POSTING FOR AWARENESS FOR UTAH AND IDAHO RESIDENTS

[jjohnsonElknewbie]

Anyone who thinks growing corn to make ethanol for fuel makes any kind of real economic sense needs his head examined. Take away the absurd subsidies for it and it collapses overnight.

Don't forget the EPA mandates that started us down the rabbit hole...

 

[jjohnsonElknewbie]

I don't think this is true. Forces much larger than any individual consumer or demand dictate what we do and invest in as a society and country. If you don't think those forces/powers have the ability to manufacture demand and consent, as well as subsidize and physically defend and enforce these technologies, then you are misinformed


I literally cannot purchase non-ethanol gas in the county I live in. I have no choice other than to not drive or drive electric. Either of those are logistically difficult or expensive options. I cannot ditch consumer electronics, or electronics of any kind really, and still maintain a job and income, have my kids attend school, etc. Same with the internet. Impossible. Bills, banking, employment, etc, depend on internet access and use. Therefore it is not a simple "freedom to choose" or "lifestyle changes". You would essentially have to become a hermit and live completely off grid to really implement the ideas you've presented here. There are serious barriers to objection or abstention that have been intentionally constructed and implemented.

and you highlighted my point. The genie is out of the bottle. When technology goes from a privilege to a commodity (ex. ipads and laptops in schools vs. paper and writing) our dependence is sealed.

 

[jjohnsonElknewbie]

Sidebar moderately interesting story:

Many years ago when the ethanol scam was in its earlier days, we were at church one morning and another member voiced a prayer request for wisdom about some upcoming life changes. We were in a small group setting and when we asked details, he said - basically - that he was an accountant, and he had to change jobs.

Why?

Well, he was an accountant that had taken a job at an ethanol-related firm. Once he started working he began to look over numbers (because that's what accountants do) and he realized that the entire thing was a scam and he was deeply convicted that he couldn't in clear conscience work for such a farce of a company anymore and he was terrified of losing his livelihood.

He quit very soon afterwards. We lost track of him when we moved out of the area. But I'll never forget that conversation.

It is my belief that the ethanol scam as we know it simply would not exist if not for the timing of the 'Iowa Caucus' every 4 years.

(/end thread hijack)

The EPA established the mandate for ethanol as part of the Renewable Fuels Standard. Iowans are both the benefactors and victims.

 

[jjohnsonElknewbie]

Because there is not enough water to fill it, unless you deprive someone or something (fish) of their water in much of the west. Colorado River is poster child for oversubscribed use.

Last I heard it stops way short of its original mouth due to overuse.

 

[Rotnguns]

Yes, I agree with what you are saying and I appreciate you being respectful with it. I would be curious what their PUE is to truly know what the actual heat output would be. And, like you said, who knows if they’ll build to their nameplate or not. I’ve yet to see any DC build to full capacity.

Thanks, and I enjoy discussing this issue, especially with another engineer. My specialties are vibrations, acoustics, and machine dynamics, but I was involved with a nearby combined cycle plant on a research project with Idaho Power (the plant is in New Plymouth, Idaho). What I'm wondering: can the hot water exiting the data center be incorporated into the low or medium reheat water pipes for the combined-cycle plants? It's my understanding that both the data center and the plants will not be using evaporative cooling towers, so if the water from the plants needs to be chilled anyway before entering the low temperature piping, why not take advantage of the hot water from the data center, and use only one set of chillers on the plant side in the process, eliminating the need for separate chillers on the data center?