Painless load development (mine)

[ThatDUDE]

I haven’t had issues with SR primer 6XC, 6.5cm, or 308. Just 22CM. Don’t know why, but I’m not interested in finickyness and won’t use SR in the future.

Just when I bought 2000 CCI 450's.....

 

[Castle Rock]

You will be absolutely fine with them, they are a true magnum primer

 

[DEW0341]

Just when I bought 2000 CCI 450's.....

Over 5k of 450’s in 6.5cm srp not one problem


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[Carl Ross]

Over 5k of 450’s in 6.5cm srp not one problem


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That’s great to hear. Would you mind sharing:

What powder(s) did you use?

What was the coldest weather you shot much in?

Thanks!

 

[Marbles]

@Formidilosus
I'm assuming if magazine length puts the bullet further into the case, it is probably not worth the complication of trying to load long.

Example, 223 with 77 gr TMK loaded to 2.26 OAL places a decent bit of the bullet in the case. Is it worth modifying the magazine?

As a gas gun should have a crimp, even loading at 2.26 I still do not really have a round that works for both my Tikka and my AR, correct? Does it cause any problems to put a roll crimp on a TMK with no cannalure? Obviously it will deform the bullet, but as it does so uniformly, my gestalt is that it doesn't matter.

 

[Formidilosus]

@Formidilosus
I'm assuming if magazine length puts the bullet further into the case, it is probably not worth the complication of trying to load long.

Example, 223 with 77 gr TMK loaded to 2.26 OAL places a decent bit of the bullet in the case. Is it worth modifying the magazine?

As a gas gun should have a crimp, even loading at 2.26 I still do not really have a round that works for both my Tikka and my AR, correct? Does it cause any problems to put a roll crimp on a TMK with no cannalure? Obviously it will deform the bullet, but as it does so uniformly, my gestalt is that it doesn't matter.

I load to mag length or SAAMI for everything, as I want to be able to shoot every load in every so chambered rifle, and seating depth has very little or no impact on real precision.

For the 223/77gr TMK it’s 2.26” coal regardless of the rifle or mag, a slight crimp on all.

 

[DEW0341]

That’s great to hear. Would you mind sharing:

What powder(s) did you use?

What was the coldest weather you shot much in?

Thanks!

H4350, Superformance, A4350

Coldest weather in 3rd and 4th rifle season in Colorado down into low teens.


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[gbflyer]

I haven’t used that one. How does it do with H1000, H4350, etc? And how quick is it to set a charge weight? For instance I did three different cartridges and powders yesterday but only 20-60 rounds of each.


The electronic is mindless to me. Set the pan on, set the grain, it buzzes, beeps when it’s done, dump powder, rinse and repeat.

The Harrells measure is good quality. I’ve dealt with him on several occasions and gotten a hand written pay me when you get this invoice with the product. Old school.

 

[philcox]

@Formidilosus when you are doing the "21 shot" for load dev, at what point do you pull the plug and say, nope not gonna work? Would it be early in the first 10 shot. Let's say shot 6 puts the group bigger than you want, do you just stop there, or do you continue through the 10 to see, and then if all the rest are more inline with your group, you move out to the 1K mark?

Thanks in advance.

 

[Formidilosus]

@Formidilosus when you are doing the "21 shot" for load dev, at what point do you pull the plug and say, nope not gonna work? Would it be early in the first 10 shot. Let's say shot 6 puts the group bigger than you want, do you just stop there, or do you continue through the 10 to see, and then if all the rest are more inline with your group, you move out to the 1K mark?

Thanks in advance.

If I need 1.2 MOA for example, when a shot goes over that, it’s done. I’d still shoot the 10 rounds because they are already loaded, but I couldn’t say that anything would make me use that load.

 

[Tell]

How do you determine the accuracy requirement of the gun? Do you pick a distance you want to shoot to and a size target and then put the WEZ to it?

 

[Formidilosus]

How do you determine the accuracy requirement of the gun? Do you pick a distance you want to shoot to and a size target and then put the WEZ to it?

I don’t need to put it into the WEZ anymore. If it’s a deer/elk rifle for use to 600’ish yards sub 2 MOA consistently for ten rounds is acceptable. To 800 yards, legit 1.5 MOA.

At that precision, targets sizes, and distances, any miss isn’t from the baseline precision of the gun.

 

[philcox]

I don’t need to put it into the WEZ anymore. If it’s a deer/elk rifle for use to 600’ish yards sub 2 MOA consistently for ten rounds is acceptable. To 800 yards, legit 1.5 MOA.

At that precision, targets sizes, and distances, any miss isn’t from the baseline precision of the gun.

@Formidilosus so have a scenario to bounce off of you. Would love to get your input ... Based on your essentially "shoot 10" at 100, then 10 at distance ...

I just shot a 20 shot group (you saw it in an earlier post). It ended up at 2.381 MOA, and I am wanting a 1.5 MOA rifle. BUT ... if I would have shot 10 (actually up to 13) I was at 1.456 MOA. I am asking myself if that load is actually "good enough" because "It would have been if I stopped at 10". Is the 1.5 MOA for a 10 round essentially "good enough". I assume "legit 1.5 MOA" for 10 would be multiple 10 round groups that all were sub 1.5.

Just trying to wrap my head around this whole thing. Thx.

 

[CBB1]

I don’t need to put it into the WEZ anymore. If it’s a deer/elk rifle for use to 600’ish yards sub 2 MOA consistently for ten rounds is acceptable. To 800 yards, legit 1.5 MOA.

At that precision, targets sizes, and distances, any miss isn’t from the baseline precision of the gun.

I would love for you to explain this more thoroughly. Perhaps even in a new thread. I think this information could save so much time and stress trying to ring out every .01 MOA out of a gun/ load. Please make us all feel better for not have a 1/4 MOA gun/load and save us thousands on guns and reloading components.


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[amassi]

I would love for you to explain this more thoroughly. Perhaps even in a new thread. I think this information could save so much time and stress trying to ring out every .01 MOA out of a gun/ load. Please make us all feel better for not have a 1/4 MOA gun/load and save us thousands on guns and reloading components.


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Have you listened to the shoot 2 hunt podcast they did on this?

A good way to feel happy with a 1.5 moa gun is testing it in field conditions and realizing you’re missing because of technique /wind call et el and not the precision of the rifle.

 

[Marbles]

@Formidilosus so have a scenario to bounce off of you. Would love to get your input ... Based on your essentially "shoot 10" at 100, then 10 at distance ...

I just shot a 20 shot group (you saw it in an earlier post). It ended up at 2.381 MOA, and I am wanting a 1.5 MOA rifle. BUT ... if I would have shot 10 (actually up to 13) I was at 1.456 MOA. I am asking myself if that load is actually "good enough" because "It would have been if I stopped at 10". Is the 1.5 MOA for a 10 round essentially "good enough". I assume "legit 1.5 MOA" for 10 would be multiple 10 round groups that all were sub 1.5.

Just trying to wrap my head around this whole thing. Thx.

Could shooter fatigue have caused the group to open up? What cartridge and rifle weight?

But yest, legit 1.5 MOA means being repeatably 1.5 MOA.

Now to see if I'm correct when Form replies

 

[CBB1]

Have you listened to the shoot 2 hunt podcast they did on this?

A good way to feel happy with a 1.5 moa gun is testing it in field conditions and realizing you’re missing because of technique /wind call et el and not the precision of the rifle.

I did listen to it but I would love to have it explained more thoroughly. My mind has looked at it as stacking tolerances and I wanted to start off with the highest level of precision. I am happy to have that idea debunked and would like to understand it well enough to have a conversation with my buddies about it.


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[Formidilosus]

I did listen to it but I would love to have it explained more thoroughly. My mind has looked at it as stacking tolerances and I wanted to start off with the highest level of precision. I am happy to have that idea debunked and would like to understand it well enough to have a conversation with my buddies about it.


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It is discussed here-

What role does probablity play?

I'm not a long range hunter and am amazed at some people's capabilities when it comes to long range shooting. I do have a legit question. Assuming a rifle shoots MOA and assuming a rifleman can not shoot with zero error, isn't there a theoretical limit to shots without banking on only a...

rokslide.com

And here-

Why Match/Target Bullets For Hunting

This is going to be a barrage of questions. It will help to view me as a skeptic relative to the matter at hand. I am going to do some load development for my new 6mm Creed. I live in the southeast where shots are rarely taken at more than 100 yards. But, I fancy that I will take a trip out...

rokslide.com

 

[Bbell12]

Have you listened to the shoot 2 hunt podcast they did on this?

A good way to feel happy with a 1.5 moa gun is testing it in field conditions and realizing you’re missing because of technique /wind call et el and not the precision of the rifle.

What episode was this?

 

[josh0513]

What episode was this?

41 I do believe.


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