What is holding you back from competitive shooting?

[EastCoaster]

This screams of the guys who say "Bro, jiu jitsu does nothing in a street fight. If things go down in the streets, pain train coming for you! Cause street rules, bro. Jiu jitsu does nothing for me."

It's been proven false, over and over and over.

I believe the expression is "Legend in their own mind" ...

Ha! Man, that is a perfect analogy. I remember the first match I shot.......I went into it thinking I was going to hammer the first stage. Ended up not even getting shot off, due to a complete mental breakdown when the buzzer went off. Life lessons......

 

[Lawnboi]

I am ignorant as I have not completed or attended a match. However, I have read numerous times people talking strategy on the Facebook page I mentioned before, and it seems the majority dump a shot off target intentionally to read the splash when the timer starts. That method of doping doesn't seem productive for a hunter.

This is not the norm

Depending on venue. You might not even have a berm to see your miss at all.

Not all matches are the same. The MD here in WI does a phenomenal job at mixing things up.

 

[wind gypsy]

How do you know this to be true? What is your competition experience?






How do you know this to be true?




Like what things? Please be specific.




Actually, yes. I see between 30-50 big game animals a year taken, almost all by those same people.





And you know this because of what experience competing?






Actually, hitting is the hard part and where most fail.




Well I’m killing multiples of hundreds of game animals, and seeing thousands killed by others, I would say that second round corrections are very important and nearly as important of a skill as first round hits past 300’ish yards. Past 500’ish second round corrections done quickly is more important that first round hit ability. Or at least that is what has shown up in those animals killed.





How do you know this? I don’t generally miss- I’ve missed twice in the last 60-70 animals; but I people do miss and in over 90% of cases they get a second shot. For someone that is trained correctly, they will spot their own impact/miss, correct and send another round as fast or faster than a spotter could could call it.




Ok- go on. What is your experience of using a calibrated FFP reticle (specifically mil) on animals and targets at speed?




I never said that it’s “marginal if not detrimental to the killers focus” beyond 600. Most people, regardless of equipment, do not have enough knowledge, skill, or ability to be taking shots on animals past 450’ish yards in broken terrain- that’s factually true. That has nothing to with what is the best “setup, gear and practice”. That can only be determined by shooting and tracking performance differences in hit rates and time to hit between techniques in large data sets…. Generally called competition.




Actually that’s not we’ll known at all. That is an excuse that people who don’t perform when measured objectively use- “ya, well if it was real, I would have totally dominated”. What had proven out repeatedly in every single study and research project measuring stress and ability is that there is no “magic” ability to perform above someone’s baseline under stress. In other words- if you can’t do it consistently on a range, you can not do it consistently “for real”.






The highlighted part is so laughably false, it boggles the mind as the information is not hard to find. Point in fact, historically the best units in war (read most effective) very often had high levels of competitive background, or outright demanded their members to compete. All of the data collected over the last decade since it has been really measured and looked at has found a direct correlation between someone’s on demand shooting skills, and their performance under stress. So much so that an entire branch of the US armed forces has completely rewritten their marksmanship doctrine.

It's like arguing with the sky. Logic likely wont get you anywhere with him but at least others reading can see it.

 

[Lawnboi]

Would people with time constraints shoot more one day matches? I think the thought is you need to shoot the expensive two day match when in reality most of these places are hosting 1 day matches throughout the year for less money, no prizes, and they can be a little more relaxed.

 

[chutinlead]

Would people with time constraints shoot more one day matches? I think the thought is you need to shoot the expensive two day match when in reality most of these places are hosting 1 day matches throughout the year for less money, no prizes, and they can be a little more relaxed.

The people organizing NRL Hunter must have heard similar feedback because they have a Hunter One section dedicated to one day matches now.

 

[SDHNTR]

Time. I’d rather spend my spare time actually hunting than playing like it. I practice enough to feel confidently proficient to hunt effectively. Then I go hunting.

Truthfully, my position is an opposite question to the OP. I’ve never understood people’s desire to engage in all these competitions. It baffles me that there are people that would rather spend time shooting at targets than hunting. Shooting is fun, but hunting is a hell of a lot more fun!

 

[david2duck]

The people organizing NRL Hunter must have heard similar feedback because they have a Hunter One section dedicated to one day matches now.

They did somewhat listen. 6 matches is hardly anything. Obviously there has to be a big enough desire, they need to be able to make it worth their time to put one on, etc. The closest match to me is 10 hrs… hardly a one day deal.

The obvious reality is people don’t have enough time and they think the cost of travel, stay, ammo, etc isn’t worth it. That’s evident from the comments. Until there are matches in every state, or close to, it will probably continue to be what it is now. And that’s totally fine.

 

[chutinlead]

They did somewhat listen. 6 matches is hardly anything. Obviously there has to be a big enough desire, they need to be able to make it worth their time to put one on, etc. The closest match to me is 10 hrs… hardly a one day deal.

The obvious reality is people don’t have enough time and they think the cost of travel, stay, ammo, etc isn’t worth it. That’s evident from the comments. Until there are matches in every state, or close to, it will probably continue to be what it is now. And that’s totally fine.

It was just launched this August and it takes time for everything to get put together. I bet we see way more than 6 one day matches.

I went to a "Hunter Style" 22lr match this summer that had targets out to 200yds and it was down along the shooting clubs trap range. It was only one day and while a long day with a 4hr drive before the match, not impossible.

 

[LongWayAround]

There was a nrl match near me this spring that I would have liked to attend.

The two biggest reasons I didn't were ammunition and ability/equipment.

I don't currently reload and did not have 150-200 rounds to burn. The price of that much factory ammo, plus an entrance fee were more than I was interested for. Not to mention the recent lack of availability of ammo to begin with.

I also don't have a bunch of fancy rifle gear. I would feel a lot more competitive shooting against a field of guys with a factory rifles off of their packs than what I'm seeing in the comments here.

 

[long hunter]

Cant eat paper.

 

[SDHNTR]

Cant eat paper.

Exactly!

 

[Lawnboi]

Exactly!

I watch most hunters waste way more time at the rifle range getting a fraction of the experience that a one day match would get them.

 

[TX_Diver]

Would people with time constraints shoot more one day matches? I think the thought is you need to shoot the expensive two day match when in reality most of these places are hosting 1 day matches throughout the year for less money, no prizes, and they can be a little more relaxed.

I'd love to shoot a 1 day match. I didn't this year because I drew an archery tag so I solely shot a bow from about May onwards. Next year I'll (probably) have a rifle antelope tag and if so I'll definitely be shooting the rifle more.

My main reason is cost though. I have enough other expensive hobbies that I don't need to start shooting thousands of rounds a year (and then the associated gear rabbit hole!).

 

[SDHNTR]

I watch most hunters waste way more time at the rifle range getting a fraction of the experience that a one day match would get them.

Oh, I certainly do not disagree with you! I was at the range today and experienced the same watching a few others. One guy could barely keep his shots in an 8 inch bull’s-eye at 100 yards, and expressed “OK, I’m good to go” as he was putting his rifle back into the case.

His buddy was talking about their hunt this weekend, as he was attempting to cite in a new scope. Cheapo vortex of course. I watched him go through a box of ammo and change simply trying to get it on paper.

I’m with you, most hunters are absolutely lousy shooters. But I’d also like to think I am not “most hunters “.

 

[Lawnboi]

Oh, I certainly do not disagree with you! I was at the range today and experienced the same watching a few others. One guy could barely keep his shots in an 8 inch bull’s-eye at 100 yards, and expressed “OK, I’m good to go” as he was putting his rifle back into the case.

His buddy was talking about their hunt this weekend, as he was attempting to cite in a new scope. Cheapo vortex of course. I watched him go through a box of ammo and change simply trying to get it on paper.

I’m with you, most hunters are absolutely lousy shooters. But I’d also like to think I am not “most hunters “.

Once you hit that point where your starting to get it, I’d give a match a go. It will accelerate you beyond what you know. It takes what you know and places pressure on you to make the shot, much like a hunt.

I’m not saying you need to go out and travel every month to shoot the nrl or prs pro circuit. I’m just saying if there is a match within a few hours from you, go give it a go.

Iv shot exactly one national level match. I got just as much out of the 1 days I had shot before that.

In terms of crap Iv wasted my time on, matches are pretty low on the list. Because at the end of the day making the shot is the difference between success and not.

 

[Lawnboi]

The people organizing NRL Hunter must have heard similar feedback because they have a Hunter One section dedicated to one day matches now.

It just needs to be adopted now by ranges and MDs. That’s the problem in my state, there’s not much for ranges that can host something like that. Hopefully we get there some day. The demand is there.

 

[EastCoaster]

This thread is interesting. Seems to be some push back on the comp thing by some. Usually the long range hunting crowd goes hand in hand with the PRS crowd. I’m not sure I would feel comfortable taking a 600 plus yard shot on an animal without having had done it previously in a somewhat stressful situation. Where else would you get this experience?

 

[EdP]

Too old. I still shoot flintlock rifles competitively and do quite well. At 68 years of age I don't need or want a new competitive hobby. It does look like a heck of a lot of fun though and I might have been all in 25 years ago.

 

[SDHNTR]

Once you hit that point where your starting to get it, I’d give a match a go. It will accelerate you beyond what you know. It takes what you know and places pressure on you to make the shot, much like a hunt.

I’m not saying you need to go out and travel every month to shoot the nrl or prs pro circuit. I’m just saying if there is a match within a few hours from you, go give it a go.

Iv shot exactly one national level match. I got just as much out of the 1 days I had shot before that.

In terms of crap Iv wasted my time on, matches are pretty low on the list. Because at the end of the day making the shot is the difference between success and not.

I hear ya, and I’m sure you’re right, but I have no off season. I used to shoot a lot of 3d archery tournaments. Several times a month. Similar concept. Then I had kids and something had to give. Nowadays, If I have a half day or more available where I could do something like that, I’m going hunting for real. There’s no practice better than the real thing!

In the last 30 days I’ve shot 7 (4 gun, 3 bow) different big game animals and some birds sprinkled in. And there’s also fishing season too! And I have a family, a job, and an overall busy normal life too!

 

[long hunter]

I believe most dedicated hunters put more range time in than most think, I shot competition pistol for years, shot competition rifle matches while in the Marine Corps along with the annual re-quals, Was working on long range rifle until a work injury caused me three operations on a shoulder, Shoot out to 600 yards now just for fun, limit my hunting distances to 4-450 yards max. (perfer closer ) Theres a lot of difference between punching holes in paper or ringing steel at long distances and actual shooting on a big game animal. ( we read stories on here of guys shooting animals at 1000 yards or more only to wound them and then lose them ) Getting ready (hopefully if tags are drawn) for Antelope and mule deer in Wyoming Oct. of 2023 this will be trip # 3 will start to shoot at least 10 months before the hunt there will be a lot of range sessions and they are 7-8 hour days during that time, on top of the normal shooting which happens at least once a week, Sure there are hunters that are happy witha 5 in. group at 100 yards but I bet that is not the norm. Some shoot for bragging rights or perhaps a trophy or medal, I shoot because I am a hunter and as a hunter I owe the animal a quick death brought about due to my skills and markmans abilities.