Taboo Topics of Discussion

[bozeman]

After reading this thread, I'm getting anxiety thinking about all the hunters in the woods with bows and guns who are medicating for various issues......

For those dealing with grief and loss of a loved one, yes, it can hit you hard (was there last year). I began to write.....wrote out my thoughts....it was quite calming.

 

[Yoder]

After reading this thread, I'm getting anxiety thinking about all the hunters in the woods with bows and guns who are medicating for various issues......

For those dealing with grief and loss of a loved one, yes, it can hit you hard (was there last year). I began to write.....wrote out my thoughts....it was quite calming.

That's why we murder all those animals.

 

[Jmort1754]

I used to be totally against anyhting to do with depression medication and any sort of pharma to help with my PTSD. I finally admitted I have a problem, I am just having a hard time taking any sort of meds to help.

I am one of those people who can't sleep quietly, I have tried, the quiet lets my thoughts run rampant, I got so used to sleeping on the flight line that without noise I freak out.

I tried the therapy route, I tried the beat myself into the ground route. I have tried certain medications I think the best thing for me is a combination of everything.

 

[CRJR45]

Wow , this hits home for me , the whole not talking about it because I'm a man thing . I have issues that are incurable or not treatable , IMO . I get depressed , but mostly I beat myself up over stuff I regret doing in my past , or just my past . Laying in bed at night they hit me like a punch , I actually flinch , the wife thinks it funny when I do it , but she doesn't understand why I do it . She has tried to get me to go to counseling for my depression , but I won't go , and I won't ever go . My troubles are mine , I own them .
I don't want to be happy from a pill .
I've watched my brother and friends take antidepressants become a totally different person , and not for the better . They forget the things they've done and become vapid and shallow , IMO .
I've dealt with my mind my whole life and I'm better now than ever . I never lose my temper and refuse to talk when I'm mad about something , I wait till I'm calm and can talk about it rationally . Plus , I know when I'm depressed and don't make any decisions when I am .

Funny though , how we automatically reply when greeting someone .
They say "How are you today ?" and your reply is automatic - "I'm good , how are you ?"

No one cares or wants to hear your troubles . If you replied "I'm thinking about suicide daily , thanks for asking " , they'd say "Well good luck with that" and keep walking .

This is not a cry for help or a poor poor me post , just that I have a different take on the topic and thought I'd share it . We all have troubles and we deal with it the best way we know how , or with what works .
Also , I don't mean to insult or demean anybody else's choices , what works for you is great .
In the words of Red Green , "Keep your stick on the ice and I'll be pulling for Ya"

 

[Fowl Play]

Wow , this hits home for me , the whole not talking about it because I'm a man thing . I have issues that are incurable or not treatable , IMO . I get depressed , but mostly I beat myself up over stuff I regret doing in my past , or just my past . Laying in bed at night they hit me like a punch , I actually flinch , the wife thinks it funny when I do it , but she doesn't understand why I do it . She has tried to get me to go to counseling for my depression , but I won't go , and I won't ever go . My troubles are mine , I own them .
I don't want to be happy from a pill .
I've watched my brother and friends take antidepressants become a totally different person , and not for the better . They forget the things they've done and become vapid and shallow , IMO .
I've dealt with my mind my whole life and I'm better now than ever . I never lose my temper and refuse to talk when I'm mad about something , I wait till I'm calm and can talk about it rationally . Plus , I know when I'm depressed and don't make any decisions when I am .

Funny though , how we automatically reply when greeting someone .
They say "How are you today ?" and your reply is automatic - "I'm good , how are you ?"

No one cares or wants to hear your troubles . If you replied "I'm thinking about suicide daily , thanks for asking " , they'd say "Well good luck with that" and keep walking .

This is not a cry for help or a poor poor me post , just that I have a different take on the topic and thought I'd share it . We all have troubles and we deal with it the best way we know how , or with what works .
Also , I don't mean to insult or demean anybody else's choices , what works for you is great .
In the words of Red Green , "Keep your stick on the ice and I'll be pulling for Ya"

I do the same still (dwelling on the past), but it’s much better than before after talking with someone. Easier said than implemented, but the past is the past… everyone makes mistakes or F’s up at some point. When you remember or focus on some item from your past — you are the only one thinking about it.

I have compassion for loved ones who have f’d up and tried to make it right. I don’t dwell on their mistakes. No one is thinking about your past mistakes, other than you. Have a little compassion for yourself.

 

[Dos Perros]

Cut yourself a deal. "I will forgive myself for my past if I also promise myself not to do that again."

Easier said than done, I'm sure, but maybe helpful?

 

[tkhuntsman]

Anxiety and Depression. It has always seemed that talking about this is "unmanly"...Well, who gives a crap, lets talk.
Do you have it?
What brings it on?
How do you deal with it?

I have neither but my wife and 2 of my 5 kids have pretty severe anxiety. It's tough for me sometimes to understand their thoughts process and why they are so emotional. I have found that the calmer and more understanding I am when I communicate with them the more I can convey logic and help resolve the situation.

 

[sbaker0029]

Wow , this hits home for me , the whole not talking about it because I'm a man thing . I have issues that are incurable or not treatable , IMO . I get depressed , but mostly I beat myself up over stuff I regret doing in my past , or just my past . Laying in bed at night they hit me like a punch , I actually flinch , the wife thinks it funny when I do it , but she doesn't understand why I do it . She has tried to get me to go to counseling for my depression , but I won't go , and I won't ever go . My troubles are mine , I own them .
I don't want to be happy from a pill .
I do the same still (dwelling on the past), but it’s much better than before after talking with someone. Easier said than implemented, but the past is the past… everyone makes mistakes or F’s up at some point. When you remember or focus on some item from your past — you are the only one thinking about it.

I do the same still (dwelling on the past), but it’s much better than before after talking with someone. Easier said than implemented, but the past is the past… everyone makes mistakes or F’s up at some point. When you remember or focus on some item from your past — you are the only one thinking about it.

When I work stretches of night shifts, sometimes the sleep deprivation gets the best of me and start to go back and think about everything in my life and life choices I should have made and things I should have done differently. I think about where i am and everything led me to that point where I don't want to be (sleep deprived and becoming depressed)

Best words of advice when starting to think on the past that's going to bring up bad feelings and let the depressed state start to take over is :
Don't should on yourself!
Say it out loud to yourself even. Silly when you first say it or think it but the deeper you think about it, it really makes sense. Stop shoulding on yourself.

Edit: yes that really does mean to should and not just an interesting way to not say shit

 

[mt terry d]

Not to trivialize the issue in any way ,and this even for those who don't suffer from anxiety or depression but simply regrets, I heard a line that I think is helpful for everyone:

The windshield is much larger than the rear view mirror because it's more important to look ahead to
where you're going than to look at where you've been.
And when you look back, just glance, don't stare.

Another line ( C S Lewis?): A man with no regrets has a conscience literally as wide as hell.

 

[Leverwalker]

Thank you for the thread, and to the many people coming forward to open up. Not an easy thing to do. PTSD, long history of severe depression, suicidality and anxiety. Nightly, violent nightmares I act out, though much better now than any time in the past. Not good, because among other things I'm a trained martial artist and I've had to isolate from my wife to ensure her safety, and take steps to prevent my own injury as I throw myself out of bed or lash out with objects nearby. Insomnia was severe....I learned it's no big surprise to dread sleep when this is the nightly show, so I was getting just a few hours for years. Any kind of loud sounds (or, more, probably sudden sounds - not necessarily just loud sounds) can send me through the roof, and conflict kicks up some pretty intense stuff. Radar is at constant code red for protectiveness to others I think might be in any kind of danger. This was the norm for years. It's nowhere near that any longer.

It took a lot of years, trying many things, through many providers - experimental stuff here locally, like Transmedial Magnetic Stimulation (TMS) and ketamine, none of which was very helpful in any long-term way. Finally found a good team of people between my neuro, pain doc, psychiatrist and ongoing work with a psychologist who specializes in PTSD. I also have a central nervous system condition that is permanent, so the cocktail of meds I work with has been a long road of tweaking to see what works, getting rid of what doesn't. I hate taking them and have tried to get off as many as I can, but with many of the ones that relate to my mental issues, it's been a dicey road to get off. I've learned to accept the intense, total body pain for what it is, which may sound weird, but the layer of "suffering" on top of the plain fact of constant pain can be learned to be dealt with.

I'm in a vastly better place than I was even a few years ago. For me, I count a strong family as central; finding a PTSD guy who is really skilled and whose approach goes "in" very lightly, which has yielded a far better approach than anything else I've done in close to 20 years - too often, yes, "buck up" I think is everywhere, and while resilience is a worthy goal, getting there isn't always a straight shot and in fact, working from that view can just drive things more to ground. Meditation, meaning nothing more than literally being "here" now in breath and body (I often do it when working out intensely - and especially in yoga at the end of any training day), realizing the past is gone and has no reality now. I do have meds for anxiety but find the total exhaustion of this level of training is something like a "tap" that drains anxiety spikes, even if it's only temporary.

I imagine like most if not all of us, I take a lot of comfort in wild places.

One of the greatest gifts my gp told me years ago - "what you have is frontier medicine. We just haven't caught up yet." For years I dealt with many doctors who either thought I was hysterical or malingering, etc. To be told by a skilled and compassionate doctor that medicine didn't have the answers, but we'd keep trying, meant the world to me at the time.

I hope you, and anyone else suffering with what many do in silence and shame, get the help you need. 62, and for the first years in decades, I look forward with reality, and hope, with a body that is fighting back.

 

[Stalker69]

I had a a bad bought of it a couple years back. I didn’t think I was ever going to make it out of that “ darkness”. I was living on 2 hours of sleep a night, just paced the house all night long. Didn’t have any sort of appetite, it was scary for a good while. They tried several “ drugs” both to help me sleep and to over come the anxiety. But they seemed to make it worse, some way worse. Eventually it got better, but man did it take a long time. I don’t take nothing for it, and still have small episodes but very very minor, comparatively, and have passed quickly. Mine I believe is brought on by knowing I have to speak in front of a group of people, or interviews, or just being in large crowds. I try and avoid any thing like that now. If you need to talk, I will try and help. It’s hell for sure, and seems like it will never end, but it will. Doctors help a lot of folks, and they say the meds take a while to “ work”, but DONT GIVE UP, ITS A FIGHT YOU NEED TO WIN. seriously if you need to talk, pm me.

 

[MallardSX2]

Just this summer I stopped being friends with my best friend of 35 years. Completely cut ties to him. Being friends with him was a one way street and he was very toxic. Took me a long time to admit that to myself but I feel like a new man now that I’m not his friend anymore.

Fight the good fight guys!

 

[grfox92]

I've suffered from anxiety and depression since I was 16 and found my father dead.

That incident and several other life altering accidents and situations shortly after have left me with what is called complex PTSD.

I can go 2 years feeling great and then out of no where for no good reason wake up with unexplainable anxiety that will plague me for weeks, to months to years.

2 times now, when I was 33 and 34 I had what I would consider a complete nervous breakdown. A few months of anxiety so bad that my legs would twitch when I was sitting still. While I never thought about actually killing myself, the anxiety was so intense and so overpowering that I daily had the thought that if this didn't go away the only answer would be to eventually die.

The problem with these bouts of anxiety is there is no root cause to them. So there is no issue to work through. I've been to therapy and all therapists agree that I am over and have come to terms with the tragic events from my past. But that doest fix the permanant damage done to my nervous system by PTSD.

I've been doing great with anxiety for several years now. I'm sure moving away from NY and the terrible people who inhabit that place has helped a ton. The depression is always pokes its head in and out of life. Luckily self awareness, hunting, exercise and being productive keeps that at bay.

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[Pramo]

I work in tech and talking with a co-worker this week on anxiety and depression for the average joe, not someone who went to war or had some unthinkable tragedy happen. How much of modern day anxiety is fueled by tech particularly your phone. Our thought is most brains have been rewired the last 15 years to need the constant feed of input and stimulation and it's just not healthy.

I am a very strong willed person that works out every day, doesn't drink, smoke, was D1 athlete, fancy job running IT and OPS at large company, all that junk. But I crave reaching for my phone to kill time when I should be letting my brain rest or I crave looking at emails/teams at night just to get mad. Quite a few of my developers are on sort of depression meds and battle anxiety and only one of them has a real reason he was raised in awful situations surrounded by drugs/booze and people going to jail and at one point homeless.

Growing up and now 45 most people didn't have the daily anxiety we see now. I rank social media and cell phones up near the top of life destroyers for mental health it's a drug that is highly addictive.

 

[Pro953]

I am glad to see so much discussion here. I think first off like many other health issues, mental health is not a one size fits all situation. Causes and symptoms are wide ranging. Due to this treatments cannot be a one size fits all.

The brain (while amazing) is just another organ. Just as you would not tell someone with type one diabetes to exercise and think positively to overcome insulin deficiency, someone who’s brain has a chronic serotonin deficiency needs medication to reach a point where lifestyle tools can make a impact.

But I do agree that medication is not “magic pill”. Medication is one management tool that you should use along with good lifestyle choices like exercise, stress reduction and community support be it religion or otherwise.

I just hope everyone understands it’s not a “suck it up and deal with it” situation. That is only a path to self destruction. Depending on your situation get help and learn the tools to manage your symptoms.

I am a middle aged, married with two kids, upper middle class guy with a fairly normal life. Untreated my life, family, career would more likely be in shambles. Do I like taking pills everyday, no. Do I like being alive and around to see my kids grow, yes. So it’s an easy choice for me.


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[tony]

30 plus years of fire department/ EMS and now a nurse. I know I have a little bit of something. What’s funny is with my background, I don’t know where to get help.
I screwed up a great relationship and that still affects me to this day over 6 years later.
My present GF says I have 2 emotions, “ nothing and anger.” I believe her.
I am not violent like I have never raised a hand to a woman. I can just be mean.

I did become a born again christian - saved and baptized about 6 years ago. It made a huge impact on me. And then i fell away from the church and the Lord. I have started back to church recently and have noticed a difference. Problem is present GF is not interested in attending or believing. I get it, it’s not for everyone.
I tell you, there are days I fell like I’m walking in a circle and bouncing off the corners.

 

[bohntr]

“I also think there are many people who are soft and lack resiliency.”

Yup!

 

[Fowl Play]

“I also think there are many people who are soft and lack resiliency.”

Yup!

There's also people who could be categorized as sociopaths, psychopaths, etc. Not everyone is wired the same.

Are there truly some people who make no effort to help themselves... yes. But not everyone going through this is "soft", and it's talk like this that puts us back. Some people have been through shit, some people have no good role models in their life to talk through shit with, some people have true medical issues, some people lack empathy, some others were maybe dealt a dose too much.

 

[Forestryguy]

30 plus years of fire department/ EMS and now a nurse. I know I have a little bit of something. What’s funny is with my background, I don’t know where to get help.
I screwed up a great relationship and that still affects me to this day over 6 years later.
My present GF says I have 2 emotions, “ nothing and anger.” I believe her.
I am not violent like I have never raised a hand to a woman. I can just be mean.

I did become a born again christian - saved and baptized about 6 years ago. It made a huge impact on me. And then i fell away from the church and the Lord. I have started back to church recently and have noticed a difference. Problem is present GF is not interested in attending or believing. I get it, it’s not for everyone.
I tell you, there are days I fell like I’m walking in a circle and bouncing off the corners.

Your employer has to have services to deal with work/life, mental issues by law. It should be posted where all the OSHA info is at or where HR posts info. IF they don't, especially in your line of work, I would be finding a new place to work. I have a similar work background and have always been told of the services that are available and encourage the new young people to use them, especially after their first call that involves a death or something that could be disturbing.

I have started my journey back to the God and Christ, I will not go to a church. I grew up with my father and grandfather as ministers/preachers. I saw more of the politics and back stabbing drama than I will deal with.

“I also think there are many people who are soft and lack resiliency.”

Yup!

Or maybe they have more resiliency than most, but at times (or longer period of times) have to work through the issues in their head. There are a multitude of issues that could keep a person from being able to work through issues also. It is not always just in their head. Could be environment, economic, lack of good support people.

 

[Steelhead]

For me in my 50's the following helps...doesn't solve it but helps.

Exercise, kettlebells, burpees as much as my failing joints will allow.
Clean diet (no refined sugars, low carb, high protein)
No booze,
regularly scheduled "fun", adventure, hunting, fishing, hiking in the woods, exploring. This is usually the hardest thing to make happen regularly as a husband and father.
Prayer, Psalm 55:22

As I'm learning more about myself and my freaking brain wiring, my "issues" in my youth and pondering what the hell was/is wrong with me. Landed on "Inattentive ADHD" classification recently and it lines up...and maybe a bit of asperger's or something.
Regardless of what you call it, at the end of the day I've been agitated and uncomfortable, struggled with social stuff...which all led to overall anxiety and depression.

In my teens and 20's my therapy was drinking a lot and fighting a lot because I was stupid, angry and drunk.

in my 30's it was drinking a lot, fighting and grinding away at my job no matter what the cost to support my family, in a really poorly matching career, commute, not making enough, round peg-square hole. Disaster and just put me over the deep end into anxiety and depression.

40's and beyond has been leaving the booze behind, trying to stay positive, prayer and struggling to stay away from the anxiety monster that haunts me and follows me in my day to day.
I tried Lexapro/medications for about a month but did not like the bland-ness, emotionless, blank-page it left me with. Loved the way it helped me sleep, but didn't resolve the mental health stuff to my liking.