PRS scope that passes drop eval?

[prairieboy]

In the midwest there is, of course, the large zco movement and then the TT guys. There is a massive group that got pissed about the reliability of mid-tier scopes shooting nx8 with mil xt, also a few shooting zeiss s3.

are you saying the nx8 was not reliable? serious question here

 

[ddowning]

are you saying the nx8 was not reliable? serious question here

No. The opposite, but after re-reading I can understand the question. Guys were running Vortex and Athlon and the scopes were failing. To be very honest, the company culture at Vortex was (maybe still is) pretty incredible for the most part. They had/have some very truly good, God fearing people that work there and care deeply about the customers and people in general. When there were issues they were as authentically disappointed as many of us customers were. When it was brought up that there were issues, many did not deny that there were issues. It was nearly impossible to deny even from a simply anecdotal evidence. It would have required the engineers to admit there was a flaw and fix it. Many of us could not get them to admit there was a problem. Who knows if it was ego, money, etc. When you are dealing with a bunch of great well meaning people and a product that doesn't work, it is easy to have a lot of patience. Many people in that company that were face to face with customers and sponsored shooters on a daily basis deeply wanted the problems to be fixed. Eventually, they wear you out and you are done.

TT seems to be good enough to work as long as it is not abused. ZCO needs good mounting options. I have barely played with a ZCO, but there are a couple guys with machining capabilities that are incredible minds and shooters that made their own mounts to solve problems. After that, problems were solved. I was told the mounts were one off and not feasible for mass production. Nightforce has been pretty solid as you would expect, it just doesn't have the greatest glass. Same with the Zeiss s3. The s5 had issues with durability, but the s3 has been pretty decent.

What I was trying to say, there are guys that know nothing about the rokslide drop tests that have been saying f it, I'm going to shoot Nightforce and stop worrying about it. They figured out that they don’t have problems with Nightforce holding zero. When you shoot as much as most of these guys do, it is not hard to see things even though there really isn't a systematic approach. The difference is, without a systematic approach to identify what is going on, you question if what you are seeing is real.

 

[Castle Rock]

All the guys who win are shooting Kahles, Vortex, and Leupold for the most part and they generally don't really care if the zero is off, they just want to know where the zero is and then adjust the zero offset in the kestrel.

What a foreign concept

 

[hunterguy122]

For strictly playing games, I don't think it's that big of a deal to pass a drop eval.

The zero board is open every morning, and PRS matches will frequently have zero boards set up every few stages. You have 45+ minutes between stages. If your rifle falls, you just run over to the zero board.

All the guys who win are shooting Kahles, Vortex, and Leupold for the most part and they generally don't really care if the zero is off, they just want to know where the zero is and then adjust the zero offset in the kestrel.

When you're constantly shooting, losing zero by a tenth from the car ride in isn't that big of a deal. The much much more common issue I see that causes disaster stages is improper scope/ring mounting, loose action screws, and mags that won't feed.

What scope do you use for PRS?

 

[alexnelon]

What scope do you use for PRS?

Right now it’s a Nightforce SHV f1 which really is not a good choice for that game. But at least I don’t have to zero at matches.

 

[hunterguy122]

Thank you, I was just curious. I am trying to decide on what I want at the moment.

 

[JGood]

I am of the opinion that scope durrability is largely unimportant in PRS. You confirm zero before every day and your rife recieves no impacts. If for some reason you dropped it, you can almost always go check zero agian. You just need a scope that reliably tracks. Reticle is more important than drop testing for this.

 

[Jordan Smith]

I am of the opinion that scope durrability is largely unimportant in PRS. You confirm zero before every day and your rife recieves no impacts. If for some reason you dropped it, you can almost always go check zero agian. You just need a scope that reliably tracks. Reticle is more important than drop testing for this.

In my observation, rifles/scopes definitely get knocked, bumped, and banged during the many PRS matches I've shot.

I had a frustrating 2-day match because my scope was constantly shifting zero by a small amount throughout each day. I would confirm zero at the beginning of the day and re-zero at the end of the day, but that didn't help with the shifts from stage to stage. I pulled the scope after that match and replaced it with an ATACR. No more issues.

 

[BLJ]

In my observation, rifles/scopes definitely get knocked, bumped, and banged during the many PRS matches I've shot.

I had a frustrating 2-day match because my scope was constantly shifting zero by a small amount throughout each day. I would confirm zero at the beginning of the day and re-zero at the end of the day, but that didn't help with the shifts from stage to stage. I pulled the scope after that match and replaced it with an ATACR. No more issues.

What scope were you having issues with?

 

[Jordan Smith]

What scope were you having issues with?

An early Apex Rival. They replaced it under warranty, and service was great. I sold the NIB replacement and went ATACR 5-25x.

I was able to compensate for the shifting zero by spotting my shots and correcting, but the constantly shifting zero was frustrating.

 

[BLJ]

An early Apex Rival. They replaced it under warranty, and service was great. I sold the NIB replacement and went ATACR 5-25x.

I was able to compensate for the shifting zero by spotting my shots and correcting, but the constantly shifting zero was frustrating.

Correcting for a bad wind call without the wind.

Thanks.

 

[Jordan Smith]

Correcting for a bad wind call without the wind.

Thanks.

Haha, except that it was entirely vertical shift.

 

[BLJ]

Haha, except that it was entirely vertical shift.

Wind blows up, too.

 

[Jordan Smith]

Wind blows up, too.

Indeed, haha.

But yeah. It was essentially the same idea. Drop a point or two on most stages to assess POI before correcting and getting the rest on target.

 

[JGood]

In my observation, rifles/scopes definitely get knocked, bumped, and banged during the many PRS matches I've shot.

I had a frustrating 2-day match because my scope was constantly shifting zero by a small amount throughout each day. I would confirm zero at the beginning of the day and re-zero at the end of the day, but that didn't help with the shifts from stage to stage. I pulled the scope after that match and replaced it with an ATACR. No more issues.

This is an interesting observation as most of the top shooters are not experiencing this issue, even with Vortex and Leupold scopes. What are you typically doing to the rifle to cause the zero shift?

 

[Jordan Smith]

This is an interesting observation as most of the top shooters are not experiencing this issue, even with Vortex and Leupold scopes. What are you typically doing to the rifle to cause the zero shift?

I generally dial elevation for each target (except on holdover-only stages), and rifles/scopes tend to get bumped against barricades and props, going in and out of narrow openings while on the clock and trying to hurry, etc. I even had a rifle in a stand get accidentally (or was it?!) kicked over onto concrete by a guy. Luckily, the Bushnell XRSII held zero even after a direct impact on concrete while aboard a 15 lbs rifle, and continued to function perfectly throughout the rest of the match. Even just the recoil of 100 shots per day over many days of competition, a lot of driving on gravel roads, etc., can (and does) cause zero shifts.

Most of the Leupold guys are holding with the reticle rather than dialing, so that mitigates the RTZ and tracking problem, for the most part.

 

[Dave Thomas]

I want my scope to work no matter what I'm doing with it. Yes it's more important for a hunting scope since you're dealing with live animals. But I don't want to deal with shifting zero or tracking issues after putting in all the work it takes to be competitive at a match.

 

[JGood]

I want my scope to work no matter what I'm doing with it. Yes it's more important for a hunting scope since you're dealing with live animals. But I don't want to deal with shifting zero or tracking issues after putting in all the work it takes to be competitive at a match.

This is a valid thing to want, however i postulate that its an unnessary thing on a PRS rifle and as such, its not expected that a match rifle/scope that weighs 26 lbs should have to also withstand a 3 foot drop. And if you ever did drop your rifle at a match... you could just go re-check zero...My point is that there are plenty of scopes that dont "pass the drop eval" but will easily make it through a PRS match. Im never not checking zero at the start of a match. Im never dropping my rifle in a match. If for some reason my rifle sustained an impact... id just go check it. The minimum standard are just so different.

I generally dial elevation for each target (except on holdover-only stages), and rifles/scopes tend to get bumped against barricades and props, going in and out of narrow openings while on the clock and trying to hurry, etc. I even had a rifle in a stand get accidentally (or was it?!) kicked over onto concrete by a guy. Luckily, the Bushnell XRSII held zero even after a direct impact on concrete while aboard a 15 lbs rifle, and continued to function perfectly throughout the rest of the match. Even just the recoil of 100 shots per day over many days of competition, a lot of driving on gravel roads, etc., can (and does) cause zero shifts.

Most of the Leupold guys are holding with the reticle rather than dialing, so that mitigates the RTZ and tracking problem, for the most part.

the dropping portion of the tests and the road work portions of the tests really only test the Zero retention. Tracking is uneffected.

If you are losing zero on your rifle with 100 shots, you need to look into a different caliber/brake/chassis combination. Most competitive PRS rifles weigh in the 20+ range and are shooting 6mm projectiles with massive brakes....there is virutally no recoil.

Additionally, I dont know what matches you are shooting, but your bumps into baricades shouldent be throwing off your zero while you are shooting your stage. This is likely a an issue with how youre approching/building positions or perhaps a ring failure?

Last, why are you driving on gravel roads between stages?

 

[Lawnboi]

Does every PRS match have a zero board? Most of the matches I have been to this has not been an option.

Zero argument that PRS isn’t hard on a scope at all. I’d still rather have a rifle that I can count on to hold zero. I also wonder why so many guys seem to have to zero so often. I do understand barrels change through their life but that shouldn’t be happening between a couple one day matches.

 

[RockAndSage]

Well I guess im going to use it for NRL hunter. But is it really just nightforce? Looking for a 34mm tube FFP w/ MOA reticle

I'm genuinely surprised nobody's mentioned the Minox ZP5 yet, given that it's passed the drop test, and has such high reviews, especially for its THLR reticle. I have one for sale here:

WTS Thread 'Minox ZP5 with THLR Reticle'

Wednesday at 1:11 PM

Purchased 2 of these, and have been exceptionally impressed - but only need one. This one is NIB, never mounted, only pulled out to check parallax, turret function, etc. All good. $2250 shipped to you, insured.

• RockAndSage
• Replies: 3
• Forum: Optics Classifieds