Suppressed vs Non-Suppressed Hunting

[Robobiss]

Sheesh! Thanks for the lecture. What I said about “hearing protection” vs. “ear pro” was just a simple kidding around. Like I said, I’m
not in the cool kid club and will definitely stay in the nerd crowd. I’m a little ways over the 30-45 age group so that makes me exempt from using the “correct” slang terms. (laughing again cause it’s a joke).

Thanks for you service though. I definitely appreciate that.

Hahahaha, it’s all good! Strictly educational. Just a fun fact for the day. My 4 month old wasn’t letting me sleep so I had time to write a novel.

Yours isn’t the first post I’ve seen on here saying something similarly thinking it was some sort of an internet larper wannabe swat guy term or something. Just setting the record straight a little bit, because I use the term for good reason, and I’m not a larper .

Thanks man

 

[butcherboy]

Hahahaha, it’s all good! Strictly educational. Just a fun fact for the day. My 4 month old wasn’t letting me sleep so I had time to write a novel.

Yours isn’t the first post I’ve seen on here saying something similarly thinking it was some sort of an internet larper wannabe swat guy term or something. Just setting the record straight a little bit, because I use the term for good reason, and I’m not a larper .

Thanks man

I completely understand where you picked it up and why you use it. Good reason to keep using it. When I first heard ear pro used I really did think it was a new hearing protection (add nerd voice) device that I had to have and almost did a search for it!

 

[WTFJohn]

Nope. Impact velocity matters and that's all.

There is a nauseating thread all about it.

You missed the word accuracy in there as well, and the context. The passed-down gun knowledge from the generation of hunters before was longest barrel possible to get it moving as fast as possible and be accurate. Modern knowledge lets us know what calibers can do their work in a short barrel and still obtain the needed velocities for the bullet to preform, and we know that barrel length has jack and all to do with accuracy once the bullet is stabilized.

There is a large amount of data out there regarding muzzle brakes and the downsides to everyone around the shooter, here's a few quick links. Lots more if you look into it.

TBI & Shooting

TBI & Brakes

Muzzle Brake Sound Data

And just to sum up a lot of the thread again:

My kids are playing lots of sports, shooting is just a drop in the bucket on any chance of TBI/overpressure damage. Why would I try something that may make a difference for them? They are tough, and their ears are strong.

Anyone who uses a different term for hearing protection is dumb, no way they could know anything I don't.

If you have a suppressor or shoot more than me, you're an instagram larper or an adult playing with kids' toys.

On a more serious note, as someone in their late 30's with tinnitus and more concussions than I probably know about; suppressors make a difference. I spent lots of time in duck & goose blinds with ported chokes all around me and lots of time around rifles/pistols on the range. They make a legitimate difference in not aggravating my tinnitus or giving me ringing headaches.

If suppressors had been a thing for us growing up, there is a decent chance I don't have some of the hearing loss I do now. My dad, and the rest of his generation, all wear hearing aids now that help make up for the ranges of hearing he lost from a lifetime of shooting (he's also a suppressor convert, killed a bear this year with a suppressed .300WM).

 

[Slickhill]

Question from the new guy. For those who state they will never shoot anything unsuppressed, or hunt with anyone who does. Do you bird hunt? Do you own or shoot any classic rifles that aren’t suitable for a suppressor? Any revolvers? When you won’t hunt with anyone who doesn’t have a can on their rifle, “because I don’t want to get muzzle blasted” (real quote I saw in another thread here) do you always hunt right beside your hunting buddies where their rifle report might damage your hearing? Do you ever hunt with a muzzle loader?

I just see all this and more all the time in threads like this and it makes me wonder. I don’t really have a problem either way, you can shoot however you like as long as it’s safe. But if I refused to be in the same zip code as an unsuppressed firearm I would have to give up shooting and hunting with classic rifles either not suitable for threading or too valuable to do so. No more range days with classic S&W revolvers, even if they were possible to suppress I wouldn’t thread a 100 year old gun worth thousands of dollars to make it worth hundreds of dollars. No bird hunting since shotgun cans are huge and unwieldy and once again would require major mods to make them work. I also won’t demand that my dad, uncles, cousins, and friends I hunt with pony up and buy one or I won’t hunt with them, not my place to spend their money and we generally aren’t sitting side by side when one of us shoots anyway.

I use a suppressor a lot, I’ve shot hundreds of animals with it. It’s great and it has its place. But to say I would never again shoot without it would severely cut into the other ends of this hobby that I also enjoy.

 

[roadrunner]

You missed the word accuracy in there as well, and the context. The passed-down gun knowledge from the generation of hunters before was longest barrel possible to get it moving as fast as possible and be accurate. Modern knowledge lets us know what calibers can do their work in a short barrel and still obtain the needed velocities for the bullet to preform, and we know that barrel length has jack and all to do with accuracy once the bullet is stabilized.

There is a large amount of data out there regarding muzzle brakes and the downsides to everyone around the shooter, here's a few quick links. Lots more if you look into it.

TBI & Shooting

TBI & Brakes

Muzzle Brake Sound Data

And just to sum up a lot of the thread again:

My kids are playing lots of sports, shooting is just a drop in the bucket on any chance of TBI/overpressure damage. Why would I try something that may make a difference for them? They are tough, and their ears are strong.

Anyone who uses a different term for hearing protection is dumb, no way they could know anything I don't.

If you have a suppressor or shoot more than me, you're an instagram larper or an adult playing with kids' toys.

On a more serious note, as someone in their late 30's with tinnitus and more concussions than I probably know about; suppressors make a difference. I spent lots of time in duck & goose blinds with ported chokes all around me and lots of time around rifles/pistols on the range. They make a legitimate difference in not aggravating my tinnitus or giving me ringing headaches.

If suppressors had been a thing for us growing up, there is a decent chance I don't have some of the hearing loss I do now. My dad, and the rest of his generation, all wear hearing aids now that help make up for the ranges of hearing he lost from a lifetime of shooting (he's also a suppressor convert, killed a bear this year with a suppressed .300WM).

I didn't miss anything. The "great one" has pronounced (and made the decree into governing opinion) that the only thing that matters aside from high fragmenting boolets is impact velocity for terminal ballistics, aka, "wound channel".

 

[roundegg]

Suppressors save ears for hunters, guides, and everyone around them. Glad they’re becoming more common

 

[thinhorn_AK]

You guys crack me up - so worried about everyone’s ears. Lol

I dont care about anybody’s ears except my own.

 

[Marshfly]

My son’s rifle doesn’t have a brake so I’m not emotionally involved like a lot of the people here seem to be.


#1 you’re overstating the muzzle blast issue a lot. If you would just go shoot in the mountains instead of a public range under a metal roof, you’d see that a good brake doesn’t really increase blast at the shooter at all.

#2 A kid getting hammered by an unbraked rifle could potentially cause way my concussion than one with a brake that barely moves. A moderate caliber with a brake recoils like a 22.

#3 My kid does so much other concussive stuff (soccer, wrestling, mma, bike crashes, falling off playground equipment, skiing, somehow tripping over his own feet all the time)that shooting a braked rifle (WITH EAR PRO) would be the least of my concern.

Saying anyone who lets their kid shoot a braked rifle is brain dead is silly. Different things work for different people.

Human anatomy and muzzle blast isn't different for different people. It's the same. Inner ear concussion happens even with ear protection with muzzle brake use. The ear protection does zero for what I am talking about. The force travels through the bones of the skull. The skull doesn't even fully fuse together until adulthood. Children are especially at risk from this stuff.

This isn't conjecture or emotion. It's fact. Brakes are a very poor "solution" to recoil. The only reason they exist is because of the ridiculous suppressor laws in the United States. Had suppressors never been regulated, brakes would probably not even exist.

 

[Felix40]

Your links are to an article that says shooting an ar in an enclosed building and shooting a 50bmg are bad, and a forum thread where a bunch of guys say shooting a braked 50bmg is bad…..pretty sure we all knew that?

You missed the word accuracy in there as well, and the context. The passed-down gun knowledge from the generation of hunters before was longest barrel possible to get it moving as fast as possible and be accurate. Modern knowledge lets us know what calibers can do their work in a short barrel and still obtain the needed velocities for the bullet to preform, and we know that barrel length has jack and all to do with accuracy once the bullet is stabilized.

There is a large amount of data out there regarding muzzle brakes and the downsides to everyone around the shooter, here's a few quick links. Lots more if you look into it.

TBI & Shooting

TBI & Brakes

Muzzle Brake Sound Data

And just to sum up a lot of the thread again:

My kids are playing lots of sports, shooting is just a drop in the bucket on any chance of TBI/overpressure damage. Why would I try something that may make a difference for them? They are tough, and their ears are strong.

Anyone who uses a different term for hearing protection is dumb, no way they could know anything I don't.

If you have a suppressor or shoot more than me, you're an instagram larper or an adult playing with kids' toys.

On a more serious note, as someone in their late 30's with tinnitus and more concussions than I probably know about; suppressors make a difference. I spent lots of time in duck & goose blinds with ported chokes all around me and lots of time around rifles/pistols on the range. They make a legitimate difference in not aggravating my tinnitus or giving me ringing headaches.

If suppressors had been a thing for us growing up, there is a decent chance I don't have some of the hearing loss I do now. My dad, and the rest of his generation, all wear hearing aids now that help make up for the ranges of hearing he lost from a lifetime of shooting (he's also a suppressor convert, killed a bear this year with a suppressed .300WM).

 

[Fireflyfishing]

I’m amazed at the weight weenie movement in hunting…

 

[Felix40]

Human anatomy and muzzle blast isn't different for different people. It's the same. Inner ear concussion happens even with ear protection with muzzle brake use. The ear protection does zero for what I am talking about. The force travels through the bones of the skull. The skull doesn't even fully fuse together until adulthood. Children are especially at risk from this stuff.

This isn't conjecture or emotion. It's fact. Brakes are a very poor "solution" to recoil. The only reason they exist is because of the ridiculous suppressor laws in the United States. Had suppressors never been regulated, brakes would probably not even exist.

There’s infinite different combinations of rifles, calibers, brake design, so yeah, different things work better than others.

Can you provide evidence that a braked rifle causes more head trauma than a kid getting hammered by the recoil of an unbraked rifle? You can’t because it doesn’t exist.

We all agree that a suppressor is better for a kid to shoot but calling people names for using brakes is speaking in hyperboles based on emotion.

I guess all the parents who let their kids eat processed food, drink soda, and look at social media are brain dead too. Those things have actual data to show they do damage.

 

[young7.3]

Ill say i would have loved to have a supressor on my rifle this year when I shot my 6.5prc twice on my bull. Ears were ringing for two days!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[jrowl2282]

Just like most people I wish I had one years ago, but I will say I sure don't miss those ringing ears! Still use ear pro with all the other firearms but when it comes to kids/women/new shooters they all gravitate towards the suppressed stuff just because they're flat out not as intimidating to shoot. I think they're here to stay and believe it'll only continue to grow in popularity.

But yes definitely not for everyone and like most good things in life, that's fine. I'll enjoy them for myself haha. My only issue now is that I want one on every rifle

 

[TaperPin]

I dont care about anybody’s ears except my own.

Me to.

 

[mt terry d]

Suppressed or not it's always good practice to get the muzzle outside the cab.

 

[TaperPin]

You have unrealistic expectations for a suppressed rifle, and use that unobtainable strawman to justify not having one.

I just said the things you guys value aren’t as important to me, so I reject it based on my interests - that’s not a straw man.

 

[Marshfly]

There’s infinite different combinations of rifles, calibers, brake design, so yeah, different things work better than others.

Can you provide evidence that a braked rifle causes more head trauma than a kid getting hammered by the recoil of an unbraked rifle? You can’t because it doesn’t exist.

We all agree that a suppressor is better for a kid to shoot but calling people names for using brakes is speaking in hyperboles based on emotion.

I guess all the parents who let their kids eat processed food, drink soda, and look at social media are brain dead too. Those things have actual data to show they do damage.

Believe what you want. But there are actual studies about this. The data DOES exist. You just choose to ignore it because you want to be macho or something. The fact is that muzzle blast damages the brain. You are arbitrarily saying that less is OK but it's simply not. It's just less. Children are especially at risk due to the fact that their skulls are not fully formed.

Can Shooting Cause Brain Damage? The Science, the Bad News, and the Solution

Beyond hearing damage, are shooters and hunters susceptible to Traumatic Brain Injury (TBI)? We share the bad news, the science and the solution.

shwat.com

Protecting Warfighters from Blast Injury

Developing strong, pragmatic and principled national security and defense policies.

www.cnas.org

https://www.wsj.com/articles/weapons-training-likely-causes-brain-injury-in-troops-study-says-1525060860

Blast Force

Using Art to Reveal the Trauma of War

www.nationalgeographic.com

 

[roadrunner]

Believe what you want. But there are actual studies about this. The data DOES exist. You just choose to ignore it because you want to be macho or something. The fact is that muzzle blast damages the brain. You are arbitrarily saying that less is OK but it's simply not. It's just less. Children are especially at risk due to the fact that their skulls are not fully formed.

Can Shooting Cause Brain Damage? The Science, the Bad News, and the Solution

Beyond hearing damage, are shooters and hunters susceptible to Traumatic Brain Injury (TBI)? We share the bad news, the science and the solution.

shwat.com

Protecting Warfighters from Blast Injury

Developing strong, pragmatic and principled national security and defense policies.

www.cnas.org

https://www.wsj.com/articles/weapons-training-likely-causes-brain-injury-in-troops-study-says-1525060860

Blast Force

Using Art to Reveal the Trauma of War

www.nationalgeographic.com

Macho? Kind of like [making] kids play contact sports like football and hockey that can have the same effect?

Compressed air, also known as "sound", doesn't magically reroute once it leaves the barrel or brake to have the full impact on maxilla anatomy. You're only getting components of it.

Just as wave propagation can be used to enhance the affect, it can also be used to lessen it as well...

 

[Marshfly]

Macho? Kind of like [making] kids play contact sports like football and hockey that can have the same effect?

Compressed air, also known as "sound", doesn't magically reroute once it leaves the barrel or brake to have the full impact on maxilla anatomy. You're only getting components of it.

Just as wave propagation can be used to enhance the affect, it can also be used to lessen it as well...

My kids don't play those sports specifically due to the high concussion potential but nice try. Glad we can agree on that.

Lessen it... you mean like a suppressor. Exactly.

 

[roadrunner]

My kids don't play those sports specifically due to the high concussion potential but nice try. Glad we can agree on that.

Lessen it... you mean like a suppressor. Exactly.

You're the one that made the blanket "macho" statement, not me...