Uphill Athlete

[Dave_S]

Curious to hear if anyone has used one of Uphill Athlete's programs. If so, which one(s) and what did you think of it?

 

[JohnB]

Curious to hear if anyone has used one of Uphill Athlete's programs. If so, which one(s) and what did you think of it?

Look into Evoke Endurance. One of the UA founders as well as something like 17 out of 18 total coaches all chose to leave UA and found a separate company. Their products are very similar.

 

[ResearchinStuff]

I have the book, training for the new alpinism, which mentions uphill athlete and had some level of author affiliation. Cool concepts, but it's not feasible for me to work out 3+ hours per day, or to do 2 a days. Also, elk hunting is not the same as climbing in the Himalayas. Ymmv.

 

[Dave_S]

I feel like heard one of their people on a podcast….can’t remember which one. I’ll check them out. Thanks!


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[Dave_S]

I have the book, training for the new alpinism, which mentions uphill athlete and had some level of author affiliation. Cool concepts, but it's not feasible for me to work out 3+ hours per day, or to do 2 a days. Also, elk hunting is not the same as climbing in the Himalayas. Ymmv.

I also don’t have that kind of time. I’m pretty experienced as far as programming for strength, but I really don’t know where to start as far as trying to program for cardio or endurance. I guess I’m hoping that following an established program would help with putting some intent into my training, as opposed to just sort of going for a run or hike and hoping for the best.


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[B_Reynolds_AK]

@Dave_S

Dave, here is the podcast with Scott Johnston.
You don’t need to work out 3+ hrs per day to make massive improvements in your Aerobic Threshold and Muscular Endurance.

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-hunt-backcountry-podcast/id1020880772?i=1000661670706

 

[P Carter]

I’ve read both books - training for the uphill athlete and training for the new alpinism.

Their plans are good, but need to be modified to suit your needs. I used the max vertical program from uphill athlete. I thought it was good, but it has to be “scaled” appropriately. In other words, the workouts are good and structured but the volume needs to be tailored to your goals. They are explicit about that - you can’t just follow an off-the-shelf plan or you’ll just get injured.

The buildings blocks are pretty simple: 8-12 week blocks of periodization; lots of volume in zone 2; one tailored muscular endurance training session per week in the last block; 2-3x per week of strength training.

If you read one of the books, get a plan, and modify the plan, it should be good. Lots of folks here follow the concepts and can help. (Or maybe “help.”)

The two authors and founders of uphill athlete, Scott Johnston and Steve house, recently split. Steve house now runs uphill athlete and Scott Johnston runs evoke endurance.

Scott Johnston was on the hunt backcountry podcast, and I think they are considering a hunting-specific plan, though I think their 24 week mountaineering plan (from UA or Evoke) would work just fine, with some tweaks.

Evoke endurance and uphill athlete both have podcasts; I think evoke is more training-based, whereas uphill athlete is more climbing based. Both are good.

 

[Dave_S]

@Dave_S

Dave, here is the podcast with Scott Johnston.
You don’t need to work out 3+ hrs per day to make massive improvements in your Aerobic Threshold and Muscular Endurance.

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-hunt-backcountry-podcast/id1020880772?i=1000661670706

Yep, this is the one I heard. I’ll have to give it another listen.


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[ResearchinStuff]

@Dave_S

Dave, here is the podcast with Scott Johnston.
You don’t need to work out 3+ hrs per day to make massive improvements in your Aerobic Threshold and Muscular Endurance.

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-hunt-backcountry-podcast/id1020880772?i=1000661670706

Agreed, you can improve a lot in way less time. However, if you follow the books programming exactly and have any baseline activity level, that's where you end up. Compound time interest on workouts in effect.

 

[B_Reynolds_AK]

Agreed, you can improve a lot in way less time. However, if you follow the books programming exactly and have any baseline activity level, that's where you end up. Compound time interest on workouts in effect.

Sure, I can see why you say that. You can take anything to the highest level and end up at a place that a recreational athlete/hunter cannot attain to.
Myself, I train nowhere near those type of hours, except on long backcountry skiing days of which number appx 50 a year, and can still climb at a rate of 3,000 ft per hour in steep terrain when mountain running and complete solo 10 day mountain hunts & maintain effectiveness throughout.
My point being that the Uphill Athlete/Evoke methods don’t need to be taken to World Cup athlete levels to be very useful for even the most dedicated mountain hunters.

 

[bpeay4]

This year I got my feet wet experiencing with some of the principles associated with uphill athlete and specifically what was mentioned in the Exo Podcast.

Instead of doing traditional higher heart rate cardio such as running or biking I switched to zone 2 training sessions at 1 hour long. I usually just hit the stair master and sometimes rucked at a slower pace. I also did my normal strength training.

I will say that I definitely noticed a difference this fall. I could hike uphill for longer periods without needing as many breaks. Inclines with heavy loads over longer distances were less fatiguing. The final days of my hunts I still had energy to get after it.

lots of info in the zone 2 thread

Zone 2 Training

I'm a little late to the Zone 2 training idea but have been trying to implement it this year. After listening to this Exo podcast, I realized I've definitely been more in Zone 3 and not spending enough hours on it. https://exomtngear.com/blogs/podcast/475 Anyone here doing a lot of Zone 2...

rokslide.com

 

[dreamingWest]

I was disappointed with the Uphill Athlete book. I was expecting much more organized thoughts and applications for normal working folks. No doubt the science is sound for performance in the mountains, but the book was not good. I'd recommend just using the free articles and podcasts they publish online.

For a much more concise and approachable read, I suggest Tactical Barbell (books 1 and 2). The methodology for cardio (and strength) is developed on a similar foundation as Uphill Athlete, but in my opinion is much more approachable for a guy like me (office job, wife and kids at home).

 

[P Carter]

I enjoyed the books - the concepts made sense to me, and once you understand the concepts, it's easier to scale up or down to fit the available time. But they are pretty dense.

The plan I used definitely had volume that wasn't realistic for me--for example, back-to-back 4-hour runs. Those would be great for a 100-mile race, but I wasn't able or willing to put in that much time. But once you understand the purpose of the workouts, and the tradeoffs in play, it's easy to scale the plan to hit your needs. For example, instead of two four-hour runs, I'd do a 3-hour run one day and a 2-hour weighted hike the next day, time permitting, or 2-hour run and 1-hour weighted hike, etc. etc. So perhaps not beginner-level, plug-and-play plans, but helpful.

The concept of consistent zone 2 sessions at as high a volume as practical (preferably 1 hr/day and one longer session perwork), with strength work and progressive muscular endurance workouts in blocks, has worked really well and can be scaled up and down depending on schedule. Nothing fancy, but very effective. The tough part is doing the work, not knowing what work to do.

 

[Poser]

Yeah, I don't think most people (non competitive athletes) are going to have the time or be able to handle the training volume as laid out in the book as a program. It will be interesting once Evoke releases their military programming because the focus on rucking heavier weight way be more relevant for hunting. As for what is prescribed, hunting will fall closer to mountaineering training than any other mountain sport.

As we are in ski season, I've been focusing on getting gym conditioning sessions in as much as possible. In terms of getting out and skinning, its all over the place depending on avalanche conditions. I did a 2,000 foot climb on a tour last weekend, but sometimes I go for weeks at a time without getting into the backcountry as conditions are just too dangerous and I'm not into the "mini golf" days where you lap a few hundred feet of powder on a 25 degree slope. I just as soon ride a chairlift on those days. On those weeks, I'll get 3 one hour conditioning sessions in the gym: rowing and box step ups. That seems to sustain me. My regular strength training is already 4.5-5 hours a week in the gym, so unless I'm actually getting out in the mountains, 8 hours of total training volume (not counting chairlift skiing -that's more skill development and fun than training) a week is all i'm going to get and 5 of that is easily strength training. That's just how life works and I'm already getting up at 4 am every day, so not really interested in fitting in more volume during the week.

 

[B_Reynolds_AK]

For the skiers/snowboarders here, skate skiing is a fantastic way to train when the snow & avy conditions are not conducive to backcountry use, if you have trails nearby.

 

[mtnbound]

I also don’t have that kind of time. I’m pretty experienced as far as programming for strength, but I really don’t know where to start as far as trying to program for cardio or endurance. I guess I’m hoping that following an established program would help with putting some intent into my training, as opposed to just sort of going for a run or hike and hoping for the best.


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I keep it pretty simple for both Aerobic and Anaerobic workouts. Typically, I do them on separate days from my strength days, but sometimes, I will combine a Strength workout and an Anaerobic workout. I build my workouts in 3-week blocks and repeat those workouts, trying to increase whatever metric I used but still staying within the goal of that workout.
Cardiac Output (Aerobic) Guidelines:
Duration: 30 - 60 minutes
Intenisty: Zone 2, 60-70% of MHR
Rest Interval: All work is done at a steady state for the entire duration. I may have short rest periods, but that's mainly time to move to different equipment or record data.
I hate doing straight, steady-state training, so I will build workouts like the ones below.

Week 1 EMOM 30 minutes, Week 2 EMOM 35minutes, Week 3 EMOM 40minutes
MINUTE 1: 50s Bike
MINUTE 2: 50s Step-ups
MINUTE 3: 50s Jumping Rope
MINUTE 4: 50s Jog
MINUTE 5: 50s Sled push

Run, Row, Bike: 4 x 25 calories each, increase by 5 calories each week or do 5x25, then 6x25

Run, Row, & Bike x 10 minutes each for week 1; add another Run, Row or Bike for weeks 2 and 3

 

[mtwarden]

Yeah 3+ hours/day is non-starter for most folks; a 3+ hour day/week is definitely something worth shooting for though. An hour -ish a day (or most days) in Zone 2 training is also worth shooting for.

The concepts outlined in Uphill Athlete are pretty solid imho, but really aren't geared for someone looking for a "quick fix". Aerobic endurance in my experience is measured in years, not weeks.

I've never officially used any of their programs, but my fitness "program" is built around the concepts from their books.

As mentioned above, there is a ton of free information on both websites delving into a lot of different subjects germane to the backcountry hunter.

 

[Poser]

For the skiers/snowboarders here, skate skiing is a fantastic way to train when the snow & avy conditions are not conducive to backcountry use, if you have trails nearby.

We have an area or 2 around here that are groomed for slate skiing, but it strikes me more as a golfing crowd. When I see people out skinning on multi use winter roads, it seems as if they are having a hard time with the ruts etc. I do sometimes just go skinning, but not near as often I should.

 

[B_Reynolds_AK]

We have an area or 2 around here that are groomed for slate skiing, but it strikes me more as a golfing crowd. When I see people out skinning on multi use winter roads, it seems as if they are having a hard time with the ruts etc. I do sometimes just go skinning, but not near as often I should.

Don’t let any stereotypes put you off. There’s no better mode of training in my mind for building your aerobic capacity than skate skiing.

 

[Dave_S]

I keep it pretty simple for both Aerobic and Anaerobic workouts. Typically, I do them on separate days from my strength days, but sometimes, I will combine a Strength workout and an Anaerobic workout. I build my workouts in 3-week blocks and repeat those workouts, trying to increase whatever metric I used but still staying within the goal of that workout.
Cardiac Output (Aerobic) Guidelines:
Duration: 30 - 60 minutes
Intenisty: Zone 2, 60-70% of MHR
Rest Interval: All work is done at a steady state for the entire duration. I may have short rest periods, but that's mainly time to move to different equipment or record data.
I hate doing straight, steady-state training, so I will build workouts like the ones below.

Week 1 EMOM 30 minutes, Week 2 EMOM 35minutes, Week 3 EMOM 40minutes
MINUTE 1: 50s Bike
MINUTE 2: 50s Step-ups
MINUTE 3: 50s Jumping Rope
MINUTE 4: 50s Jog
MINUTE 5: 50s Sled push

Run, Row, Bike: 4 x 25 calories each, increase by 5 calories each week or do 5x25, then 6x25

Run, Row, & Bike x 10 minutes each for week 1; add another Run, Row or Bike for weeks 2 and 3

I really like this idea of a zone 2 circuit. I’ll have to give that a a shot: boredom is a real thing sitting on a stationary bike.


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