What did you do at the range today?

[Lawnboi]

For whatever it’s worth, I’d take whatever money you save up for an ATACR, sell one of your NX8’s and get a ZCO. But I hear you about all the other ancillary gear. Awhile back I hit the reset button, sold almost everything and decided I’d rather have low volume of high quality gear.

That’s my problem, iv trimmed most of the fat in my gear and currently have more rifles than scopes, if you count 4 rifles as a lot, one being a match gun that really only does that well. I could almost buy three nx8s for the price of one ZCO. I am already playing musical scopes ones match season is over.

I’m getting there one piece at a time though. I’m going to build up the slush fund a bit before deciding to buy anything. Unless an rrs 24l comes in stock, or a 6.5 ultra 9.

 

[Lawnboi]

Gen 2 Ultra-9 6.5 in stock

Thunder Beast: Ultra 9 Suppressor, Gen 2 - 6.5mm

The TBAC Ultra 9 6.5mm suppressor is designed for applications where maximum suppression is needed regardless of suppressor length (9in).

www.milehighshooting.com

I've seen the 24L pop up in stock here and there, but best bet is to just backorder through RRS to get it the quickest. I've only owned/used a handful of tripods, but I'm a pretty big fan of my 24L with integrated Anvil30.

Unless one of those four rifles is a 22 rimfire, I'd sell one if I were you. If one is a 22 rimfire and one is a 223, I'd sell the 223 if I were you. A three gun set-up for bolt guns is a good spot to be IMO. Lightweight hunting set-up, heavyweight volume/range/comp gun, and midweight crossover/back-up/loaner. I don't really get wrapped around the axle comparing cartridges. I do think a 223 bolt gun (or similar) is kind of a waste. It's poor ballistically, is hard to truly learn on, doesn't teach recoil management, etc. For the three rifles, just pick a cartridge that is available and economical when you get a new barrel and re-evaluate when that barrel is burnt. That's just my unsolicited opinion.

Back to scopes, personally, I wouldn't trade either of my ZCOs for an entire pallet of NX8s. I've sort of transitioned from the "value" mindset to pure performance for my main bolt guns. If you look at other hobbies, shooting actually isn't that bad from a financial standpoint. And maybe I'm wrong, but when I see how often you are hitting up the range, the time spent reloading, etc., the additional couple thousand dollars for a true top tier optic is really small potatoes from a big picture standpoint. Optics and stocks, that's where you interface, and that's where you should spend your money. Again, just my opinion.

I’d be all over that ultra 9 if my local didn’t charge me $165 for a transfer. Need silencershop to avoid the fees… or another TBAC cert….

Re the RRS. You can’t backordered now or it would be done, they just came out and said that hopefully by august. I don’t want to buy a two vets as I have a rrs ascend and really like everything about it, just want a little bigger. That and I’d rather support a made in America product. If you see a 24 in stock anywhere let me know, if been keeping an eye out.

The only fat I have to trim is a custom defiance 3006 I had built, that currently is sitting scopeless. I just didn’t need another hunting rifle. I’ll use it someday, and I put together the parts over years, but here it sits. It’s my only long action, I can’t get rid of it though, will likely be my only custom for a long time.

As far as other rifles I have no 22lr, atleast not one I shoot often, just a ruger from childhood. Do have a 17hmr but that sits in the corner always ready for predator management in the yard. 223, which Is my main hunting gun for up to deer to 400. I shoot the crap out of the 223, prairie dogs, predators, deer. Got a 6.5cm light hunting rifle that is currently out of commission waiting for a manners, along with a 6.5cm heavy match rifle. That’s it for now. My wife has interest in shooting as well, along with hunting, she has come, but dosnt have any of her own rifles. On top of the above I have components to burn all those barrels, along with one spare tube, hopefully soon to be two. I actually get a lot out of the 223. I realize it’s short comings but loading 75/77s, it’s a solid performer to 500, past that I think you start gambling a bit. If I had to get rid of one, the 223 would be the last one being that elk hunting is not something I do often. I don’t see a 22 as useful at all, I have shot a lot of 22 and get about as much as a dry fire with a little dopamine out of it. Maybe that would be different if I had a decent 22. My 9lb suppressed 223 recoils about like my match rifle. Out of curiosity you said you pared down, what to?

With the actions I have, I’d happily buy more tubes, and maybe another bolt and be happy for a long long time. Just need a few more good scopes…. And more components.

I hear you on the grand scheme though… in shooting a thousand bucks is nothing. I go to matches looking at my tikka/nx8 setup next to guys who spent what I did on my entire setup on just a scope. I just need to put on the blinders some times and shoot what I have.

 

[Lawnboi]

Will do.


If we are taking gambling off the table, I think 500 yards is a stretch. At my altitude the 77 TMK is going to be about a 4MPH cartridge. At least in field conditions, a lot of people are going to be hard pressed to call wind speed better than 4MPH (and we are completely ignoring direction), which means you have a +/- 0.5 mils to add on either side of your ability to shoot. So add 18" of width to your ability. If you can shoot 0 MOA groups, you are already gambling on most big game animals. If you are able to perfectly call the wind direction and can be within 2 MPH of speed, we are still talking about 9" of horizontal variance, so you need to be able to shoot about 5/8 MOA (accuracy) on demand, which would correlate to groups (precision) in the 3/8 MOA realm (or likely smaller).

Let's say you only ever shoot from the prone, and you consistently shoot 0.5 MOA (precision), which will likely translate to 0.625 - 1.0+ MOA groups (accuracy) at distance. AND, let's also say that you are an "elite" wind caller in field conditions and can call the wind to +/-2 MPH (speed) and +/- 30 min (direction). At 350 yards, you are looking at about 3.5" of shooter variance, and +/- 2.2" from wind speed. In 10+ MPH winds, you could have an additional directional error of 2.5+ MPH (depending on actual direction), which would be +/- 2.8"+. So we're talking 13.5"+ of total horizontal variance assuming you are able to dictate position. Unless you venture into the probability game, I think most people will be looking at the 200 - 300 yard range as their maximum effective range with a 223 (any position and unknown conditions). You very well could be an outlier though, or the statistics just haven't caught up to you.

By simply choosing a better/more efficient cartridge, you can easily extend your effective range. Generally the trade of is ability to manage recoil, which is a basic/fundamental skill IMO. My 7RM is about an 8MPH gun at my altitude. The unknowns associated with the wind variance are cut in half, which will significantly extend your effective range.


I'm making a small transition this year.

1) heavyweight/heavy use custom steel action, steel barrel, ZCO optic, chassis. Currently chambered in 6CM, and will likely be chambered in a 6mm or 6.5 variant moving forward (depending on availability/cost). Atlas gen 2 bipod, TBAC Gen 1 6.5 Ultra 7.
2) midweight/medium use custom steel action, current barrel is about burnt out and I'm debating steel vs CF wrapped barrel for the next one, currently has a ZCO on it, carbon fiber stock. Currently chambered in 6.5CM, and will likely be chambered in 6mm or 6.5 variant moving forward (depending on availability/cost). Atlas gen 2 bipod, TBAC Gen 1 Ultra 7 30 cal.
3) Light(ish) weight primary hunting rifle custom Ti action, carbon fiber wrapped barrel, carbon fiber stock, Tangent Theta, chambered in 7mm Rem Mag. Atlas gen 2 bipod, TBAC Gen2 Ultra 7 30 cal.

The ZCO on #2 might make its way to a Vudoo 22lr build, and I might replace it with a baby ATACR on #2. Maybe. I have a couple other stragglers that are either sentimental or not even worth selling or something that I'd gift or give a good deal to someone local that I know, but those 3 listed easily get 95% of my time. Moving forward, I might sell a stock/chassis or optic or something to fund a replacement, but I don't really care to expand that set-up.


'Do what you have to do until you can do what you want to do'

I hear you on the 223. It’s a 4-5mph gun depending. 400 on something alive is pushing it, my personal limit, 2kfps threshold and that has to be wind I’m comfortable with. I think if more people did a little more digging into the data such as that with the 223 they would realize how much of a gamble they are taking.

The Kraft drill stuff really opened my eyes to that idea, why it hasn’t been looked at in that regard more I don’t know.

 

[Lawnboi]

Kraft drill, 2 shot@ 400yd 6” circle 20 second drills, finished with another Kraft. Working on speed and breathing with speed, seeing my hit, and following up in a timely manner.

Fighting a bit of a flinch shooting such a fine point at 100 yards, should probably stop shooting Kraft drills at 25x and move it down to where I can’t see my heart beating.

 

[Lawnboi]

25x?!?!?!? Daaaaaannnnnnggg

I’m on like 8x at 100 yards, and maybe 10x - 12x at 400 yards shooting these Kraft drills.

Iv been trying to tighten up my target acquisition.

Most of my distance shooting is all done on 12-16x.

That said the scope has hit 32x a few times shooting 100.

 

[rokbottom]

Some match rifle training today. Swapped primers, 205s gave me some primer flow I never saw with 450s/br4, so I abandoned them for 450s. Shot a Kraft drill and adjusted zero. I’m going to shoot Kraft drills on the positional target on one spot rather than the big one, 4 drills per paper!

After that I did some timed drills with the shot timer, 6” plate at 400 yards. Spanked that for a while and called it a day.

Need to work on more speed, and faster target acquisition. I also wonder if a scope that resolves better would help on grey targets, most of the time we are shooting them there isn’t paint on them and they nearly disappear.

Going to bring out the 4 incher next time as well.

@TK-421 I need to shoot some longer range Kraft drills.

View attachment 413970

What is that bottom metal? It kind of looks like Redsnakes for AICS mags.

 

[Lawnboi]

What is that bottom metal? It kind of looks like Redsnakes for AICS mags.

That’s a manners tikka aics mini chassis. Solid bedding block with the bottom metal built in. Been super reliable.

 

[rokbottom]

That’s a manners tikka aics mini chassis. Solid bedding block with the bottom metal built in. Been super reliable.

Ahh, I read that they made an AICS version of the mini-chassis, but I haven't seen a decent picture of it.

I like it!

 

[Mike Islander]

Cataract surgery on right eye 6 days ago. What a difference! Left eye in a week.

Three 10-round groups with the little 10/22 at 30 yards.

 

[Thinkingman]

I shot two 1/2MOA groups this weekend.
One at 100yds and one at 200yds.
Rock River AR15 Predator Pursuit
HSM 77gr MatchKings

 

[TX_Diver]

Positional craft drill with some old loads from before switching brass. Various powder charges in .223.

2 shots in the middle to the right of "Prone" were to figure out where this ammo was hitting. I shifted up .4 mil and started shooting.

Was a little surprised when I got to the target and only saw 2 holes standing. Checking the inside of the box I got all 3 on target though...

It definitely appears that I hit about 1.5" left with my positional shots compared to my prone shots. Open to anyone's suggestions on that. Tikka .223 with original stock. Harris bipod and GC lite rear bag.

Sitting was cross legged with the rifle on a bag on my kids table.

Kneeling was with the bag on my deck rail.

First shot prone (left) was from top of a t-post while I leaned against the house. Next 2 were from a tree limb and were much more comfortable. All w/ the GC bag

 

[USNairborne]

Zeroed my melon hunting rifle; 40 shots later, and my head is feeling like that melon …kick is not bad, but the concussion is a bit unpleasant after a while.

 

[eldeuce]

Got my 17 PP CO bull elk tag, muzzleloader,
SO
Went to the range, where I've been working up a new load BH209 + 330gr ELR (powerbelt)

1.3 MOA open sights at 100yds (bottom 2 don't matter...)
~1750 fps MV, coincidentally ~1750 ft. lbs. @ 80 yards..
I'm quite pleased..
Oh, plus left work early

 

[Lawnboi]

Positional craft drill with some old loads from before switching brass. Various powder charges in .223.

2 shots in the middle to the right of "Prone" were to figure out where this ammo was hitting. I shifted up .4 mil and started shooting.

Was a little surprised when I got to the target and only saw 2 holes standing. Checking the inside of the box I got all 3 on target though...

It definitely appears that I hit about 1.5" left with my positional shots compared to my prone shots. Open to anyone's suggestions on that. Tikka .223 with original stock. Harris bipod and GC lite rear bag.

Sitting was cross legged with the rifle on a bag on my kids table.

Kneeling was with the bag on my deck rail.

First shot prone (left) was from top of a t-post while I leaned against the house. Next 2 were from a tree limb and were much more comfortable. All w/ the GC bag

Is your barrel free floated? I had a similar shift with factory tikka stocks when shooting off different open tables vs a bipod. Floating it helped but beyond that I just ended up with different stocks.

If it’s not a rifle issue it’s hard to diagnose on here. I’d start by dry firing a few. If you see reticle shift from the firing pin spring Is bet it’s a shooter issue. That’s a hole to go down, but my guess would be that your not applying the same pressure as you are prone to the rifle.

Cheek and hand pressure can make quite a difference with a light rifle as well. You should be able to release your firing hand and not see reticle movement, same goes for cheek on the stock.

 

[TX_Diver]

Good thinking on video. Even with the .223 my reticle is ending up 1-2 mils left on some shots. Occasionally low too but typically left

 

[TX_Diver]

Is your barrel free floated? I had a similar shift with factory tikka stocks when shooting off different open tables vs a bipod. Floating it helped but beyond that I just ended up with different stocks.

If it’s not a rifle issue it’s hard to diagnose on here. I’d start by dry firing a few. If you see reticle shift from the firing pin spring Is bet it’s a shooter issue. That’s a hole to go down, but my guess would be that your not applying the same pressure as you are prone to the rifle.

Cheek and hand pressure can make quite a difference with a light rifle as well. You should be able to release your firing hand and not see reticle movement, same goes for cheek on the stock.

If I had to guess it’s definitely primarily a shooter issue. I will try a few of those drills and also try to get some video. Did not draw a rifle tag this year so may be a Bit as I will be shooting my bow a lot more than the rifle. Also The soybeans to tall soon which will make it a little harder to shoot paper

 

[Lawnboi]

Finally slapped a scope on the 3006 to give it a go. $300 SWFA on a $3000 rifle. Wanted to give the custom 700 platform a good go before I build another gun this winter. Unsure of another tikka or going with something like an ARC or terminus. This one is on a defiance tenacity, built by LRI. Don’t have anything to shoot with the thing this year. Almost forgot what real recoil felt like. Nice to pull the trigger on something that I started assembling parts for in 2019

 

[Decker9]

Got out to do some barrel break in on my new 7 saum, also sighting in my Brno 22 I recently built a new stock for.

I’m pretty impressed with the 22 at 50 yards, it was a pretty windy day, I look forward to trying again on a calm day.


I have a magnospeed hanging off my saum, so I’m not expecting much in terms of accuracy yet, but 160gr accubonds are showing some promise even with the barrel ornament.

 

[Lawnboi]

Data gather, zero post clean and Kraft for this weekends upcoming match.

Might need to let off the gas a bit on my 140eldm load.

 

[Lawnboi]

Match day, practice is paying off. 76% hit rate, 71/100, timed out a few. Made it into the top twenty despite zeroing a stage. Solid trigger presses cost me a few points, that and I’m going to practice some tripod rear on wobbly props, cost me a few more. I did something bad and ordered an RRS 24L. Also need to buckle down on fueling for the day and controlling my caffiene intake, seeing my heart beat in the reticle first stage didn’t help.

Got a 22 mag for a match and day use, good price used on here, worked much better than the 14r. Only picture I took.

@hereinaz hows the brass bag pocket coming? The Home Depot bag I kept my brass in this match didn’t last long.