RokStok

[DangerRanger]

Keep in mind a CTR magazine/bottom metal isn't going to work with current rokstok inlets. You can get a SS 6.5 T3x lite for $722 vs roughly $1000 for a CTR and pay $100 to have it chopped/threaded, not have to worry about sourcing bottom metal/mag, and have a lighter rifle.

You could recoup some $ by selling CTR stock, bottom metal, and mag but since you didn't want to deal with getting it threaded i'd guess that might be a hassle as well.

I agree, personally the hassle of having it threaded doesn’t seem anymore than the hassle of selling off ctr and buying bottom metal you need.

Put barreled action in box, ship to gunsmiff

Easiest button is roughtech for both, but it’s gonna be a long boi

 

[wind gypsy]

Considering all the long standing stock manufacturers out there like McMillian, Manners, Grayboe, AG Composites, Alterra, Mesa Precision, et al, don’t these guys have professional engineers working for them? How did they not figure this out long ago? They’ve been around for years, yet where have they been? They just keep cranking out stocks with antiquated designs. All these years and it takes some dudes from an internet site with a bucket of bondo to make a gun stock that actually works as it should? I wonder if the big guys are embarrassed? Or in denial? Or disagreement? How did the “pros” drop the ball so badly?

Probably all or most of the above. Sad part is Gunwerks has shown the way and left the component stock market open for them to copy/capitalize for years.

That said, maybe there still isn't a huge market for it outside of rokslide? Based on comments here and elsewhere, quite a few people think they need a sloped toe to make proper elevation adjustments with a rear bag. Then there is the "I'm not a bench/prone shooter and need a rifle to point/shoot well offhand so I don't want a vertical grip" crowd.

The most frustrating absurdity for me has been their inability to make a grip to trigger distance that is better for most shooters.

 

[Stockys]

Cant tell if you are kidding. I really want this to be true though. Can we get a invoice visual or something? If it is true I have massive respect. I may steal this idea though…creating a new sku in our point of sale system for “asshole fee” as we speak…

Hope you paid it without a fight too.

 

[lak2004]

View attachment 651358

 

[jeremy.b]

Probably all or most of the above. Sad part is Gunwerks has shown the way and left the component stock market open for them to copy/capitalize for years.

That said, maybe there still isn't a huge market for it outside of rokslide? Based on comments here and elsewhere, quite a few people think they need a sloped toe to make proper elevation adjustments with a rear bag. Then there is the "I'm not a bench/prone shooter and need a rifle to point/shoot well offhand so I don't want a vertical grip" crowd.

The most frustrating absurdity for me has been their inability to make a grip to trigger distance that is better for most shooters.

Mini rant:

Form has touched on something worth noting: what percentage of the hunting population is even aware that things like proper recoil control, shot process etc even exist? Remember (or go read up on) the stories told about helping out at ranges prior to hunting season and how many examples of ignorance and/or laziness there were.

So indeed, the population here (and even at any of the other hunting forums etc) has to represent a very small portion of the overall population.

So with that in mind, the type of shooter that wants to be well informed is a small minority and is forced to contend with massive amounts of historical inertia in the world of shooting sports. To bring that home let's be honest and admit that a good percentage of THIS group struggled with the aesthetics of the rokstok initially (I did).

Another example, government red tape aside, how long has it taken for suppressors to gain momentum in the general shooting public? It sure seems like they have not really gained popularity until the last 5-10 years.

It's taken someone who works with people who's lives literally depend on proper function of a weapon system, along with willingness to push against the historical norm, to even open up the discussion on what should be different in this and other one areas of a weapon system.

So, all that to say, there is inertia, but innovation will come AND prove itself. It may take years but it wouldn't shock me at all if the design elements of the rokstok do work their way outside of this community.

 

[SDHNTR]

Probably all or most of the above. Sad part is Gunwerks has shown the way and left the component stock market open for them to copy/capitalize for years.

That said, maybe there still isn't a huge market for it outside of rokslide? Based on comments here and elsewhere, quite a few people think they need a sloped toe to make proper elevation adjustments with a rear bag. Then there is the "I'm not a bench/prone shooter and need a rifle to point/shoot well offhand so I don't want a vertical grip" crowd.

The most frustrating absurdity for me has been their inability to make a grip to trigger distance that is better for most shooters.

Yes. I can understand why Gunwerks component stocks have never been popular due to their outrageous cost! And now they aren’t available at all. But how could all those other engineers not know how to build a better stock? It’s baffling to me. Yes, I understand the toe line debate not everyone agrees with. Fine, I could live with that element alone. But it’s basic physics, that the fulcrum point of a butt stock should be higher, and the trigger reach should be shorter. I think everyone agrees on those two points. Crazy it’s taken this long.

 

[SDHNTR]

Mini rant:

Form has touched on something worth noting: what percentage of the hunting population is even aware that things like proper recoil control, shot process etc even exist? Remember (or go read up on) the stories told about helping out at ranges prior to hunting season and how many examples of ignorance and/or laziness there were.

So indeed, the population here (and even at any of the other hunting forums etc) has to represent a very small portion of the overall population.

So with that in mind, the type of shooter that wants to be well informed is a small minority and is forced to contend with massive amounts of historical inertia in the world of shooting sports. To bring that home let's be honest and admit that a good percentage of THIS group struggled with the aesthetics of the rokstok initially (I did).

Another example, government red tape aside, how long has it taken for suppressors to gain momentum in the general shooting public? It sure seems like they have not really gained popularity until the last 5-10 years.

It's taken someone who works with people who's lives literally depend on proper function of a weapon system, along with willingness to push against the historical norm, to even open up the discussion on what should be different in this and other one areas of a weapon system.

So, all that to say, there is inertia, but innovation will come AND prove itself. It may take years but it wouldn't shock me at all if the design elements of the rokstok do work their way outside of this community.

How many vehicle drivers are aware of the proper deployment of an airbag, or compressible foam in a bumper, or where the crumple zones are in a car, so one survives a crash. No one. We rely on smart vehicle engineers to design that stuff properly for us. That’s my point. Where have the engineers from these stock companies been all these years?

 

[Tartan]

View attachment 651358

my favorite part is that there is a qty of 2

 

[huntnful]

Probably all or most of the above. Sad part is Gunwerks has shown the way and left the component stock market open for them to copy/capitalize for years.

That said, maybe there still isn't a huge market for it outside of rokslide? Based on comments here and elsewhere, quite a few people think they need a sloped toe to make proper elevation adjustments with a rear bag. Then there is the "I'm not a bench/prone shooter and need a rifle to point/shoot well offhand so I don't want a vertical grip" crowd.

The most frustrating absurdity for me has been their inability to make a grip to trigger distance that is better for most shooters.

I too was/am (as I haven't tried any different yet) a sloped toe guy for proper elevation with rear bag.... until this season.

Both my buddy and I are avid long range shooters. We went into a backcountry hunt fully confident out to pretty long distances. Both of us shot our rifles at 1000 yards at the trailhead before packing it. Spot on.

BOTH OF US shot over the top of our bucks with our first shots on steep uphill angles. 600 & 800 yards. I am very confident at this point it was because of the sloped toe of the stock, and muzzle rise, accompanied and exacerbated by the steep upward shot. Eliminating, or at least managing, two of those components with this RokStok design is very intriguing me now. I look forward to testing the difference in the field.

 

[jeremy.b]

How many vehicle drivers are aware of the proper deployment of an airbag, or compressible foam in a bumper, or where the crumple zones are in a car, so one survives a crash. No one. We rely on smart vehicle engineers to design that stuff properly for us. That’s my point. Where have the engineers from these stock companies been all these years?

Making money designing products for a population of consumers, not for function (alone).

 

[wind gypsy]

I too was/am (as I haven't tried any different yet) a sloped toe guy for proper elevation with rear bag.... until this season.

Both my buddy and I are avid long range shooters. We went into a backcountry hunt fully confident out to pretty long distances. Both of us shot our rifles at 1000 yards at the trailhead before packing it. Spot on.

BOTH OF US shot over the top of our bucks with our first shots on steep uphill angles. 600 & 800 yards. I am very confident at this point it was because of the sloped toe of the stock, and muzzle rise, accompanied and exacerbated by the steep upward shot. Eliminating, or at least managing, two of those components with this RokStok design is very intriguing me now. I look forward to testing the difference in the field.

It's definitely convenient to use a wedge or other bag on a sloped toe to adjust elevation. I was more pickin on folks that insist it's the "proper way" or that they cant make fine adjustments without it. Cant pretend to say conclusively a slight toe has caused any issues, just that not having an angled toe is a very easy change to adjust to.

 

[huntnful]

It's definitely convenient to use a wedge or other bag on a sloped toe to adjust elevation. I was more pickin on folks that insist it's the "proper way" or that they cant make fine adjustments without it. Cant pretend to say conclusively a slight toe has caused any issues, just that not having an angled toe is a very easy change to adjust to.

Totally. Just use the bipod or whatever front rest you have for the adjustment. It isn't as convenient maybe, but you'll probably get just as efficient with it after enough time and practice.

I still have my main rifle bedded into an adjustable KS1 stock. And it'll stay that way until after lots of Rokstok testing. Change is hard for sure, but sitting on the side lines stuck in your ways potentially making no progress is worse.

 

[Stockys]

my favorite part is that there is a qty of 2

Jake's funding my gambling at SHOT this year.

 

[wind gypsy]

Totally. Just use the bipod or whatever front rest you have for the adjustment. It isn't as convenient maybe, but you'll probably get just as efficient with it after enough time and practice.

I still have my main rifle bedded into an adjustable KS1 stock. And it'll stay that way until after lots of Rokstok testing. Change is hard for sure, but sitting on the side lines stuck in your ways potentially making no progress is worse.

You dont even need to change the front rest. Just manipulate the rear bag to get the height you need. Looking at a pic of a KS1 it looks like a total of what, 1" total front to back elevation? Doubt most people use the whole length of it most of the time and less than an inch can usually be addressed easily with manipulating the bag. That inch gives you more operating range maybe without adjusting front rest height but I just don't think it's that big of a difference unless one must use a wedge in the rear.

 

[SDHNTR]

That KS1 stock is the best I've ever shot. And again, it's also unfortunately now largely unobtainable.

 

[huntnful]

You dont even need to change the front rest. Just manipulate the rear bag to get the height you need. Looking at a pic of a KS1 it looks like a total of what, 1" total front to back elevation? Doubt most people use the whole length of it most of the time and less than an inch can usually be addressed easily with manipulating the bag. That inch gives you more operating range maybe without adjusting front rest height but I just don't think it's that big of a difference unless one must use a wedge in the rear.

Excellent points for sure! Yeah the KS1 has a pretty moderate toe angle compared to other stocks for sure.

 

[Formidilosus]

Yes. I can understand why Gunwerks component stocks have never been popular due to their outrageous cost! And now they aren’t available at all. But how could all those other engineers not know how to build a better stock?

Because the people making/designing field stocks aren’t high level shooters with a calculating and experimental mind. The same is the same for the scope, rings, actions, etc., etc. Again- insert whatever stock company you want- how many pallets of ammo do they have in their shop? How much time and ammo is the person making the decisions on stock design shooting in all conditions and environments with performance in mind? How many shots at animals are they taking a year, and how many shots are they witnessing and then problem solving the issues?

I was apart of the “testing” for one of the most historically popular long range stocks. That “testing” consisted of less rounds on actual stocks before they went to market then I have on this milk jug, glued up, duct taped 3d printed stock.

Companies simply don’t do testing and evaluation that people believe they do.

 

[Formidilosus]

I am very confident at this point it was because of the sloped toe of the stock, and muzzle rise, accompanied and exacerbated by the steep upward shot angle.

Ding! Fries are done.

The rifle should do what I tell it to, not do something by some inherent design.

 

[Sled]

Cant tell if you are kidding. I really want this to be true though. Can we get a invoice visual or something? If it is true I have massive respect. I may steal this idea though…creating a new sku in our point of sale system for “asshole fee” as we speak…

Hope you paid it without a fight too.

I do that with my side business. We call it "rush job". We certainly find a way to do a rush job for good customers for less though.

 

[hereinaz]

Probably all or most of the above. Sad part is Gunwerks has shown the way and left the component stock market open for them to copy/capitalize for years.

That said, maybe there still isn't a huge market for it outside of rokslide? Based on comments here and elsewhere, quite a few people think they need a sloped toe to make proper elevation adjustments with a rear bag. Then there is the "I'm not a bench/prone shooter and need a rifle to point/shoot well offhand so I don't want a vertical grip" crowd.

The most frustrating absurdity for me has been their inability to make a grip to trigger distance that is better for most shooters.

I think the Rokstock is cool, and will work. I don’t know that I will upgrade stocks for the comb difference, which is the feature I like most. I will try some foam for a negative comb, but don’t know that I need the butt up higher given the way I shoot.

There isn’t a one size fits all.
Bodies and faces are all different.
There are different ways to shoot.
It’s a marginal improvement with the comb.
All the improvements don’t matter for lots of shooters.
Most shooters are idiots.

Rokslide does attract shooters who really care about improvements.

Form is engaging in a philosophy of use that is right for a lot of shooters. And, if people listen they can improve a lot. I have.

Even the Rokstock had to go through modifications and the comb got cut down by half inch during development to accommodate others.