Ultralight hunting: toward a coherent definition.

[djsmith46]

I will confess to having to open another browser with an online dictionary while reading some of Dave's work, but I see that as my shortcoming, not his.

This isn't your shortcoming. This was his intention. He acknowledges it by referring to his propensity towards "obfuscation"- to make something more difficult to understand. And his verbosity (wordiness).

 

[Tanner]

Funny stuff...

 

[DaveC]

I am also 100% serious at all times. 105% while on internet forums.

 

[5MilesBack]

This one was easy to peg. I am a "bottom line.......get to the point" kind of guy. I had a philosophy professor in college that I wanted to punch in the face every time I saw him. I didn't go to that class very often. Even understanding the words and meanings doesn't take away from the chaos and confusion, which doesn't help anybody.

 

[Tanner]

Nothing like a little philosophy and rhetoric to make hunting unnecessarily complicated. It's just not that hard.

 

[Poser]

Dave C: The Schopenhauer of Ultralight Hunting

 

[tipsntails7]

After reading, it's not a bad article, while I don't understand the Aron quote because by the end of it, It affirms Aron's comment in my eyes. He chose literally the lightest stuff he could and barely came in at 35 pounds, not including water.

It's also easy to see that this article fits with BPL much more then this forum. Hunters are salt of the earth guys who if they are highly educated don't feel the need to articulate themselves in that manor. I've got 2 degrees and don't consider myself a dummy by any means but there was a few times when I said "WTF is that word?".

The other piece of the puzzle that I think is missing from the article is hikers are always carrying everything on their back at all times. Now I understand hunting can be like this but in my experience most guys hike to a location, set up camp and hunt the surrounding area. If no game is spotted they pack up and move on. Weight penalties of certain items are not nearly as big a factor to hunters as section or thru hikers.

I've never been a guy to chase ounces and more times then not will choose comfort over weight. Hunting 5 miles away from anything is hard enough with out me worrying if my pad is 6oz too heavy.

 

[Take-a-knee]

This isn't a knock on DaveC whatsoever but I swear when I read the summary of the article I thought to myself, this sounds like the type of wordy papers I had to write for my rhetorical conventions class in college. Then in his last post he states he's a philosophy major and has a tendency towards obfuscation, which explains why I couldn't understand much of what he wrote; because this was his intention I love philosophy.

I like a good philosophical discussion as well. I also don't have any trouble reading DaveC's writing. I think he writes quite well. It do make a man think, maybe that is the real issue here for several.

 

[DaveC]

Dave C: The Schopenhauer of Ultralight Hunting

“Mitleid mit den Thieren hängt mit der Güte des Charakters so genau zusammen, daß man zuversichtlich behaupten darf, wer gegen Thiere grausam ist, könne kein guter Mensch seyn.”

 

[DaveC]

He chose literally the lightest stuff he could and barely came in at 35 pounds, not including water.

I could have cut 5-10 pounds with a smaller shelter, less durable clothing, less insulation redundancy, and a stove not optimized for cold weather. My guideline was what I'd take into the Bob in early November, by myself, without feeling like I'd be cutting corners.

Point well taken on the base camping dimension. That's my bias, as I prefer to carry everything and keep moving day to day, even if I only go five miles dawn to dusk.

 

[fillthefreezer]

i think i tip toe back and fourth with this. i try to buy the lightest, of each item necessary, and obsess about weight maybe more than is healthy, but at the end, i find to get truly UL, the mission becomes compromised. im not willing to have to seek a sheltered camp cus my shelter is 6oz. or find an area that isnt rocky because im only on foam. or have to sit out rain because my rain gear sucks. or go home because the weather is getting too bad.
most thru hikers seem to try to finish, and be done, even though they hike alot of sheltered areas, right as we're really getting going. im not saying it cant be done, just that in my experience, the trade off may not be worth it.
i need a pack capable of coming off the mountain at 130, 140, 150lbs.
(for reference, my base weight is around 30lbs for hunting)

 

[mfolch]

As a professor of philosophy and classics, I did not find his prose excessively obscurantist or prolix, but nor did I find the promised coherent definition--more an aspirational, architectonic framework, a set of metaprinciples for determining a science of ultralight hunting, which in philosophy would be designated as an epistemology, though one might reasonably contend that ultralight hunting should be categorized as an art not a science.

 

[airlocksniffer]

As a professor of philosophy and classics, I did not find his prose excessively obscurantist or prolix, but nor did I find the promised coherent definition--more an aspirational, architectonic framework, a set of metaprinciples for determining a science of ultralight hunting, which in philosophy would be designated as an epistemology, though one might reasonably contend that ultralight hunting should be categorized as an art not a science.

I don't understand a word you just said.

 

[mmw194287]

As a professor of philosophy and classics, I did not find his prose excessively obscurantist or prolix, but nor did I find the promised coherent definition--more an aspirational, architectonic framework, a set of metaprinciples for determining a science of ultralight hunting, which in philosophy would be designated as an epistemology, though one might reasonably contend that ultralight hunting should be categorized as an art not a science.

Now this is getting fun!

 

[Yellowknife]

Your move DaveC....

 

[Mike7]

Funny Yellowknife.

I have a read a few of Dave's posts/blog, and they are fun and interesting, even if not as concrete as his gear lists. I didn't read this particular article, but the requirements of the backcountry hunter's mission do clearly lead to a lot of different gear choices for me compared to summer backpacking.

I am not an ultralight backpacker, but I am typically lighter when going backpacking, and some clear gross hunting gear differences for me compared to backpacking include: the need for optics, tripod, a heavier backpack, heavier boots for walking steep hills off trail with a load, a foam sitting pad & clothing for staying warm while sitting in inclement weather while hunting, hunting weapon & rangefinder, a rain jacket capable of dealing with bushwacking, GPS for marking wallows and off trail navigation in the dark etc., food which requires less preparation when I leave early in the AM or return late in the dark & tired after hunting, a shelter which can be pitched over a deer bed on the side of a hill, kill kit supplies, and an extra large water bladder so I can live for days at a distance from a water.

 

[DaveC]

Your move DaveC....

Wovon man nicht sprechen kann, darüber muss man schweigen.

 

[Ryan Avery]

WTF is going on here. I know I am probably in the minority here. But I just like to kill shit. I am not overly fond of backpacking in the mountains to see the pretty trees. I backpack as means to kill more shit. That is redneck Philosophy!

 

[dotman]

Spot on Ryan!

 

[Take-a-knee]

WTF is going on here. I know I am probably in the minority here. But I just like to kill shit. I am not overly fond of backpacking in the mountains to see the pretty trees. I backpack as means to kill more shit. That is redneck Philosophy!

Right on, and that is why you'll most likely do a very chitty job on the "backpack" portion of your hunts. But you know what? That's okay. Hikers have an expression, "Hike your own hike".

When Spec Ops guys get tasked with a mission outside their own base of knowledge and those of their peers, they seek out a subject-matter expert, typically with zero military experience, to teach them that skill or skills. I guess everyone doesn't think like that.