Tikka Performance Mountain Tactical replacement magazine wont accept 3.4" COAL Anybody have better success?

[steffen707]

It seems pike the saum would shine in a medium action like a tikka with a high bc bullet, not a lrx. Are you going to throat for something like the 180 class berg, sierra or eldm and hope you can tune the lrx(shouldn't be a problem they're relatively insensitive to jump)

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That's exactly the plan.

I have 145LRX, 168ABLR and 190Berger target hybrids on hand.

I think if I have the throat optimized for the 190Bergers, the 168ABLR and 145LRX can be seated deeper into the case if necessary to find their seating depth node. Barnes also already told me the 145LRX likes more jump, so I think I can get all 3 bullets to work with the SAUM and 3.4" magazine. I just couldn't do that with the 7RM and its 2.5" case neck length with the 3.3" mag.

I've already loaded up a dumby round of each bullet to measure the base to ogive with an expected jump to the lands/jam on the 7Rem Mag. Once I get my 7saum brass it'll be the same relationship to each other, just in a .465" shorter case.

I've calculated in a 7saum its about
190 Berger
COAL 3.138"
Base to ogive 2.344"

168ABLR
COAL 3.053"
Base to ogive 2.344"

145LRX
Coal 2.967
Base to ogive 2.304"

If you're interested I made a whole thread on this at https://forum.accurateshooter.com/t...llets-dumby-rounds-and-google-sheets.4053793/

 

[steffen707]

It seems pike the saum would shine in a medium action like a tikka with a high bc bullet, not a lrx. Are you going to throat for something like the 180 class berg, sierra or eldm and hope you can tune the lrx(shouldn't be a problem they're relatively insensitive to jump)

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Oh, i'm also interested in the Federal Terminal Ascent bullet which would fall around the 168ABLR base to ogive length I would assume. Can't find any of those bullets right now.

Let me also say i'm looking at taking a long range shooting course at Vortex Edge in June. Its an all day thing and need to have 150 consistent rounds for the day. I don't plan for this to be a PRS gun, or even see regular target shooting, except on this one day, but I can't justify building a gun just for this class.

I already asked Vortex and they said with the length of day and the cadence that I would be shooting, they're not worried about the 18" barrel heating up and causing mirage issues. They're more concerned about the suppressor, but still think it should be fine.

 

[JeffRaines]

This is why I went with the 300wsm and won’t go with anything “magnum” length in a Tikka.

They’re awesome rifles, and if you’re the kind of guy to load up “regular” projectiles or shoot factory you’ll be fine with anything Tikka puts out… but if you want to load long/heavy in a magnum, it’s gonna hold you back one way or another.

I think a 7saum Tikka would be awesome.

 

[steffen707]

This is why I went with the 300wsm and won’t go with anything “magnum” length in a Tikka.

They’re awesome rifles, and if you’re the kind of guy to load up “regular” projectiles or shoot factory you’ll be fine with anything Tikka puts out… but if you want to load long/heavy in a magnum, it’s gonna hold you back one way or another.

I think a 7saum Tikka would be awesome.

Yep, after all my searching it seems to come down to:

(Usable Mag length) MINUS (length of bullet that will protrude case) > Desired case length IT WORKS

7RM
3.34"(factory tikka mag)-1.138"(190berger) = 2.202 this is not greater than a 7RM case of 2.5" WON'T WORK.

7saum
3.34" - 1.138 = 2.202 which is greater than the 7saum case of 2.035" IT WORKS

300wsm
3.34"-1.138"=2.202 is greater than 2.1" of WSM case 2.1" IT WORKS

Thats why i started wondering about 7/300wsm (because i already bought the .284" barrel), but you either gotta neck up 270wsm or neck down 300wsm, and quality 270wsm or 300wsm brass is hard to find.
But as I posted above, it looks like you're only giving up 0-4% muzzle velocity in a 7saum which I can find brass for that doesn't need to be necked up/down or fire formed.

Nothing against the 300wsm, but I think 0.284 bullets have the best BC/weight range for the hunting I do. But then I go and F' it all up by wanting to use a 145 LRX, lol.

 

[steffen707]

One more thing I think i've learned, but have to test out:

wsm brass is wider than most and causes mag "log jams" in Long Action factory length Tikka magazines, BUT

the 300wsm Tikka mags are a touch wider and work with 7saum and wsm brass, BUT

the 300wsm Tikka mags have a spacer in them that doesn't allow you to use all 3.34" of magazine capacity,

The 2 solutions I saw,

1. Buy a mountain tactical magazine for factory bottom metal, or
2. Buy a Tikka wsm magazine, pull the follower/spacer out of it and swap in a LA tikka magazine follower.

I recently screwed up my tikka LA magazine by thinking I could notch it to get more COAL, long story doesn't work, BUT the follower and spring are ripe to throw into a Tikka wsm magazine to test out solution 2 above.

Solution 2 if it works, will be the best IMO, the factory magazine is so buttery smooth and protrudes the least out the bottom.

My Tikka wsm magazine is on its way from grabagun.com as we speak. like $38 shipped.

Also if you're starting with a WSM tikka action, you'll need to modify or replace the bolt stop (very easy to do), to get bolt to load full 3.34" cartridges and buy a Tikka LA magazine.

Best route is to start with a Tikka long action and buy a wsm magazine, swap followers, rebarrel, ready to rock(supposedly). I'll definitely post up results when its all done.

 

[Ucsdryder]

7saum feed in factory tikka mags

7saum has tons of extra space in the mag

7saum with 20” barrel gets me 2750fps using 64.2gr of h1000

Let me know if I can answer any questions having just gone through this build.

 

[steffen707]

7saum feed in factory tikka mags

7saum has tons of extra space in the mag

7saum with 20” barrel gets me 2750fps using 64.2gr of h1000

Let me know if I can answer any questions having just gone through this build.

Oh, so with 7saum you don't need to do the whole wsm mag modification?

What bullet are you launching at 2750 with the h1000?

 

[Ucsdryder]

Oh, so with 7saum you don't need to do the whole wsm mag modification?

What bullet are you launching at 2750 with the h1000?

Nope, put them in and shoot them!

180eld-m

 

[steffen707]

Nope, put them in and shoot them!

180eld-m

Any idea how fast a 145gr would leave your 20" barrel?

 

[steffen707]

Nope, put them in and shoot them!

180eld-m

Is that an elk in your profile picture? What bullet will you use for another elk hunt?

 

[Ucsdryder]

Is that an elk in your profile picture? What bullet will you use for another elk hunt?

Yeah I killed him with that 180. Also killed an antelope and a cow elk…all 3 pass throughs, bull and antelope made it 40-50 yards, cow was DRT with a neck shot.

Shot a deer and never found him, it appeared that I broke his front leg. Not sure if it was low in the leg or a hit in the shoulder that was a bullet failure. I would have loved to have found him to find out what happened with that shot but there was no blood and the last time I saw him he was moving out on 3 legs 300 yards from the spot I hit him.

 

[Ucsdryder]

Any idea how fast a 145gr would leave your 20" barrel?

No clue. My buddy is going to do load development for 143gr hammers this spring for a moose hunt.

RL26 seems to produce faster speeds but I hit pressure early with it.

A lot of people shoot h4350 with lighter bullets as well. With the heavies I think 26 or 1000 are the go to.

 

[steffen707]

Yeah I killed him with that 180. Also killed an antelope and a cow elk…all 3 pass throughs, bull and antelope made it 40-50 yards, cow was DRT with a neck shot.

Shot a deer and never found him, it appeared that I broke his front leg. Not sure if it was low in the leg or a hit in the shoulder that was a bullet failure. I would have loved to have found him to find out what happened with that shot but there was no blood and the last time I saw him he was moving out on 3 legs 300 yards from the spot I hit him.

isn't 180eldm a target bullet? don't you want the 180eldx?

 

[amassi]

Any idea how fast a 145gr would leave your 20" barrel?

I Had a 20" 7saum that shot 150 accubonds and ballistic tips at 3000fps with H4831sc. Your 18 should only lose 25-50fps.

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[steffen707]

I Had a 20" 7saum that shot 150 accubonds and ballistic tips at 3000fps with H4831sc. Your 18 should only lose 25-50fps.

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That would be perfect. Just what I'm looking for! Thanks @amassi

Now I just wonder if 1367ft/lbs from a monolithic bullet is adequate to shoot elk. The FPS is there at 500 yards for the LRX to open up I think.

 

[amassi]

That would be perfect. Just what I'm looking for! Thanks @amassi

Now I just wonder if 1367ft/lbs from a monolithic bullet is adequate to shoot elk. The FPS is there at 500 yards for the LRX to open up I think.

View attachment 364755

Energy is irrelevant; velocity is quite relevant especially for the lrx. 2000 fps will create a bullet with slightly larger than caliber mushroom. That being said if that mushroom goes through a vital organ the elk will die.
On the other hand any of those heavy rapid expansion 7mm options will be much more emphatic at stopping those systems.
I shoot the 145 lrx out of a 7mm weatherby at 3380 and it's worked great on a bunch of deer, bears and cow elk under 500 yards But will be resigned to use here in CA where required and traditional bullets getting the nod elsewhere

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[Ucsdryder]

isn't 180eldm a target bullet? don't you want the 180eldx?

Google “hunting with target bullets” and come back in 10 hours when you’re done reading all the topics. There’s a good one on here from last year that had 10+ pages.

They make a 175eldx.

 

[Mulyhuntr]

That's kinda where I'm at. I ve been using my tikka 308 so far and haven't had a chance to really shoot the 7 mag enough to tell. When the season is over, I plan on seeing what it can do. Even knowing that tikkas are considered "slower" than other barrels, I'd rather stack em in the same hole even if it means a little "slower" MVs. I have some 162 eldx's but wanted to try some 168 vld's, but again, no time with work and the rut coming up.

168 vlds had a huge jump in my gun at mag length and didn't shoot well. 168 classic hunters shoot lights out and aren't restricted by the magazine.

 

[sdupontjr]

168 vlds had a huge jump in my gun at mag length and didn't shoot well. 168 classic hunters shoot lights out and aren't restricted by the magazine.

 

[snowcamoman]

I love my Tikka 7SAUM. The Tikka's are perfect for long bullets in short, fat cases. They feed great out of factory Tikka mags as well in the Mountain Tactical bottom metal. I run 180EldM's and there is no chance of maxing out the mag length.

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