Reliable stone sheep pricing

[Grisha]

So checking around on stone sheep hunts in bc - pricing seems absurdly high: under 6 figures but getting there. What is the consensus on what is happening? Is it really going to be almost 3x an Alaska dall sheep hunt to chase after stones?

 

[Mykolaivka887]

I believe Canada is a capitalist country. If people will pay whatever price, for whatever, why not go as high as possible? Wild sheep are a rare commodity, especially in North America. Sky's the limit when it comes to pricing sheep hunts on this continent, because people obviously will pay whatever price that sheep hunts can and will skyrocket to.

There's nothing "fair" about a capitalist society. Socialism however, lowers the bar for everyone and consequently, lowers the value of living. This is what's wrong with America today, but more and more young people believe that equality, acceptance, diversity and "fairness" trumps capitalism, the work ethic toward an achievement, and the better quality of life that capitalism offers. Their reasoning is; "it isn't fair!".

 

[wyosteve]

Demand exceeds supply so price will climb until demand dwindles!

 

[HornPorn]

I talked to an outfitter in BC the other day. He is charging in the upper 60s to book right now, but he did sell a hunt to someone at a show recently for $100K. Can't fault him for that. Outfitters are running a business, not saving the manatees.

 

[AZ_Hunter_2000]

If the cost will have little to no effect on your life and retirement, then go for it. Otherwise folks would be better served saying “no” and find something else.


While I’m fortunate to be able to afford a lot in life, I have zero desire to be stuck eating pet food during retirement while admiring my ego-stroking mounts.

 

[Grisha]

Ok I get how capitalism works (though I think its generally a disaster), I guess my question is what is the normative pricing these days and are there quality outfitters who are still in the 60k range?

 

[SDHNTR]

Yes, and it’s only going to get worse. With the broken nature of the draw system, I know many very wealthy hunters, who have given up and resigned themselves to just buy tags/hunts. No matter the cost. It’s yet another ripple effect of the you tube how-to’s de -mystifying western hunting.

I was looking at brown bear hunts yesterday, and that cost has more than doubled since I last went in 2019. Some of those hunts are knocking on the door of $40,000!

 

[AZ_Hunter_2000]

Quick search:

Book Your Hunt: $75000
World Wide Trophy Adventures: “from $60000” through “from $95000”

 

[t_carlson]

I believe Canada is a capitalist country. If people will pay whatever price, for whatever, why not go as high as possible? Wild sheep are a rare commodity, especially in North America. Sky's the limit when it comes to pricing sheep hunts on this continent, because people obviously will pay whatever price that sheep hunts can and will skyrocket to.

There's nothing "fair" about a capitalist society. Socialism however, lowers the bar for everyone and consequently, lowers the value of living. This is what's wrong with America today, but more and more young people believe that equality, acceptance, diversity and "fairness" trumps capitalism, the work ethic toward an achievement, and the better quality of life that capitalism offers. Their reasoning is; "it isn't fair!".

Not sure why you felt the need to spin off into an anti-socialist diatribe in response to his question, but ok.

One of the tenants of capitalism is supply and demand. The boomers are the largest and wealthiest generation. They're buying lots of those bucket list hunts now before they get too old.

Wait until social security collapses. Wait until the boomer start having to sell of their 2nd or 3rd homes and downsize the ones they are in.

I've only been on this earth for 38 years, but longer I'm here, the more I'm certain that EVERYTHING changes in ways we didn't anticipate a decade earlier.

I'm planning on hunting lots of sheep in my 50's (that is, if we're not destroyed by a civil war or WWIII first).

 

[alexanderg23]

Not sure why you felt the need to spin off into an anti-socialist diatribe in response to his question, but ok.

One of the tenants of capitalism is supply and demand. The boomers are the largest and wealthiest generation. They're buying lots of those bucket list hunts now before they get too old.

Wait until social security collapses. Wait until the boomer start having to sell of their 2nd or 3rd homes and downsize the ones they are in.

I've only been on this earth for 38 years, but longer I'm here, the more I'm certain that EVERYTHING changes in ways we didn't anticipate a decade earlier.

I'm planning on hunting lots of sheep in my 50's (that is, if we're not destroyed by a civil war or WWIII first).

Bro. If WW3 breaks out 1st thing I’m doing is sheep hunting. Any Ram

 

[cbeard64]

It’s just basic supply and demand.

Anyone counting on the price going down is in for a rude awakening IMO.

I’m pushing 60 and I can count on one hand the things that have gone down in relative cost over the years. And that’s only because they learned to make more of them faster and cheaper.

I’m pretty sure sheep hunting isn’t going to join that list.

 

[HornPorn]

I guess my question is what is the normative pricing these days and are there quality outfitters who are still in the 60k range?

This may sound harsh, and please don't take this personally, because anytime anyone on here posts a question asking how much a sheep hunt is I think the same thing as I do right now.......If you were serious about going on a stone hunt, you would already know the answers to these questions because you would be calling different outfitters in BC and talking to them. It's not a mystery who the quality outfitters are.....they are all over this and other forums, and also easily found in the back of Wild Sheep magazine.

And if you are not serious, then you are only asking for this information to put some negative light on it or tear down people who are paying for it, or to perhaps reinforce your lack of participation as somehow being "smarter" than the people who are paying for these hunts. It's really none of your business what they cost. That's between an outfitter and his client at the time of booking. Even clients booked with the same outfitter should not be comparing notes on what they paid to book. It is bad form.

The outfitter I mentioned above is a top, well known outfitter, but I'm not going to say who it is, so don't bother PMing me about it. Do your own due diligence if you are serious about it.

 

[Mykolaivka887]

It’s just basic supply and demand.

Anyone counting on the price going down is in for a rude awakening IMO.

I’m pretty sure sheep hunting isn’t going to join that list.

Agreed. Sheep hunting in North America, or possibly anywhere else for that matter, save for maybe Far East Russia, is definitely not going to become less expensive. Ain't happenin'.

 

[Mykolaivka887]

Not sure why you felt the need to spin off into an anti-socialist diatribe in response to his question, but ok.

Well, not to derail this thread, but socialism sucks, compared to capitalism. I've seen it and lived it firsthand, outside the United States.

Unfortunately, the entitlement mindset of today's American youth, and a portion of middle-aged Americans that favor being subsidized and controlled by an authoritarian regime, pushes the United States closer and closer toward a socialist republic.

Hands down I'll take capitalism every time, over socialism. But, that's me. Of course maybe if the U.S. government controlled wild sheep allocations in the United States, every one could then line up at the government butcher and buy a small chunk of sheep meat to take back home.

 

[t_carlson]

It’s just basic supply and demand.

Anyone counting on the price going down is in for a rude awakening IMO.

I’m pushing 60 and I can count on one hand the things that have gone down in relative cost over the years. And that’s only because they learned to make more of them faster and cheaper.

I’m pretty sure sheep hunting isn’t going to join that list.

Well, under the laws of supply and demand:

"Baby boomers make up our nation’s largest cohort of hunters, and they’ve already begun to age out of the sport. Within 15 years, most will stop buying licenses entirely. And when they do, our ranks could plunge by 30 percent...Hunting participation peaked in 1982, when nearly 17 million hunters purchased 28.3 million licenses. Hunter numbers have steadily declined since. We lost 2.2 million hunters between 2011 and 2016 alone. In 2016, just 11.5 million people hunted. That’s less than 4 percent of the national population. Baby boomers (anyone born between 1946 and 1964) make up roughly a third of all hunters nationally. They currently range from 54 to 72 years old, which means the oldest have already crossed the threshold for aging out."

Why We Suck at Recruiting New Hunters, Why It Matters, and How You Can Fix It

Baby boomers make up our nation's largest cohort of hunters, and they've already begun to age out of the sport. Within 15 years, most will stop buying licenses entirely. And when they do, our ranks could plunge by 30 percent—along with critical funding for wildlife management, advocacy for...

www.outdoorlife.com

Demand is about to take a large drop.

What do the laws of supply and demand say will happen when demand drops by 30%???

Well, not to derail this thread, but socialism sucks, compared to capitalism. I've seen it and lived it firsthand, outside the United States.

Unfortunately, the entitlement mindset of today's American youth, and a portion of middle-aged Americans that favor being subsidized and controlled by an authoritarian regime, pushes the United States closer and closer toward a socialist republic.

Hands down I'll take capitalism every time, over socialism. But, that's me. Of course maybe if the U.S. government controlled wild sheep allocations in the United States, every one could then line up at the government butcher and buy a small chunk of sheep meat to take back home.

I agree with you politically 100%.

I just get tired of having it shoved in my face every time the door cracks.

 

[cbeard64]

Your own figures reveal the fallacy of your argument. Hunter numbers declining significantly since 1982.

Now look at what sheep hunt prices have done since then.

Hmmmmm……….

 

[t_carlson]

Also, I doubt the data exists, but I'd REALLY like to see the price of a stone sheep hunt over the last 30 years.

I'm betting that there is a noticeable rate of change starting shortly after our monetary policy of suppressed interest rates began in response the 2008 recession. We've had a decade+ of artificially good economic times, and people have a lot of extra money to throw around.

The first "payment" on that "loan" is due soon. By the end of the decade, social security will be insolvent. The twilight of the petro dollar has now begun on top of all of that.

At a minimum, tax rates are going to have to rise, and sharply. The people who buy stone sheep hunts are the same people who will get hit with the biggest tax increases. I don't think historical data is of much use for us in the next 10 years. We could experience a reversion to economic realities that have not existed since before WWII, or maybe even ever in the U.S.

 

[t_carlson]

Your own figures reveal the fallacy of your argument. Hunter numbers declining significantly since 1982.

Now look at what sheep hunt prices have done since then.

Hmmmmm……….

No. The numbers *appear* strong now, but you have to dig a little deeper to see who and what is actually driving the trends.

Hunter numbers have fallen because we are failing to recruit younger hunters. 18 year olds don't go on stone sheep hunts. Blue collar guys with families don't go on stone sheep hunts.

Statistically, the most accurate predictor of wealth is age. Besides being the wealthiest generation, baby boomers are also the largest.

Do you not think there will be any interruption when the largest and wealthiest generation quits hunting?

 

[cbeard64]

No, I do not. The younger folks will get older and wealthier, sheep populations are in decline, and sheep hunting is the pinnacle of hunting.

Its current popularity among young people is through the roof. The number of young guys (and gals) at Sheep Show is astounding. The participation of young folks on western hunting forums, listening to hunting podcasts, etc. are at all time highs. The appetite for sheep hunting info, stories, gear, etc. among younger folks has never been higher.

Plus I think you are not giving near enough consideration to the supply side of the equation. There is only a very limited supply of wild sheep tags available any given year. And that’s not going to change significantly.

If anyone really wants to go sheep hunting, they should go now if the costs haven’t already gone up too much for them. JMHO.

 

[Steve O]

Yep. I’ve hunted all 4 and only have a stone and desert to show for it. I can’t see another northern sheep hunt for me, I’m no boomer and I’m pretty much priced out except for supporting conservation efforts by buying raffle tickets…

Nothing I’d rather do than sheep hunt but I can’t justify the costs. And no the prices will NOT be going down. Ever.

We used to pay for Canadian sheep hunts in US dollars and get the exchange rate. That stopped 25 years ago and was 30-40% at times.