Sports Psychology/Mental toughness for kids?

[ODB]

Anyone had to help a teenager with mental toughness (for lack of a better phrase) relative to sports? My 16yo daughter is a great volleyball player but really struggles with what I will call “straight” coaching. If a coach raises their voice or makes the team run for whatever reason she just clams up, gets emotional and withdraws. This isn’t the case at home - from us, she takes criticism/advice well and we can talk through things just fine. But when it’s a coach - different story. I think part of it is she fears being taken out of the game if she underperforms and thinks that strong advice from the sideline during a game is a precursor to being pulled out and not instructive.

I figure plenty of guys here may have had similar experiences with kids and sports. I’d love to hear about anything you felt was helpful.

 

[gbflyer]

I don’t have daughters. I have coached a number of young ladies in MS wrestling. I’m no professional though.

My observations which may or may not be relevant. Women do not respond well to a militant coach. They cannot be bullshitted. They will recognize the slightest incompetence immediately. As a coach, If you direct a particular technique you’d better be ready to do it yourself, without hesitation or mistake. Also, they generally are more interested in the process than they are getting wins. They are much more technically capable than their male counterparts, at least in that particular age group, in my experience.

As a parent it’s hard to pull rank on a coach. Even harder if your athlete is a girl. The last thing you want to do as a parent is embarrass her. It might be worth considering a discreet conversation with the coach. He/she may have some tips for you. There are some awesome coaches out there.

 

[ODB]

They will recognize the slightest incompetence immediately. As a coach, If you direct a particular technique you’d better be ready to do it yourself, without hesitation or mistake. Also, they generally are more interested in the process than they are getting wins.

Spot on, mate. I didn’t mention either of these two things but both are the case with my kid. One of her hang ups with her school coach is she never, ever, demonstrates what she wants - just tells the kids what to do. This gains 0 respect (right or wrong) from my kid.

Her club coach, on the other hand, is VERY good at VB - it’s the loud, commanding voice from the sidelines that stops her.

Thanks for the comment - good stuff.

 

[roadrunner]

What's the purpose to coaching? Guiding others to perform at their best level. That takes talent and ability, not everyone has it.

A good coach will know what each player will respond to. The biggest mistakes a lot of coaches make is a one-size-fits-all approach. We all know the psyche of females is way different than males. During teenage years up to around 25 (sorry guys) males are dumber than a fencepost in certain ways. Females are just plain goofy, but at a different maturity level.

You don't coach girls the same way you do boys. Ever.

 

[gbflyer]

It’s a delicate process for sure. Self image and embarrassment is a huge thing at 16 for a young woman. Coaches generally don’t try to embarrass, yet often times young women take it that way. If a young woman feels singled out unreasonably, you’ll lose her. As volleyball is a team sport, a wise woman’s coach will not single out a player but address them as a team. Women are excellent team players.

Coaches come from all walks of life, an exceptional coach is rare. Just one can make all the difference in a persons life, just like an exceptional teacher. Many of them at a club level are quite good, and others suffer from trying to relive their own glory days through their athletes. This one is the most dangerous.

Again these examples may not apply at all. If I could tell your daughter one thing it would be to adapt a mindset that the coach is yelling at everyone not just her.

Good luck my friend. It’s a credit to you as a parent to recognize what’s going on. Good job!

 

[SuperDUECE22]

My 2cents

I'd say your daughters coach needs some coaching. Every successful coach out there is respected by its players, not always liked but RESPECTED. What makes good coaches ... GOOD is their ability to earn that respect from the players, the difficult part is that below average coaches don't know how to do this. The great coaches earn respect from their players in a multitude of ways, some from being their friend, some from being the drill sergeant, once they have the players respect them players will literally do anything their coach asks... whether it is yelled at them from the sidelines or whispered in their ear during a timeout.

 

[cjdewese]

Have you talked to your daughter about how she likes to be coached or had any conversations around this with her?

As others have said, coaching is a fine line between getting your players to do what you want and being able to tap into their mental capabilities to get that to happen. One size definitely doesn't fit all and taking that type of approach is lazy at best and will cause kids to lose interest or quit at worst.

If you have a good relationship with your daughter, which it sounds like you do, have a conversation with her, let her know what it looks like from your perspective and see how she feels about it all. After that conversation, have a private discussion with the coach and let him/her know you both are trying to accomplish the same thing. As a coach, having a parent come up and discuss your kids situation AFTER talking with your kid goes a lot further than just saying you want them to do things differently.

Coaching is hard, and even more difficult in todays day and age. Make sure it's a two way conversation be willing to listen and things will work themselves out.

 

[Dos Perros]

There are a lot of books on this topic. I've never raised teenagers and don't know yours so I'll refrain from giving an impersonal opinion on what YOU should do.

Coaches have varying styles, and even when the style is held constant the results (wins) can vary quite a bit just based on team chemistry, and individual chemistry with a particular coach. Obviously though, in this case, it's high school, and I hope wins are less important than some other things.

Kids are funny, being a parent is weird. I find myself trying to build confidence, or temper over-confidence, in the same kid on the same day. Just depends the situation.

If it were me and my kid, I'd tell them to get out there and try hard and risk making big spectacular mistakes, and then learn from them, and then of course no criticism is personal, everybody parent/coach/teammate wants them to be successful. I'd also remind them that the team is depending on them, needs them, to give their best effort always.

 

[ODB]

You guys are awesome. Great comment fellas.

Yes, we’ve talked to her about how she likes being coached and because she is a very logical/mathematically minded kid, she needs to know EXACTLY what to do different. For example she was told to block a certain way - she did what she thought the coach was asking, but he got on her for not doing what he asked. When she said “what do you want me to do?” He just repeated the same thing. Thus ensues a circle where she thinks she’s doing what he asks, he doesn’t think she is, and it’s a battle Royale - tears, frustration, the whole thing. She respects him as a coach, but without a specific instruction, she feels like he’s just yelling without guiding.

@gbflyer you are 100% correct on the glory days issue. Her school coach has said many times how she wants this and she wants that. How she went to state and how she won’t accept a loss. Very little encouragement of the team to grow and want it for themselves, but to do it for her. It’s ridiculous.

And don’t get me started on the end of year banquet where it was all “my kids” and flowers and roses in front of the parents.

 

[WCB]

You don't coach girls the same way you do boys. Ever.

100% not true. In general guys can be coached different than women. But from the female athletes that I hung around and grew up with and now my wife and her one sister who both played college soccer on scholarship...MOST of the high level performing female athletes I know have a very similar mindset as their high level male counterparts. Are there subtle differences sure but general the same.

So to say don't coach girls the same way you do boys is completely false. If my wife or her sister had a coach that coddled them or tried to be smooth about anything they would eat them up in a second. A coach that yelled at them and called them out was what they needed and what they wanted.

To the OP...as far as your daughter is concerned. She sounds mature enough to just have a conversation with the coach and before or after practice ask those question and ASK for demonstration. OR ask a teammate if they understand. I did this many times playing hockey in HS, Juniors in Canada, and College. IMO if your daughter good at communicating I would have her approach the coach (or assistant coach) and have that conversation and straight up state something like "I understand you want me to do xyz in a different manner I just don't understand that technique can you show me so I can work on it".

Also, if possible, try to communicate to her that if the coach keeps playing her after making mistakes and is getting on her a bit that is a GOOD thing. When I coach stops instruction or calling out a player and just pulls them after a mistake that is when as a player you should know your done.

Personally I never understood the parents getting involved in things like this when kids are older.

 

[ODB]

@WCB there are some girls on the team who respond to the more gruff coaching style, but most do not. My daughter is just ‘good’ at tough communication - her brain knows she can do it, her emotions show otherwise at times. I don’t pretend that there’s nothing she needs to work on personally, but the sports aspect I know has a slightly different dynamic than family/friend life.

As far as getting involved - understand, I have no intention of walking in and making demands of the coach. The entire intent is to give her tools she can use so she can manage this herself. She knows this as well - it’s just I need more wisdom from others who have been in similar situations.

 

[Scoot]

100% not true. In general guys can be coached different than women. But from the female athletes that I hung around and grew up with and now my wife and her one sister who both played college soccer on scholarship...MOST of the high level performing female athletes I know have a very similar mindset as their high level male counterparts. Are there subtle differences sure but general the same.

So to say don't coach girls the same way you do boys is completely false. If my wife or her sister had a coach that coddled them or tried to be smooth about anything they would eat them up in a second. A coach that yelled at them and called them out was what they needed and what they wanted.

To the OP...as far as your daughter is concerned. She sounds mature enough to just have a conversation with the coach and before or after practice ask those question and ASK for demonstration. OR ask a teammate if they understand. I did this many times playing hockey in HS, Juniors in Canada, and College. IMO if your daughter good at communicating I would have her approach the coach (or assistant coach) and have that conversation and straight up state something like "I understand you want me to do xyz in a different manner I just don't understand that technique can you show me so I can work on it".

Also, if possible, try to communicate to her that if the coach keeps playing her after making mistakes and is getting on her a bit that is a GOOD thing. When I coach stops instruction or calling out a player and just pulls them after a mistake that is when as a player you should know your done.

Personally I never understood the parents getting involved in things like this when kids are older.

My wife and I have both coached boys and girls and our perspective is very different than WCB's. I'd say his "100% not true" is about 40% correct! Honestly, I wouldn't say WCB is wrong, but I would say my (our) experience is very different than what he reported. No doubt much of what he said about the similarities between boys and girls is true- athletes are more similar than different across boys vs. girls, for sure. But to suggest the differences are extremely minimal or "nuanced" (man, I'm sick of that word) is incorrect. Yell at a group of boys and mostly you get a bunch of fired up boys who want to go out and work hard and prove you wrong. Yell at a group of girls and you mostly get a group of crying girls who think you're the devil and tell their parents how horrible you are. I've seen both play out a hundred times... No doubt there are a million exceptions to both, but speaking in generalities, boys ain't girls and girls ain't boys. Treat them the same and you won't fare well. JMO based on a good bit of experience.

Good luck with your daughter. Hopefully it will improve with time/maturity. Some kids are a lot like you described, but mature out of it with time and increased confidence.

 

[Customweld]

I went through this with my daughter. Tears and clamming up are signs of frustration. Mine has been a super athlete since she was young (not just a dad bragging) She has butted heads with one of her coaches for the last 2 years, to the point that she doesn't even want to play anymore. She could smell the bs from this coach from the beginning. This coach happened to be a female and asked the girls to do stuff that she wasn't physically able to do herself. She would holler at them to do it one way and not be able to physically show them exactly how she wanted it done. My daughter would get frustrated and either lash out or clam up. Her weight training coach (male) has the ability to make her shine. When her form is off, he is able to get down and show proper technique. Picking kids apart for bad form or technique, without being able to physically show them the proper way makes kids lose interest and respect real fast. Coaches, aren't always right and not all personalities mesh. If your kid has a good record (attitude and performance) prior to this coach, that usually gives you an idea of where the problem lies.

 

[ODB]

I went through this with my daughter. Tears and clamming up are signs of frustration. Mine has been a super athlete since she was young (not just a dad bragging) She has butted heads with one of her coaches for the last 2 years, to the point that she doesn't even want to play anymore. She could smell the bs from this coach from the beginning. This coach happened to be a female and asked the girls to do stuff that she wasn't physically able to do herself. She would holler at them to do it one way and not be able to physically show them exactly how she wanted it done. My daughter would get frustrated and either lash out or clam up. Her weight training coach (male) has the ability to make her shine. When her form is off, he is able to get down and show proper technique. Picking kids apart for bad form or technique, without being able to physically show them the proper way makes kids lose interest and respect real fast. Coaches, aren't always right and not all personalities mesh. If your kid has a good record (attitude and performance) prior to this coach, that usually gives you an idea of where the problem lies.

I swear it sounds like our kids are on the same team.

Any experience with coaches who love to run the kids to death and then wonder why they are exhausted during practice only to make them run again when they make mistakes? This coach has apparently even said during a game that they will pay for a bad performance at the next practice.

 

[PredatorSlayer]

Anyone had to help a teenager with mental toughness (for lack of a better phrase) relative to sports? My 16yo daughter is a great volleyball player but really struggles with what I will call “straight” coaching. If a coach raises their voice or makes the team run for whatever reason she just clams up, gets emotional and withdraws. This isn’t the case at home - from us, she takes criticism/advice well and we can talk through things just fine. But when it’s a coach - different story. I think part of it is she fears being taken out of the game if she underperforms and thinks that strong advice from the sideline during a game is a precursor to being pulled out and not instructive.

I figure plenty of guys here may have had similar experiences with kids and sports. I’d love to hear about anything you felt was helpful.

Yes - I coached my son’s sports until high school. I never went easy on him, and there are several moments that took me out of the running for father of the year. Now he is grinding it out with other coaches, some of whom have intense coaching styles. I forced him to watch youtube videos of coaches yelling at star players in different sports for different reasons. I also gave him the example of Bobby Knight ripping on Jordan for not setting screens in the 1984 olympics. Its helping them filter through it all and take away the constructive criticism. Got to develop thick skin, a short memory and let stuff roll off your back.

 

[ODB]

Yes - I coached my son’s sports until high school. I never went easy on him, and there are several moments that took me out of the running for father of the year. Now he is grinding it out with other coaches, some of whom have intense coaching styles. I forced him to watch youtube videos of coaches yelling at star players in different sports for different reasons. I also gave him the example of Bobby Knight ripping on Jordan for not setting screens in the 1984 olympics. Its helping them filter through it all and take away the constructive criticism. Got to develop thick skin, a short memory and let stuff roll off your back.

One of the kids on her team is the younger team’s coaches daughter. When he steps in occasionally to coach he is harder on his daughter than anyone else. My kid can’t understand how this girl just goes on about playing.

She wants to let it roll off her back - she’s just not dissociative enough yet to do so.

 

[roadrunner]

100% not true. In general guys can be coached different than women. But from the female athletes that I hung around and grew up with and now my wife and her one sister who both played college soccer on scholarship...MOST of the high level performing female athletes I know have a very similar mindset as their high level male counterparts. Are there subtle differences sure but general the same.

So to say don't coach girls the same way you do boys is completely false. If my wife or her sister had a coach that coddled them or tried to be smooth about anything they would eat them up in a second. A coach that yelled at them and called them out was what they needed and what they wanted.

To the OP...as far as your daughter is concerned. She sounds mature enough to just have a conversation with the coach and before or after practice ask those question and ASK for demonstration. OR ask a teammate if they understand. I did this many times playing hockey in HS, Juniors in Canada, and College. IMO if your daughter good at communicating I would have her approach the coach (or assistant coach) and have that conversation and straight up state something like "I understand you want me to do xyz in a different manner I just don't understand that technique can you show me so I can work on it".

Also, if possible, try to communicate to her that if the coach keeps playing her after making mistakes and is getting on her a bit that is a GOOD thing. When I coach stops instruction or calling out a player and just pulls them after a mistake that is when as a player you should know your done.

Personally I never understood the parents getting involved in things like this when kids are older.

No it's not 100% false and who said anything about coddling? Calling out players? Really

You sure it's 100% not true? I'm sure you have evidence to support that claim other than from a very limited anecdotal source, but I know 100% and beyond a shadow of doubt, woman are just flat out programmed differently than men are and when they want to be are more bad-ass than boys are at younger ages...

 

[Customweld]

I swear it sounds like our kids are on the same team.

Any experience with coaches who love to run the kids to death and then wonder why they are exhausted during practice only to make them run again when they make mistakes? This coach has apparently even said during a game that they will pay for a bad performance at the next practice.

I don't have much else to offer for ya. Teams succeed and fail together. However individuals have different personalities, strengths and weaknesses. A good coach knows how to criticize, praise and help each individual, based on these attributes. They have to know how to hitch the team up to the wagon and get each horse to perform at their optimum level. Kids will take an ass chewing from a coach if they respect them. A coach that is constantly on a tear very rarely has the respect of the kids.

 

[3forks]

You guys are awesome. Great comment fellas.

Yes, we’ve talked to her about how she likes being coached and because she is a very logical/mathematically minded kid, she needs to know EXACTLY what to do different. For example she was told to block a certain way - she did what she thought the coach was asking, but he got on her for not doing what he asked. When she said “what do you want me to do?” He just repeated the same thing. Thus ensues a circle where she thinks she’s doing what he asks, he doesn’t think she is, and it’s a battle Royale - tears, frustration, the whole thing. She respects him as a coach, but without a specific instruction, she feels like he’s just yelling without guiding.

@gbflyer you are 100% correct on the glory days issue. Her school coach has said many times how she wants this and she wants that. How she went to state and how she won’t accept a loss. Very little encouragement of the team to grow and want it for themselves, but to do it for her. It’s ridiculous.

And don’t get me started on the end of year banquet where it was all “my kids” and flowers and roses in front of the parents.

There‘s nothing worse than either a coach (or person in life) who can’t understand that if what they‘re saying doesn’t resonate, or isn’t understood by someone - then they need to explain themselves differently.

Someone saying the same thing over and over, but louder each time they repeat it until they’re finally yelling is and indication of a someone who doesn‘t understand how to communicate effectively.

 

[Dos Perros]

One of the kids on her team is the younger team’s coaches daughter. When he steps in occasionally to coach he is harder on his daughter than anyone else. My kid can’t understand how this girl just goes on about playing.

Speculation of course: it's because his daughter, as his daughter, knows he loves her and wants what's best for her. She trusts him. She doesn't take it personally. She probably has to listen to him all damn day at home, too, lol.