When to hold vs when to dial?

[Lawnboi]

I wasn't asking about what your SO uses on you in the privacy of your home.

Your previous post could be interpreted that only rifles MOA scopes have a cone while rifles with MIL scopes do not.

Your previous post could be interpreted that only MIL scopes could be dialed and not MOA scopes.

Your previous post could be interpreted that if you hold on fur with a MOA scope you are likely to miss but that would be a non-issue doing the same with a MIL scope.

I think you misread.

The angular measurement unit dosnt matter in this instance.

 

[Oakman]

In a hunting situation, we usually only get one shot, so dialing for accuracy is critical to avoid any deviation from the target. There’s rarely a second chance.
On the other hand, with target shooting, you can try and hold over then see where your shot lands and adjust accordingly. And if you’ve got a spotter helping you call shots in that scenario, even better

 

[MT-nuffgun]

In a hunting situation, we usually only get one shot, so dialing for accuracy is critical to avoid any deviation from the target. There’s rarely a second chance.
On the other hand, with target shooting, you can try and hold over then see where your shot lands and adjust accordingly. And if you’ve got a spotter helping you call shots in that scenario, even better

The hunting scenarios you encounter must be totally different than the ones I seem to have. Many times I find myself in a situation where you have 15 seconds to range (or not), figure out a shooting position, and fire a shot or the opportunity is lost. If it’s under 300 yards and I’m limited on time, I’m not dialing…Period. A scenario I ran into last season was a rut mule deer hunt. Two bucks dogging one hot doe on public heading toward private. I had to cut across two draws to close the distance to a comfortable shooting range. As I topped the last ridge the bucks were 150 yards shy of the private land fence and closing fast. I threw my pack down and got into position behind it, yelled at the top of my lungs to stop them, (guessed the shot distance around 200 yards), and dumped the buck I was after. Ranged the shot distance after the buck went down and came up with 240 yards. Similar situations happen to me all the time with mule deer, Antelope, and Elk. Dialing is definitely more accurate but we have to be realistic as well. I have no problems holding over on half mil hash marks and executing accurate shots on target out to 300 yards.As I said previously, the few shots I have taken over 300 yards, I had time to dial. For whatever reason, when I am under 300 yards from my target animal, things seem to escalate fast from time to time.

 

[Oakman]

The hunting scenarios you encounter must be totally different than the ones I seem to have. Many times I find myself in a situation where you have 15 seconds to range (or not), figure out a shooting position, and fire a shot or the opportunity is lost. If it’s under 300 yards and I’m limited on time, I’m not dialing…Period. A scenario I ran into last season was a rut mule deer hunt. Two bucks dogging one hot doe on public heading toward private. I had to cut across two draws to close the distance to a comfortable shooting range. As I topped the last ridge the bucks were 150 yards shy of the private land fence and closing fast. I threw my pack down and got into position behind it, yelled at the top of my lungs to stop them, (guessed the shot distance around 200 yards), and dumped the buck I was after. Ranged the shot distance after the buck went down and came up with 240 yards. Similar situations happen to me all the time with mule deer, Antelope, and Elk. Dialing is definitely more accurate but we have to be realistic as well. I have no problems holding over on half mil hash marks and executing accurate shots on target out to 300 yards.As I said previously, the few shots I have taken over 300 yards, I had time to dial. For whatever reason, when I am under 300 yards from my target animal, things seem to escalate fast from time to time.

Thanks,
Just to clear things up, the dial I'm referring to is for longer distance shots. My rifle is zeroed at 100 yards, so there's no need to touch the dial at that range. Any adjustments I mentioned are for engaging targets at longer distance as you mentioned, also where elevation changes come into play. Hopefully that makes more sense now.

 

[Pacific_Fork]

The beauty of a scope with turrets is you can walk around with it zeroed however many yards you want, or what the conditions of the hunt you’re in. In the dense dark timber of N Idaho I like to walk around zeroed at 500 so every miss is clean.

 

[AZ_Hunter_2000]

I think you misread.

The angular measurement unit dosnt matter in this instance.

Please point out where in your post where you state that fact.

The issue using mpbr or a 200-250 yard zero for most is they assume their rifle is a laser beam and shoots the same hole.

Take that shot that’s 3” low because you just have to hold fur with your 1.5moa cone of fire rifle and your shot lands at the bottom of the cone, you better hope what your shooting at is bigger than a deer.

Or you could just dial or hold 1 mil and give yourself a lot more margin for error.

 

[Lawnboi]

Please point out where in your post where you state that fact.

The issue using mpbr or a 200-250 yard zero for most is they assume their rifle is a laser beam and shoots the same hole.

Take that shot that’s 3” low because you just have to hold fur with your 1.5moa cone of fire rifle and your shot lands at the bottom of the cone, you better hope what your shooting at is bigger than a deer.

Or you could just dial or hold 1 mil and give yourself a lot more margin for error.

I guess I’m not sure where you are going. I used moa and mil but really you could use them the other way around and it wouldn’t matter.

Typically people refer to their cone of fire in MOA, as I did above.

The hold mentioned below is just a hold. It could be one mil or 3.5 moa, no difference.


My point of the whole thing is to look at your actual cone of fire when it relates to mpbr. People assume because of the numbers your going to be x” low but in reality it can much lower from normal deviation. Look at most people’s groups at 3-400 yards.

Angular measurement dosnt matter in the context of what I’m trying to explain.

 

[wind gypsy]

Please point out where in your post where you state that fact.

The issue using mpbr or a 200-250 yard zero for most is they assume their rifle is a laser beam and shoots the same hole.

Take that shot that’s 3” low because you just have to hold fur with your 1.5moa cone of fire rifle and your shot lands at the bottom of the cone, you better hope what your shooting at is bigger than a deer.

Or you could just dial or hold 1 mil and give yourself a lot more margin for error.

I've no idea how this could be interpreted as a MOA vs MIL post. This entire thread is about when to dial vs hold over and he's pointing out built in aiming error with longer than 100 yd zeros and MPBR way of thinking.

It's not common to say my rifle my rifle has a 0.4 mil cone of fire like it is to reference rifle precision in MOA.

 

[Rich M]

You can do 350-400 yards while holding on hair with the old style 3,000 fps cartridges. Not so sure with the newer style slow bullets that float in air.

I remember a guy who didn't shoot an elk at 250 yards cause he was screwing around with dialing, then wasn't comfortable shooting prone, off his pack, or off a tree. Elk run off...

Learn yer gun, what it can do and what you can do.