Unpopular Opinion: I don't like Dave Ramsey

Not an unpopular opinion. Dave speaks to the lowest common denominator. His plan works for some but is definitely not a one size fits all or accurate in every aspect.

I was listening to him one day and he gave advice to someone that was in the same business that I am in the wrong advice. Not a little off, 100% wrong. He had no idea what he was talking about.
 
The mistake I made by believing what he said was gospel was, not investing from 2009-2014 to get out of debt and build an emergency fund.

Had I had The Money Guy plan, I would have at least been putting some into retirement, while accomplishing the other two goals. That compounding time out of the market likely cost me over $100k, and will only get higher as the years pass.

He’s certainly not on my everyday listen regimen anymore.
 
The mere fact that Ramsey still seems to think that a person can buy a reliable used car for $4,000 shows he's out of touch. Would be an interesting experiment on how many days of work were missed if every C suite level Ramsey Solution employee had to drive a $4,000 car for 6 months.

Kind of funny. My buddy just yesterday bought a 2005 Dodge Dakota crew cab with color match topper and small block V8 for $3,650, only had 135,000. No drips, or leaks, he drove it home from about 2 hours away, ran great he said.
So, maybe you can't find them everywhere, but $4k reliable vehicles are out there.
 
Kind of funny. My buddy just yesterday bought a 2005 Dodge Dakota crew cab with color match topper and small block V8 for $3,650, only had 135,000. No drips, or leaks, he drove it home from about 2 hours away, ran great he said.
So, maybe you can't find them everywhere, but $4k reliable vehicles are out there.


I have no doubt there are unicorns out there, but people are looking for 10-20k for Toyotas with 300k on them. I saw a 1982 Toyota diesel for sale for $6,500 this weekend.

And then if you do find a $4,000 vehicle that appears to be in good shape, its going to almost certainly be a private sale in which case you'll be lucky if the owner let's you take it to a mechanic for a pre purchase inspection and then there's the whole issue of trying to get the car to and from your mechanic while trying not to take a day off work.

A 2005 Dodge with only 135k is hard to come by, but the relatively low mileage leaves one to wonder how much 100k maintenance was done. Some people tend to forget that a certain amount of years will override maintenance due by mileage. A new set of tires alone would put this vehicle over budget not to mention spark plugs, transmission flush, differential fluids etc. Of course, the nice thing about a 2005, is that you can still DIY a number of maintenance issues with relative ease.
 
The mere fact that Ramsey still seems to think that a person can buy a reliable used car for $4,000 shows he's out of touch. Would be an interesting experiment on how many days of work were missed if every C suite level Ramsey Solution employee had to drive a $4,000 car for 6 months.
I remember talking to an older gentleman at my old job. We were talking about how expensive vehicles have gotten and how I wish I could replace my old pickup. He said "Yea, well your generation wants the best of everything. You just need to go find a good reliable pickup for $10,000." I looked at him and said "You mean I should go buy a 2001 Tundra, with 197,0000 on it? Because that is a $10,000 pickup in todays world."

Yes good deals can be found on vehicles but they are rare and cant be counted as the standard.
 
The other thread got me thinking and I'm just wondering if anyone else feels the same. I'm just stirring the pot a bit, but I love talking finances.

Anyone else here despise Dave Ramsey's advice for people with a handle on their finances? I can't imagine I'm the only guy, I'm sure it's an unpopular opinion but here are my main reasons.
1.) His early advice is good for people struggling, but he's snake oily to me when he talks about using only his endorsed local providers including financial planners (which have no fiduciary responsibility to their clients) or real estate agents. You think his trusted "partners" actually do anything other than pay his company for that certification? They end up getting paid more when they pick high commission funds (less money for you)
2.) He advises against ETF's even though they generally beat his mutual funds when you include fees all f-ing day.
3.) The way he treats people with different opinions of his is ridiculous. They're an idiot or a moron if they don't think his advice is gold.
4.) His opinion that essentially all debt is bad other than your personal home. I have a ton of mortgages on investment property that pay me every single month, couldn't purchase them without debt.
5.) You likely won't get 12% returns in the stock market, especially with his mutual fund ideas when you count fees.
6.) Credit cards are not evil, personal control is. I could take my family to Hawaii every year on credit card rewards just from my business on things I need to spend money on.

People who he's great for.
1.) People struggling with their finances.

He'd tear apart my portfolio, but my net worth would be about 30% of what it currently is if I would've went his route 4 years ago instead of buying my first rental. I'm a much bigger fan of the choose FI, biggerpockets, bogleheads, or mr money moustache train of thought.
I think you said it best but forget that his advice is to get people to the point you are at. Not, live like that once you do.


I k akin it to if you intend to let your money work for you, the parable of the master and three workers come to mind. To hide it away is wrong. To blow it is wrong. But, to grow it in a responsible way is what’s expected.


Money setting in a bank account offers little versus assets it can buy that add to your wealth. Jesus talks about this. So does Dave when you move past his 101 course. But, to have that opportunity you must have the money to do it. Getting your income freed up to work for you is his goal. And, it’s what’s expected from the provider who gave you those opportunity’s.

Do t miss the forest by only looking at the trees.
 
I am not a fan of either of them to be honest.

I shoot for being somewhere between the two.
Same here, I can appreciate some of what they both say, but ultimately they both are influencers that are disconnected from the reality that most of their followers/consumers face.
 
Ramsey is great for broke low IQ individuals and those who have a high enough income where they can use cash to buy assets and have no need or desire to double or triple their net worth.If I would have followed his advice at 20 instead of buying rental properties I would still be hunting out west 7 days a year instead of 50+
 
The other thread got me thinking and I'm just wondering if anyone else feels the same. I'm just stirring the pot a bit, but I love talking finances.

Anyone else here despise Dave Ramsey's advice for people with a handle on their finances? I can't imagine I'm the only guy, I'm sure it's an unpopular opinion but here are my main reasons.
1.) His early advice is good for people struggling, but he's snake oily to me when he talks about using only his endorsed local providers including financial planners (which have no fiduciary responsibility to their clients) or real estate agents. You think his trusted "partners" actually do anything other than pay his company for that certification? They end up getting paid more when they pick high commission funds (less money for you)
2.) He advises against ETF's even though they generally beat his mutual funds when you include fees all f-ing day.
3.) The way he treats people with different opinions of his is ridiculous. They're an idiot or a moron if they don't think his advice is gold.
4.) His opinion that essentially all debt is bad other than your personal home. I have a ton of mortgages on investment property that pay me every single month, couldn't purchase them without debt.
5.) You likely won't get 12% returns in the stock market, especially with his mutual fund ideas when you count fees.
6.) Credit cards are not evil, personal control is. I could take my family to Hawaii every year on credit card rewards just from my business on things I need to spend money on.

People who he's great for.
1.) People struggling with their finances.

He'd tear apart my portfolio, but my net worth would be about 30% of what it currently is if I would've went his route 4 years ago instead of buying my first rental. I'm a much bigger fan of the choose FI, biggerpockets, bogleheads, or mr money moustache train of thought.
1000% agree. He is an annoying boomer. His advice is for people who have 0 handle on finances. This advice would have been more appropriate during the 80’s when mortgage rates were 15-20%.
 
Interesting to see this thread reopen.

I haven't followed Ramsey's plan, and I don't need to, but he has a lot of wisdom. Call it "common sense", but wisdom a lot of people need to hear.

It is incredible the number of people who call in asking his advice on the most insane ideas ("I've got $20k in debt and only $5k in the bank but my cousin has a great opportunity breeding blind chihuahuas!") and they are the ones who REALLY need to hear a stern older gentleman tell them to get their head straight and pay off their car.
 
Ramsey is great for broke low IQ individuals and those who have a high enough income where they can use cash to buy assets and have no need or desire to double or triple their net worth.If I would have followed his advice at 20 instead of buying rental properties I would still be hunting out west 7 days a year instead of 50+
So you're ruining the odds by drawing multiple tags. Lol
 
Late to the party, but I used Ramseys life insurance brokerage when I decided to get a policy. I was dragged along for literally 4 months only to be denied due to "medical history."

For the record. At the time I was a 36 year old, not obese, perfectly healthy male, with no medical conditions and taking zero medications. I was mis diagnosed with a rare heart disease when I was 21. I have letters and documentation from the most prestigious cardiologists at John's Hopkins, explaining that there was a huge misdiagnosis of perfectly healthy males with this disease at then time I was diagnosed. The letters explained that there was nothing wrong with my heart and was completely normal and healthy.

I re applied with NY Life and was approved within 2 days after my physical.

Sent from my SM-G990U using Tapatalk
 
The other thread got me thinking and I'm just wondering if anyone else feels the same. I'm just stirring the pot a bit, but I love talking finances.

Anyone else here despise Dave Ramsey's advice for people with a handle on their finances? I can't imagine I'm the only guy, I'm sure it's an unpopular opinion but here are my main reasons.
.....

Agreed^

DARE I SAY IT........I've seen better financial advice on Rokslide vs Ramsey. grin

Overall, I think his advice is oversimplified and tailored to the lowest common denominator.

Ramsey's advice of, "No Debt" doesn't factor in a lot of things. DR makes some good points especially when it comes to 'No Credit Card Debt'....but thats about it.

He tailors his advice to an average working stiff that is not savvy about their investment options.

Mutual funds; are worse than ETFS- you pay taxes every year on the gains in a MF- not so in an ETF, you pay those gains when you sell which can be decades later while you earned money on the differential.

Real Estate Agents; work for one person; Themselves. They want the deal to go through as then they get paid. Of course there are some good ones that will work for their $$- but always remember your best interests don't align exactly with theirs.

Paying off a 3% mortgage is silly in most cases. You can not only make more money on that money...but also the deduction lowers your taxes.
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Agreed^

DARE I SAY IT........I've seen better financial advice on Rokslide vs Ramsey. grin

Overall, I think his advice is oversimplified and tailored to the lowest common denominator.

Ramsey's advice of, "No Debt" doesn't factor in a lot of things. DR makes some good points especially when it comes to 'No Credit Card Debt'....but thats about it.

He tailors his advice to an average working stiff that is not savvy about their investment options.

Mutual funds; are worse than ETFS- you pay taxes every year on the gains in a MF- not so in an ETF, you pay those gains when you sell which can be decades later while you earned money on the differential.

Real Estate Agents; work for one person; Themselves. They want the deal to go through as then they get paid. Of course there are some good ones that will work for their $$- but always remember your best interests don't align exactly with theirs.

Paying off a 3% mortgage is silly in most cases. You can not only make more money on that money...but also the deduction lowers your taxes.
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He's also a proponent of active management. That is a topic subject to a good bit of debate - but passive investments tend to do better over time (with very few exceptions). Plenty of scholarly research to support that view, and it's much less expensive.
 
Yeah, if you don't yet know that you shouldn't be buying something you cannot afford on a CC and paying 25% interest...

.....thats Ramseys target audience and it appears to be larger than I thought. <face palm>
 
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