Seek Outside Tent + Stove = Cold?

[mtblackdog]

in

I like this idea! What candles do you use? Just the cheap tea light ones?

Amazon.com

 

[Ram94]

I have not personally used candle lanterns in a tent, but I would think it would make condensation issues worse being that water vapour is a byproduct of combustion and it wouldn’t be exhausted out the chimney like a stove.

 

[Pasty_Man_Thighs]

I’m by no means an expert but ran a very similar setup to you his year. First time being floorless myself. I was truck camping so a little extra gear.

Cimarron with a half nest and Large u turn stove for shelter. Sleep setup was tyvek, Matty mcmat face in the nest with a GoKot and Neotherm XLite on top of that. Running an Enlightened equipment 0 degree quilt.

Was up in the San Juan’s, around the same altitude, temps in high 60s during the day mid 20s at night.

First night woke up like you, cold and stove had gone out with lots of condensation in the tent. Did almost the exact same timing for starting the stove.

Second night my hunting partner gave me his small Mr Buddy heater to “preheat” the tent and I started a ripping hot fire. Right before I cashed it in for the night shut off the Mr Buddy and put a THICCC log in the fire box - zero condensation and was not cold the next morning. Slept through the night

Third day I made sure to leave the tent open to air out all day. I ditched the Mr Buddy. Put in my half liner on the other half of the tent, moved my tyvek onto the floor of the shelter that didn’t have the nest and started the stove around 7 and kept it rolling to get a good bed of coals before bed and really dry things out inside. Did the fat log again right as I turned in and tossed on my balaclava. Zero condensation and zero chill. Slept through the night.

I think really drying out the ground, getting the tyvek on the other half of the shelter, and getting that good coal bed going before tossing on the big log was Key to staying warm and keeping condensation down.

Play around with it and you’ll dial it in, for me getting the damper and airflow right was a pain at first but I got it dialed in and it worked out well.


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[BDRam16]

You pack in a mr buddy?

No, I was camping near the truck. I would have been fine without it though honestly. It was a comfort that I brought with that I ended up not needing all that much.

 

[mfllood3800]

I spend a good amount of time getting wood stacked and ready. Just when I think I have enough, I cut even more up. All the way from small starter slivers to bigger pieces. I try to have 3 piles. These floorless shelters are not built to hold heat, they are built to heat up quickly. So I understand It is on me to get it hot when needed.
I use a insulated synmat EXPED pad and it is awesome in all temps when combined with WM -5 bag.
I have woke up warm, but freezing outside the bag, and lit the stove and in 5 minutes it was noticeably warmer.

If your truck was that close that you walked to it and slept in it, you could've brought a lot of other options. When I truck camp, I bring a bigger air mattress, all night fake wood logs, extra sleeping bags and even a thicker floor pad for initial pad set up.

All this said, it is hard to beat a wall tent with a big stove, to have the best warmest set up.

 

[452b264]

About 20 years ago I backpacked in and cold camped at just under 9,000 ft. in a bivy sack/heavy reflective tarp for a lean to for a mule deer hunt in an area I had never hunted but I did scout the area prior to the hunt. It snowed about 6/7 inches for the first two days then it was bitter cold -10 to 28 degrees and I never was cold at night, but I had good clothes and a great sleeping bag. Killed an old heavy roman nosed but on the down side of life on day 5.

 

[Bighorner]

Like it was said. You are better to get comfortable then let the fire burn out, than to get a ripper going and get the tent hot. You will go so sleep comfortable, but you are probably about half out of your bag. When you wake up you are already chilled and will be until morning or you get the fire going and repeat the process. The idea of getting the tent 70 degrees before you go to sleep is asking for trouble.

 

[william schmaltz]

It sounds like you were near a pickup? Just run a propane stove. The smallest nuway stove is about the same cost as a titanium wood stove. Or I've used a Mr. Buddy in both my SO tent and AO tent without an issue. They typically vent just fine.

If I'm burring wood, the stove is just for taking the edge off in the evening and the morning. I'll fire it up for supper and maybe drying a few things and then it's burned out by the time I'm ready for bed. Then I load it up before bed so it's ready for me to reach my arm out of the fart sack to give it a match and get me going.

 

[Kevin_t]

Stoves are not meant to go overnight, but with wood prep and planning you can maintain heat at about a 2hr interval with loading, and log size.

Sounds like your pad was not warm enough, pretty common

Also, sometimes, people get a lot more chilled than they realize, be it from sun , wind, exertion and sweat . A bit of wipe the sweat off and make sure clothes are pretty dry go a long way. Some of it depends on the sleeping bag, some sleeping bags move moisture better than others.

A trick you can do is hot water in a Nalgene .. that will move the bag temp by as much as 40 degrees for a couple hours, often taking the chill off , which will allow blood to flow everywhere and possibly make you feel warmer. Cold face is another one, often times a buff or something similar can help a lot.

 

[Kevin Dill]

I've watched this thread with interest. Though I have a Ti wood stove in my shelter, I have never relied on it for sleeping comfort or warmth at night. I just came off a 12 day (Alaska) moose hunt and think I had the stove burning 3 times the entire trip. That's with some very cold frosty nights and a snowy ending, too. I recall learning many years ago about the futility of trying to keep a fire burning at night....so I don't. I also have never burned the stove in the morning hours when I wake up. I just get out of the bag and get dressed quickly. I don't have time or the will to attend a fire while getting ready to hunt. So all in all...my wood stove is a luxury mostly, but serves as a reliable heat source should I actually want or need it.

I relate the above to make a simple point. I think any man's bedroll should be capable of keeping him warm, dry and comfortable on the coldest nights expected without any supplemental heat needed. That's how I roll. Western Mountaineering Sequoia GTS bag, DownMat 9 insulated inflated pad, and LuxuryLite cot to keep me off the ground. I sleep in a layer of merino wool and always in wool sox. A beanie is mandatory and sometimes I'll wear thin gloves on very cold nights.

I basically always wake up to a well-frosted (inside) shelter but it doesn't affect me at all. I use liners to control condensate drip. I'm out and gone early. The inside is generally dry by midday and definitely dry by afternoon.

 

[Eric375]

Bummer. I was looking for the same setup for a similar trip

 

[Wally3o3]

Addressed the sleeping pad and sleeping bag. I haven’t tested it yet but I’m confident that I’ll have no problem getting some rest on the next outing.

Western Mountaineering bags are beyond legit!!! I went with the Bristlecone rated to -10 and the down fill is easily 3x of the Marmot bag I used… Can’t believe I haven’t heard of these bags before. Way more spacious and they pack down surprisingly small.

Also, I noticed a huge difference in the sleeping pads when comparing the Thermarest insulated pad against the Klymit insulated pad… Both market a R6-ish insulation value but you can hear the insulation pack inside the Thermarest as you inflate it… none of that going on with the Klymit pad. I see what others mean now about varying R value standards.

Hopefully this thread helps somebody avoid the mistakes I made on the first go round. Skimping on my the sleep system made for a rough trip and ended up costing more in the end…

Thanks again for all the input from the forum! There’s a lot of good info in this thread and I appreciate people taking the time to chime in. Cheers!

 

[Wiscgunner]

Testing gear in the yard can be an excellent lab environment before “real” trips . I run a Klymit SL pad and find it much warmer than the Klymit Stativ V insulated wide I use in the summer. Limited options for pads for me because I need a really wide pad to be comfortable throughout the night as a Flip-flopping side sleeper. One thing to keep in mind with inflatable pads is the side profile of a pad aids in cooling the air inside the pad. I use a Nemo Switchback pad in combo. Usually underneath the inflatable pad but if really cold it goes on top of the pad but my comfort if affected although MUCH warmer. As a compromise, I will wrap an emergency blanket over the airpad (weights nothing) with the foam pad underneath. Warmth is between Foam only under airpad and foam only on top of airpad but comfort is as nice as foam under the airpad. Moisture inside the tent also makes a huge difference in my experience. Like others have said, covering the majority of ground with a tarp helps keep the condensation down quite a bit. I use from Polycro sheets from Gossoner Gear. Ultra light, fairly durable and multifunctional. I keep the ground sheets in plate with shock cord looped over a stone in the corners out to my tent stakes. The same stone trick to can be used to run an inexpensive primaloft or down Costco quilt over a sleeping bag to increase warmth without buying a new bag. Shock cord just goes down under the pad and adds to the pad strap feature.

the ability to add a synthetic outer layer for better drying in wet conditions with a down main bag as body humidity will condense in the outer layer exposed to cold temps. Having the mousture condense in a synthetic later insteap of in the down, keeps the down warmer. Much cheaper than double bag systems but quite effective if cold/wet but stove drying not an option.

 

[Bluumoon]

Sounds like it’s a pad problem not a tent problem. Check the klymit R value vs the ASTM R value… I had a static v insulated that klymit said was 4.4 but astm said 1.7. I don’t trust klymits numbers.


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Last fall I spent 1 night in a Big Agnes zero degree bag on top of the orange insulated Klymit and a foam pad. Froze my ass off with temps in the teens. Retreated to the truck camp with better sleeping pads for the remainder of the hunt and didn't have issues. I have a seek tent and stove, but couldn't use the stove last year r/t the fire ban.

Tips suggested here were...get a better pad, if you carry a foam pad to sit on use that inside your sleeping bag too, fill a nalgene with boiling water and throw in your sleeping bag right before going to sleep.

 

[Seeknelk]

Its definitely your pad. Therma rest x therm is the warm one. Its still inflatable not a foam core self inflating like it seemed you thought. What new pad did you get. Also the sea to summit ether xt extreme is a 4 inch thick , super warm beast.

 

[akrdkill]

for cold weather I've found a good foam pad first then an air mattress, I've gone to exped as they seem more suited for cold & make sure your bag is good enough, i've gone to western mountaineering bags too....my wife doesnt need 1/2 the crap she used to bring to stay warm with this combo, it works for us