Vortex Japan vs China manufacture

[Bwana]

I understand your response was tongue in cheek, but I think my response was valid and the idea of outsourcing manufacturing and the effect it has on Americans was brought up by another person who said this (I quoted them above): "Vortex is just another American sell-out company that makes big chunks of change at the expense of the average American."

This is by far my favorite hunting forum with the most informed, level headed people I find on any of them, but the idea that Americans are being bled dry by trade is still bandied around here as fact, when it is clearly not backed up by the economics.

I'm certainly glad you read thru my dry sarcasm, my intent wasn't to offend you

I do feel it's unfair to classify a products quality, purely based on a countries origin of manufacturing. As long as standards are adhered to, and QC is controlled by the "mother" company of high standards...quality products at a reasonable to price to the end user can be provided. China is no longer the Taiwan/Philippines mfg. of plastic trinkets and cheap shoes, they have made remarkable steps in technology and plant upgrading. They are certainly capable of great optics, just so in-house representatives are in control of QC and standards.

I don't have an issue with foreign products, including those from China or Japan. But I'm not a fan of companies that parade a front of American owned(push military/police discounts and support), purely as a marketing ploy to dismiss the fact that their products are made elsewhere/outsourced. Products should be rated/reviewed based on quality/price, instead of blindly choosing based on an American billboard waved in front of our face to block the facts.

Companies such as Leupold have managed to stay a viable source of a good product line, all while staying in the US and affordable for the masses. They may not be the best on the market, but their pricing/business structure allows for competitive pricing and marketable product....it can be done.

 

[KurtR]

They are just a branding company, no different than bushnell, nikon, most leupold sport optics, etc. Besides the AMG, the rest of it is built and packaged to their specs and then sold. The reason retailers push them so hard is there are large margins in their product, much higher than the alphas.

The razor 2 rifle scopes are taken apart and re assembled with in Wisconsin also so as the companies over seas that dont have to follow copy right patents dont pirate the internals. Frank Gali has made videos at the Vortex factory if any one has the ambition to search them out quite interesting to see.

 

[WRO]

The razor 2 rifle scopes are taken apart and re assembled with in Wisconsin also so as the companies over seas that dont have to follow copy right patents dont pirate the internals. Frank Gali has made videos at the Vortex factory if any one has the ambition to search them out quite interesting to see.

Same as nightforce..

But less than 10% of ones SKU's having american manufacturing touch them does not make them an american made company. They're a import/branding company.

 

[dotman]

Same as nightforce..

But less than 10% of ones SKU's having american manufacturing touch them does not make them an american made company. They're a import/branding company.

That may change with Trump or pricing may go up 35%.

 

[Bwana]

That may change with Trump or pricing may go up 35%.

Sure, just like how he showed Carrier there was a new Sheriff in town lol...he gave them 7 million in incentives when he visited, really scared the crap out of them

 

[KurtR]

Same as nightforce..

But less than 10% of ones SKU's having american manufacturing touch them does not make them an american made company. They're a import/branding company.

Is there any optics companies American made other than maybe US Optics. Other than a few pieces by each company i dont know of any that would pass the ftc ratings but i could be wrong.

 

[Bwana]

I thought Leupold(gold ring), Trijicon & Meopta USA were US, but don't quote me on that.

 

[WRO]

I thought Leupold(gold ring), Trijicon & Meopta USA were US, but don't quote me on that.

A lot of the gold ring products do not qualify for the made in america sticker as they are assembled of largely foreign made parts. Burris makes a lot of the products in the USA, premier reticles used to make really nice us made scopes, US optics does, I've heard that the atacar and a few other Night forces actually qualify for the made in the USA label, and Eotech is USA made.

 

[Tex68w]

A lot of the gold ring products do not qualify for the made in america sticker as they are assembled of largely foreign made parts. Burris makes a lot of the products in the USA, premier reticles used to make really nice us made scopes, US optics does, I've heard that the atacar and a few other Night forces actually qualify for the made in the USA label, and Eotech is USA made.

USO is the only one I know of that fully makes variable optics here in the states. Premier was awesome, I think in a round-a-bout sort of way they got revived as Tangent Theta (which are phenomenal) but they are based in Canada, but don't quote me on TT coming from Premier.

 

[Bwana]

A lot of the gold ring products do not qualify for the made in america sticker as they are assembled of largely foreign made parts. Burris makes a lot of the products in the USA, premier reticles used to make really nice us made scopes, US optics does, I've heard that the atacar and a few other Night forces actually qualify for the made in the USA label, and Eotech is USA made.

Interesting,,,I'd think with optical ground glass, magnesium rings and such, etc...it would be hard to be %100 USA made, very hard to compete in the market today.

 

[WRO]

Interesting,,,I'd think with optical ground glass, magnesium rings and such, etc...it would be hard to be %100 USA made, very hard to compete in the market today.

Schott and a couple others have factories in the US. That being said, LOW and Schott Germany supply most of the higher quality glass for sport optics.

If you look at the leupold webpage, the scopes all say designed, machined, and assembled in the USA. To get an FTC approved Made in the USA label, they can only contain a negligible amount of non us sourced parts.

 

[GKPrice]

The Phillipines has factories making some Burris models and there's a manufacturer producing some pretty decent 1911's and other model firearms - Japan has the famous Miroku plant that excels at producing excellent long arms and has for a very long time, as well Japan has excelled at cameras and optics too - It seems to me that supporting China would be the real folly here .....

 

[GKPrice]

A lot of the gold ring products do not qualify for the made in america sticker as they are assembled of largely foreign made parts. Burris makes a lot of the products in the USA, premier reticles used to make really nice us made scopes, US optics does, I've heard that the atacar and a few other Night forces actually qualify for the made in the USA label, and Eotech is USA made.

as a point of reference Premier ONLY worked on Leupold scopes for boosts, reticles and the like, their ceasing that had nothing to do with Leupold's quality or where the parts were made, Leupold drove that decision - a person might want to travel to Leupold and take the tour of the factory prior to making claims about their products, just saying ......

 

[GKPrice]

I thought Leupold(gold ring), Trijicon & Meopta USA were US, but don't quote me on that.

Bwana, you are correct with Leupold at least, have no "inside" knowledge of the others

 

[KurtR]

USO is the only one I know of that fully makes variable optics here in the states. Premier was awesome, I think in a round-a-bout sort of way they got revived as Tangent Theta (which are phenomenal) but they are based in Canada, but don't quote me on TT coming from Premier.

TT bought all of premier property when they went out of buisness. They are completely new design by ATI which is out of Canada. TT were repairing premiers but as of late have stopped servicing them.

 

[KurtR]

Bwana, you are correct with Leupold at least, have no "inside" knowledge of the others

They have the made in America stamp again I know a few years back there was a law suit as they did not meet the FTC regulations. It is good to finally see some inovation on leupy part resting on the mark 4 they had fallen way behind hopefully reliability will pick up to.

 

[Tex68w]

They have the made in America stamp again I know a few years back there was a law suit as they did not meet the FTC regulations. It is good to finally see some inovation on leupy part resting on the mark 4 they had fallen way behind hopefully reliability will pick up to.

The VX6HD is legit, it will be a huge seller for them.

 

[Tex68w]

TT bought all of premier property when they went out of buisness. They are completely new design by ATI which is out of Canada. TT were repairing premiers but as of late have stopped servicing them.

Thanks for the clarification, I knew they were related to some degree. It's a shame that they no longer work on Premier's. I had a Premier reticle in one of my S&B PMII 5-25's, I never should have sold that optic, it was perfect for ELR.

 

[GKPrice]

They have the made in America stamp again I know a few years back there was a law suit as they did not meet the FTC regulations. It is good to finally see some inovation on leupy part resting on the mark 4 they had fallen way behind hopefully reliability will pick up to.

Leupold has been doing some foreign parts and maybe even manufacture on the lower end models but they have a very extensive manufacturing facility in Beaverton that has done nothing but grow and expand year by year - They tend to not get caught up in a "yearly competitive rush" but try to make sure they have something "right" before presentation - they have also been ultra focused on LE and military in recent years, there are optics we consumers know noting about and cannot get - this whole "dialing" for long distance is relatively new in the realm of "hunting", they are addressing it within their walls I believe - Leupold is a solid, honest company who's not going anywhere and won't ever attempt to deceive anyone (although they do have things they would rather not share from time to time) I've been using Leupold top shelf products my entire life and never had reason to doubt or criticize - I've no skin in the game with them, just the utmost respect after knowing many employees over the years - They've also done as much as any company "out there" for our veterans AND active military as well as LEO's - Good company with honest intentions Leupold is

 

[WRO]

as a point of reference Premier ONLY worked on Leupold scopes for boosts, reticles and the like, their ceasing that had nothing to do with Leupold's quality or where the parts were made, Leupold drove that decision - a person might want to travel to Leupold and take the tour of the factory prior to making claims about their products, just saying ......

It's not a claim, it's on the website..

Premier started their own line after they split from working with leupold which could have the made in America lable per the ftc as I understand it. They went out of business in 2013.

I've been to the factory and still have a few leupold scopes. I'm not saying they're a bad company, just not legally allowed to have a made in the USA label per ftc regulations.