want to foot the whole bill.

Damn right, the first people that should go without are NR hunters....

I feel that way as a NR hunter that's been applying for tags in 8-10 states for over 20 years. I don't have ill will toward NV, UT, OR, NM, AK, CO, etc. etc. etc. when they reduce NR opportunity to give their R's more tags. Its the way it should be...and needs to be.

 

[Dos Perros]

There aren't many people that can move to Wyoming and make it home forever, one winter with above average winds will drive most people back out! Driving from Riverton to Wheatland in the winter is more treacherous than driving in remote Alaska or the Yukon!

Summer/fall in WY. Enough to claim residency and vote. Late fall in Kansas. Winter/spring in AZ. That's our plan.

 

[tdhanses]

I think the best thing we can do is keep Resident opportunities abundant in the States we all live in. That's the most important thing as its what a majority participate in and also what we all have the most control of.

Even though I apply for lots of tags in other States, I realize that Resident opportunity has to be the priority and if something has to give, it should be my opportunities as a NR that should be cut first.

I'm fine with that, Residents first, every time.

That sounds good but keeping public lands in public hands takes more then just residents, especially residents in the west that have a minority representation. Sounds great to have a vast pool of tags available but what would they matter if there’s no where to go or very limited public land?

Western states need NR states support or these lands that will eventually go to the highest bidder in time and really what will it matter to NR that never step foot in these states.

 

[tdhanses]

Summer/fall in WY. Enough to claim residency and vote. Late fall in Kansas. Winter/spring in AZ. That's our plan.

Yup I just need to decide if WY is worth it, sell my CO place (original plan already in place) and live in a state with a more liberal hunting season 7 months of the year, WY is a good option for tax savings. It really wouldn’t be hard to do once the kids are out of the house.

 

[BuzzH]

Summer/fall in WY. Enough to claim residency and vote. Late fall in Kansas. Winter/spring in AZ. That's our plan.

Full year for Residency, then a majority of the year in Wyoming to maintain it...

We won't be staying full time in Wyoming, probably not even in the United States, in retirement. Just enough to maintain residency and stay legal.

Seems about the only way to realize the American Dream is to live part time outside the U.S.

 

[Dos Perros]

Seems about the only way to realize the American Dream is to live part time outside the U.S.

The American Dream and living abroad seem mutually exclusive.