this will be unpopular i am sure

[Ryan Avery]

Now that I can agree with. I'm suprised they have not reopened bear baiting yet. And the only real way to make a dent in cougar population is using dogs. Regretably that seems to be being pushed out the door in nearly every state.

Thats the biggest issue. Just like Washington your state will never allow a wolf season, especially a trappping season. So to many bears, cougars, wolfs and Liberals! That doesn't sound promising if I'm an Oregon hunter.

 

[HellsCanyon]

Oregon is an innitiative petition state. anybody can bring legislation to the people and as such, baiting and dogs were voted out by the majority. ODFW has their hands tied and legislation will have to be passed to reinstate it. It's not going to happen in my lifetime.....

X2, Oregon will never bring back baiting or hound hunting.... Just ain't gonna happen. If you think that's a problem, good luck having ODFW putting a successful wolf hunt system in the works.

Even if they did a lottery draw for wolf tags, do you have any idea what the success rates will be on those tags?? Idaho has OTC tags that nearly every elk/deer hunter buys, this lots more eyes and rifles in the woods and the amount of wolves taken by boot hunters per wolf tags sold is RIDICULOUSLY low!!!

Mike

 

[squeekieslayer]

Is this a troll? Ask the hundreds of outfitters and guides working different jobs all fall because the elk are decimated. Your tune will change....

Joe

 

[Ray]

There was a grey wolf trapped in a coyote set in Curry county the winter of 1977/78. I wished I had kept the clipping from the paper. The trapper refused to tell ODFG where it was trapped at, just Curry county. So, wolves have been wandering around OR, all the way to Brookings on the far SW coast, for a while.

 

[OR Archer]

To think this state will ever have any sort of wolf management ie hunting in the future is purely a day dream. ODFW can't even manage the deer and elk properly let alone the predators with the lack of baiting and hound hunting. If they even proposed a wolf hunt they would be sued by all of the left wing anti hunting groups in this state to try and stop it. This of course would take years and thousands of dollars that ODFW doesn't have with a 32 million foreseeable budget shortfall over the next 3 years so they would just cave to them. Next step the antis in this state would take would to put wolf hunting to a vote just like they did with baiting and hounds and you can bet it would probably pass.

You are standing on a very slippery slope with what you are proposing. Once you start down that slope there's no climbing back up.

 

[5MilesBack]

Beware of the wolves in sheep's clothing. A common tactic to deceive, divide, and conquer.

 

[Grundy53]

Thats the biggest issue. Just like Washington your state will never allow a wolf season, especially a trappping season. So to many bears, cougars, wolfs and Liberals! That doesn't sound promising if I'm an Oregon hunter.

Agree 100%

 

[tipsntails7]

Is this a troll? Ask the hundreds of outfitters and guides working different jobs all fall because the elk are decimated. Your tune will change....

Joe

Do you have any actual proof or is this just something you herd? Because unless they were in the Lolo unit or Yellowstone decimation is the wrong word. Those two areas are the poster child for wolf hatred. It's funny that you talk about decimation and yet your own states elk numbers are up, with Montana even issuing cow elk tags in more units then ever before. Wildlife managment is not about maximizing hunter harvest. Yellowstone had around 19,000 elk in the early 1990's that was an unsustainable carrying capacity considering the average over 40ish years is 14000. They are at 12000 now. Hunters wolf propaganda is as bad as liberals and gun control. Facts are always traded for the fear of what might be.

Ryan you make a good point. It never occurred to me that oregon would not manage wolves properly, which could happen. Then that could have an adverse effect on ungulate population. Wolves themselves are not the problem. Improper managment of wolves are.

 

[tipsntails7]

To think this state will ever have any sort of wolf management ie hunting in the future is purely a day dream. ODFW can't even manage the deer and elk properly let alone the predators with the lack of baiting and hound hunting. If they even proposed a wolf hunt they would be sued by all of the left wing anti hunting groups in this state to try and stop it. This of course would take years and thousands of dollars that ODFW doesn't have with a 32 million foreseeable budget shortfall over the next 3 years so they would just cave to them. Next step the antis in this state would take would to put wolf hunting to a vote just like they did with baiting and hounds and you can bet it would probably pass.

You are standing on a very slippery slope with what you are proposing. Once you start down that slope there's no climbing back up.

OR, these are all also really good points as well. Seeing as how oregon has failed to manage bears and cougars properly it only seems reasonable that they would fall short on wolves as well. My outlook may slowly be changing on this topic. Although I still feel it's is the managment that is the problem and not the wolves themselves.

 

[realunlucky]

Wolves themselves are not the problem. Improper managment of wolves are.

In your opinion what states are properly managing them? Wolves have more damn rights than I do. When anti hunting groups support wolves with legislation and funding instead of jumping on board I ask what's the catch. Now that Oregon has recognized a wolf population it will have to follow the federal guidelines which of course will state they must be protected until they reach a substantial population. They will continue to deny that number until its court force and who in Oregon will push this? Your state is probably working on constitutional amendment for permanent protection for them right now.

 

[Olydog09]

Do you have any actual proof or is this just something you herd? Because unless they were in the Lolo unit or Yellowstone decimation is the wrong word. Those two areas are the poster child for wolf hatred. It's funny that you talk about decimation and yet your own states elk numbers are up, with Montana even issuing cow elk tags in more units then ever before. Wildlife managment is not about maximizing hunter harvest. Yellowstone had around 19,000 elk in the early 1990's that was an unsustainable carrying capacity considering the average over 40ish years is 14000. They are at 12000 now. Hunters wolf propaganda is as bad as liberals and gun control. Facts are always traded for the fear of what might be.

Ryan you make a good point. It never occurred to me that oregon would not manage wolves properly, which could happen. Then that could have an adverse effect on ungulate population. Wolves themselves are not the problem. Improper managment of wolves are.

Oregon will not manage the wolves properly. You have to have a plan in effect before the wolves. When you put these Canadian wolves into an area that has traditionally never had wolf predation the ungulates have no defense system. They were not born with it. It takes a few cycles for newborns to be wolf aware when they enter the world. I don't really mind the wolves in Idaho but it would have been much better if they were planted with a plan instead of an agenda. Now everything is reactive and the damage has been done.

 

[Hunt'nFish]

And if you believe that these two wolves just happened to "settle" in this area and "find" each other then I have some ocean front property in Kansas to sell you.

I totally agree, the bio's must think we're stupid.
I too have seen first hand the before & after of wolves coming into an area. It's hard to tell the population impact on game as tags keep going down and inaccurate ODFW game counts. But I can tell ya the hunting is a lot harder now. One of the main things I've noticed is wolves like easy, flat county to hunt. So do we, so they usually push the game off the ridge tops and down into the steep canyons. Game is not up on top like they used to be. And we have to work a lot harder as a result.
All I have to add is.... gut shoot, then slow death.
Hunt'nFish

 

[Roy68]

Here is evidence of state & federal mis-management of wolves as well on the Eastern Side of the US as well. Last month a US Federal Judge orders a halt to coyote hunting in 5 counties of North Carolina to protect a wolf population. Effectively increasing the upper tier predator population density _ Black Bears, Coyotes, Wolves. Regardless of wild extinction or not I'm of the opinion that this is a bad management as well and parallels the Western Coast States.

http://www.jdnews.com/in-other-news/us-judge-blocks-coyote-hunting-near-nc-red-wolves-1.319202

 

[LJ Buck]

The moose tags issued have dropped by 1/2 in WY since the wolf has taken off out here. HMMMMMM Wonder Why.

Had a yearling bull moose get abandoned this last fall and he made it all through the winter by himself and 3 weeks ago found him dead. Killed by a wolf, ass was eaten out.

A wolf was shot outside of Evanston WY this year. That’s only 20miles to the S to the Utah boarder and 5 miles to the west. These things will be all across the west, better get the mule deer and sheep hunting in now it will eventually fade away, maybe not in my life time but what about my kids and if they have kids?????

 

[Rizzy]

There is more or less a set prey base, so you will see a drop in lions, coyotes, and other predators in order to make room for wolves. Unless of course the ungulates are already above the carrying capacity in the area. I think some areas are managed to be above carrying capacity because it leads to more hunter success, these areas will go away maybe permanently in some instances.

Say good by to all the easy hunts. You will now need to be on the fringes of sheep and goat country and cover a ton of ground to consistently find game. This will be the case at least until the ungulates evolve to be able to deal with the wolves. Initially they don't know a wolf from a coyote and will not be overly concerned with the wolf, this is what leads to the initial slaughter. Keep in mind there is terrain a wolf just can't hunt effectively, so some areas they will not be able to take hold.

I would hate to see the Roosevelt's Elk qualify for ESA status over this, due to the initial population dump. The Anti's may be waiting for this, be prepared.

Oregon is a trapping state, so there is at least hope. Trapping is constantly getting attacked over there so it would be wise to support the local trapping association. Trapping is the only way to effectively manage predators, especially Wolves. It's working over here in Idaho in the areas I'm familiar with. On the other hand the states like Ca and Co that have permanently lost trapping are screwed, it's just a matter of time.

Wolves are hard to hunt and a great trophy. They are not going to go away, so accepting there presence and doing what you can to ensure the population is proactively managed is probably the best thing that can be done at this point. They shouldn't have been reintroduced in the first place, but they were, about 20 years ago now, so it's a mute point.

 

[Schleppy]

Wolves dont get much love in Wisconsin anymore. The DNR claims that they did not bring any wolves into the state they just started showing up with radio collars around the early 2000's because they were tracking the native wolves. We know better. The gray wolves that were showing up all over did very well on our thriving deer population and soon we had vast numbers of wolf packs and few deer. Now if you look at the deer counts as the DNR publishes them you will see that they still claim that deer are over their population goals. Well, not in the northwoods. Those deer are living around population centers and in the southern farmlands where wolves are quick to learn that eating cattle is easier than eating deer and then those packs are quietly euthanized by the USDA. The deer populations in the northwoods have been decimated and hunters are pulling the pin and going elsewhere. Farmland areas without wolves are now hunted heavily or were hunted heavily until all the hunters had to move south and competition then money entered into the picture. Now virtually all usable hunting land is under lease for deer hunting and only a few trophy bucks are taken off of land that holds hundreds of animals and boosts up the DNR's deer counts. Now in order to reduce our "out of control" deer herds multiple antlerless tags are issued in a carpet bombing approach and guess where these tags get used. They get used to kill off the few remaining deer on the public lands while the leased lands get a pass and so the problem gets worse. Now that there are no deer up north and the wolf populations are decreasing the DNR has begun to issue wolf tags so that they can claim a victory before the wolf poulations crash naturally or move on to eating livestock. I agree that the environment is a delicate balance and needs a few wolves, but it needs to be controlled and since we have been managing for deer and elk for the last 100 or so years releasing a pack of wolves in an area that they havent been for that long is the same as tossing a cigarette butt into the corner of a brushy draw on a windy day.

 

[NoWiser]

Tipsntails7,

I understand completely what you are talking about in your original post. My entire life has been spent hunting in Minnesota, where we have as many, or more wolves than the rest of the country combined. I remember going to college in Wisconsin when everybody was running around buying handguns to protect themselves from wolves. Heck, I've shared the woods with them since I could walk and never carry any more than my hunting weapon, whether that be a bow or a rifle.

The wolves do take a bit of a toll on the deer during the bad winters. But, if we get a couple mild winters in a row, the deer bounce right back. Right now they are hurting a bit with some nasty winters strung together. Everyone seems to blame everything on the wolves, without looking at other factors. For example, 10 years ago the northern part of the state was thick with deer after some warm winters. The DNR had very liberal bag limits for a couple years in a row and many people mowed down the deer, literally shooting as many as they could. The wolves were around then but nobody seemed to notice. Then, with lowered deer populations due to hunting, a couple hard winters hit and deer populations dropped even more. All of a sudden the sky is falling and the wolves are eating all of the deer!

I love hunting alongside wolves and wouldn't give it up for anything. I love listening to them howl when I'm sleeping or walking to my stand. I love hearing the pack communicating with the scout mid morning when they are reuniting for the day. I enjoy every chance I get to see them. I'm sure over the course of my life I'll shoot a few less deer because of wolves, but it's worth it to me.

And, yes, I enjoy wolf hunting, too, and took this 120 lb male during Minnesota's inaugural wolf season in 2012.

Long story short, you aren't alone in your opinion!

View attachment 16436

 

[AZ Vince]

Ryan you make a good point. It never occurred to me that oregon would not manage wolves properly, which could happen. Then that could have an adverse effect on ungulate population. Wolves themselves are not the problem. Improper managment of wolves are.

Only way to manage wolves in the lower 48 is to kill them all.

 

[tipsntails7]

Only way to manage wolves in the lower 48 is to kill them all.

This comment is exactly why I posted this thread in the first place. Closed mindedness is not the answer to a problem. A lot of guys on this thread have made really good comments and have swayed my way of thinking a bit. Comments like yours are uneducated and unrealistic. Killing off all apex predators can be just as detrimental as having way to many. Predators can be additive.

 

[AZ Vince]

This comment is exactly why I posted this thread in the first place. Closed mindedness is not the answer to a problem. A lot of guys on this thread have made really good comments and have swayed my way of thinking a bit. Comments like yours are uneducated and unrealistic. Killing off all apex predators can be just as detrimental as having way to many. Predators can be additive.

Having grown up with an agricultural background I will stand by my statement.
It was bad enough with bears, mountain lions, and coyotes but to add wolves to the mix is why I'm glad I'm no longer at the home ranch nor do I have to depend on it for a living. The best thing we ever did was poison the coyotes in the 1970's.