Tuners’ how close is close enough? (People tuning for others)

[Bergy-Bowsmith]

Tuning the bow and fixing the shooter sounds great in theory, but in moments of stress a shooter will fall back to their most basic level of training/ability. I can take just about any bow and get it to shoot bullet holes by torquing the grip just the right way, but when an elk is screaming in my face, I'm going to revert to the grip I've developed over time. A bow is not perfectly tuned until the actual shooter can consistently produce perfect arrow flight. If the shooter has bad form/mechanics, you'll be chasing your tail tuning anyways.

I would not trust anyone to tune my bow for me – that's not a slight against you or anyone else – I made it a priority to learn how to tune because bowhunting is about the only thing I care about in this life. Luckily I had great mentors who stressed this.

As for the OP's question, I don't do any tuning unless I'm there with the person (for reasons stated above), but I guess if I had to ship one out, I'd get it bareshaft tuned and grouping broadheads for me and hope for the best. In a perfect world the owner would just need to make a few tiny adjustments.

Just my $0.02

I understand your opinion and you're entitled to it but like I mentioned before I proven this statement over a thousand times with a thousand plus different shooters, so I will have to respectfully disagree with you.

 

[Zac]

This is an interesting debate. There have been some credible shooters that have stated they never had to shim a cam in their life over the course of many years, and many bows. I personally almost always experience a left tear with almost any bow I set up. Except for Bowtech, that was a right for some reason. I wonder if it has something to do with draw length. I know the most common is around 28-28.5. I am thinking that maybe guys in that sweet spot can shoot the bow as is? and People on the other sides of the mods may have to adjust. Honestly I have no idea. I really wish I could just set the shaft down the middle and get it to behave, but that has never been the case for me.

 

[Ho5tile1]

I agree with jbels I’ve seen countless bows that are tuned at the shop and everything on that bow is in spec and square yet take it home and not even close to getting broadheads and field points to hit the same or even get a bullet hole in paper. I can also take a lot of bows and get a bullet hole if I tweak my grip but in the heat of the moment I’m grabbing that bow like I’ve always done. There is no way anyone will convince me that it’s better to tune someone else’s bow without them shooting. I’m sure the gentleman above has done it as I’m not gonna call this man a liar cause I have no idea. Be no different then setting up a race car everyone drives that machine different so I don’t think there is a one size or way that fits all. What feels good to me might not feel good to you that’s why we set things up for the individual.


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[BKM]

yes a bow is a machine that has a perfect tune tune. But throw in draw length (if it’s actually correct for the shooter) how you grip the bow (torque, high vs low grip) and even face pressure all effect how the arrow comes out of the bow and that perfect tune will be close but not perfect any longer

Most average hunters out there don’t even grip the bow the same every shot. Mechanical heads are popular for a reason

 

[Billy Goat]

I always wonder how many people who ship a bow to someone can really tell if it's tuned or not when it comes back.

 

[jbelz]

I always wonder how many people who ship a bow to someone can really tell if it's tuned or not when it comes back.

None. It's a tough argument to have on here because it's that guy's small business, but I suppose it's better to be the person who ships his bow off to be tuned than the person who dusts his bow off two days before the season opens and hits a pie plate at 20 yards.

 

[Billy Goat]

None. It's a tough argument to have on here because it's that guy's small business, but I suppose it's better to be the person who ships his bow off to be tuned than the person who dusts his bow off two days before the season opens and hits a pie plate at 20 yards.

I'm sure there's some that can tell.


There's guys who can shoot, and don't even know how to tie on a d-loop.



But many are just looking for a service so they don't need to do it, that's a lot of what I see. I don't feel like I'm doing them a service by just handing them a bow so they can lob arrows at stuff and wonder why they still miss/wound.

 

[Bergy-Bowsmith]

yes a bow is a machine that has a perfect tune tune. But throw in draw length (if it’s actually correct for the shooter) how you grip the bow (torque, high vs low grip) and even face pressure all effect how the arrow comes out of the bow and that perfect tune will be close but not perfect any longer

Most average hunters out there don’t even grip the bow the same every shot. Mechanical heads are popular for a reason

Hence tune the bow fix the shooter as mentioned previously.

 

[BKM]

Hence tune the bow fix the shooter as mentioned previously.

Did you do that with the thousands of bows you talked about? Not trying to be that guy but I don’t think you did

 

[Bergy-Bowsmith]

Did you do that with the thousands of bows you talked about? Not trying to be that guy but I don’t think you did

I actually did , I make sure to follow up with every single one of my customers and address any form issues they are having , I don't do this full time this is my side gig and all I care about is creating better bowhunters. In the mean time making a little money to pay for hunts. So yes I did. I've never had a single call back either.

 

[Zac]

I actually did , I make sure to follow up with every single one of my customers and address any form issues they are having , I don't do this full time this is my side gig and all I care about is creating better bowhunters. In the mean time making a little money to pay for hunts. So yes I did. I've never had a single call back either.

Dudley basically does the same thing for the people he builds for. Although many of them are probably celebrities that wouldn’t know a tuned bow if it hit them in the ass.

 

[BKM]

I actually did , I make sure to follow up with every single one of my customers and address any form issues they are having , I don't do this full time this is my side gig and all I care about is creating better bowhunters. In the mean time making a little money to pay for hunts. So yes I did. I've never had a single call back either.

That or great! It’s just so much the opposite of what most every shop does even though they claim great product/services. More people shooting better is good for the sport!

 

[Bergy-Bowsmith]

That or great! It’s just so much the opposite of what most every shop does even though they claim great product/services. More people shooting better is good for the sport!

I understand that that is the opposite of what most most shops do , most shops have bills to pay , I'm a service only shop with a few dealers set up for strings and stabilizers and sights that I really like and trust . No bows on the rack just service abd set up so that I can focus on bringing the very best service to every single one of my customers, all over the country .

I just have different priorities . I'm in this for the love of archery.

 

[5MilesBack]

What feels good to me might not feel good to you that’s why we set things up for the individual.

I always expected my daughters to be able to take my rifles and shoot them accurately the way I had them sighted. But that rarely happened. My thinking was.....you sight the gun and set it so the crosshairs hit the bullseye so it shouldn't matter who's shooting it. But for whatever reason, it's just not the same. Last year my daughter shot great groups, but just not in the center of the bullseye where I shot them with the same setup. I adjusted the scope to her shooting and then she was shooting bullseyes.

I think it's similar with a bow.....both for sighting and for tuning. When I'm bowhunting, I wear my thin camo jersey gloves. But I found that the arrow impacts are consistently about 3" off at 40 yards with gloves versus no gloves. That's a big difference. So several years ago I started sighting and tuning only with my gloves on, and only with the grip that I'm most likely to use while hunting. And yes, that grip is a little more "grippy" on the bow. But it's very consistent for me, whether I'm standing, kneeling, sitting, breathing hard, relaxed, amped up, or aiming around a tree. I sight and tune for what's most consistently repeatable, and forgiving......"for me". I can't control other shooter's grips or form, but I can tune their bows for them for their shooting.

 

[Luked]

For me i BH tune. I haven't shot through paper in a long time with multiple bows.
I get mine as close to centershot and level as possible with levels. Once there I start shooting FP to get a good sight in and once I am comfortable with that ill start shooting BH and FP. Microtune my rest to get both shooting the same spot and I'm done.
Might be wrong in a lot of peoples mind, and the OCD crowd. But for me its worked for years.
As long as my BH hit what I want at the max range I have I'm good to go.
I am a little different probably than most here as I don't mainly hunt out west and need a lot of long distance. I'm a Midwest guy and mainly a whitetail hunter that is in the timber all the time so long shots for me are different than probably most here.

 

[Ho5tile1]

Luked I’ve done that many times with my Hunting bows the only thing I may do differently is instead of moving the rest I move my cams unless it’s like just a click or 2 then I’m good with moving the rest but most times get everything level and square and it’s pretty darn close with FP and BH. I’m almost to the point I think paper is just a waist of time for me. I would still do it for someone else or adjust there bow based on there paper tares but for me most times a perfect bullet hole with a bare shaft does not always equal broadhead hitting with field points so I’m moving stuff anyways taking it out of “paper tune” per say.. so why bother. To each there own there are many ways to skin a cat for sure…


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[Beendare]

I'm sure there's some that can tell.
There's guys who can shoot, and don't even know how to tie on a d-loop.

Yeah, and on an Internet forum....we just don't know...

I've seen enough variation in my own tuning and shooting by just playing with my grip to know thats a critical factor.

Then we have shot angles in the field to consider; uphill, downhill, cross slope shots- these are factors that of course affect our grip and tune that we have to take into consideration and practice accordingly

 

[Beendare]

To expand on this thought;
Have you ever been to a 3D shoot when shooting uphill and downhill shots and the arrow is not doing what you thought it should? It's a bad time to find that out on a hunt.

I think it's the same with having someone else tune a bow- seems to me every bow I've owned, I have to "Get to Know it" at least a little bit.

Even having done the bowhunting thing for many decades...I still have to get to know my bows. I shot 3D last Friday- first time seriously shooting this year. So I was getting to know this bow again. It's a recurve but many of the same grip issues apply.

I found myself not applying the same grip and pressure on the steep downhill shots...shot a couple of them high. At first I thought I was overshooting or not bending at the waist- nope, the push and hand pressure on my grip was off.

My bet is; The guys that tune themselves...and shoot these 3 D courses are nodding their heads in agreement. It something we all have to get out there and do....not something someone else can do for you.

 

[GatorGar247]

I've helped several friends tune their bows.. you can only do so much if their form is crap.. I make sure they are in spec and usually just have them broadhead tune.. very few people can consistently shoot bareshafts.
I've had archery shops try to change my grip because we couldn't get a bow to tune.. The way I see it is that bow wasn't meant for me.. If 4 different brands shoot fine with one grip why should I change my grip to make one brand shoot.. like has been mentioned you will default to your original grip in the heat of the moment..