New Pup...Hypoallergenic ideas..WireHaired Griffon

[sndmn11]

Whats the best way to find a breeder in our area or reputable breeder? We are in Indiana.

If you are really set on getting a dog who should hunt, I would expand your range to a drive you can do in a day LONG round trip, or a one night stay over.

Aux Lake, Coppershot, AND I would 100% ask both to name two to five other breeders they like. These folks cannot interbreed their lines extensively, so they must work with others to grab good traits and refine the breed. If you talk to anyone who is breeding and does not have a good list of folks they would buy a dog from, do not buy a dog from them. Any good breeder should have the idea of the breed standards and traits coming first, rather than selling their own dogs. I would genuinely start by calling both Cliff and Larry and BSing with them, I have spent a few hours on the phone with both.

My dog was a test run of a random background female and a good Aux Lake background. She was $800. We got her rather than a shelter dog because our son was a few months old at the time and we were unsure of a puppy shelter dog as far as size and coat, and didn't want an adult shelter dog with an unknown behavior background. So, we purchased Juniper for the disposition, lack of shedding, and idea of the breed being gentle and staying close. Hunting ability was a far off like 5th or 6th because I have never trained a bird dog and wasn't sure of what tie I would have to do so. I goofed somewhere and Juniper does not like gunshots. I HAVE met a handful of folks who are now great friends who breed Griffs, and enjoy their thoughts on why they do so.

I bring that up because I think Juniper is awesome, but I would love to hunt with her. At the time, I could never see myself spending $1500-2k for a dog; the one in my avatar was a $70 shelter dog from college and passed away several weeks after the kid was born. From $70 to $800 was a big step, but NOW I would totally spend the difference to land a solid hunting line dog. On top of that, I would have no problem spending a year's time to find a few breeders and make sure that I get what I am wanting, or even passing on a litter after examining the pups.

AWPGA has this list as well, there is one IN breeder. Other folks I would call from this list to chat about the breed would be Renee Carter, Frank Puccio,

AWPGA Breeders 2020.pdf

drive.google.com

 

[Desk Jockey]

a bit of a different direction, but we added Bella, a mini golden doodle, to the family last year.
she is hypoallergenic, doesn’t shed much, super smart and a really good dog. Despite being a shade under 20#, she has big dog energy Under that fir. I was walking her the other day and she took a keen interest in a game trail and may actually have some tracking ability that I intend to explore.

 

[jorswift]

If you are really set on getting a dog who should hunt, I would expand your range to a drive you can do in a day LONG round trip, or a one night stay over.

Aux Lake, Coppershot, AND I would 100% ask both to name two to five other breeders they like. These folks cannot interbreed their lines extensively, so they must work with others to grab good traits and refine the breed. If you talk to anyone who is breeding and does not have a good list of folks they would buy a dog from, do not buy a dog from them. Any good breeder should have the idea of the breed standards and traits coming first, rather than selling their own dogs. I would genuinely start by calling both Cliff and Larry and BSing with them, I have spent a few hours on the phone with both.

My dog was a test run of a random background female and a good Aux Lake background. She was $800. We got her rather than a shelter dog because our son was a few months old at the time and we were unsure of a puppy shelter dog as far as size and coat, and didn't want an adult shelter dog with an unknown behavior background. So, we purchased Juniper for the disposition, lack of shedding, and idea of the breed being gentle and staying close. Hunting ability was a far off like 5th or 6th because I have never trained a bird dog and wasn't sure of what tie I would have to do so. I goofed somewhere and Juniper does not like gunshots. I HAVE met a handful of folks who are now great friends who breed Griffs, and enjoy their thoughts on why they do so.

I bring that up because I think Juniper is awesome, but I would love to hunt with her. At the time, I could never see myself spending $1500-2k for a dog; the one in my avatar was a $70 shelter dog from college and passed away several weeks after the kid was born. From $70 to $800 was a big step, but NOW I would totally spend the difference to land a solid hunting line dog. On top of that, I would have no problem spending a year's time to find a few breeders and make sure that I get what I am wanting, or even passing on a litter after examining the pups.

AWPGA has this list as well, there is one IN breeder. Other folks I would call from this list to chat about the breed would be Renee Carter, Frank Puccio,

AWPGA Breeders 2020.pdf

drive.google.com

Thank you. I will deff look into these. I think our main focus is a family companion, as I have no idea how to train a bird dog. Would rather him/her find sheds, lol. I can agree with you, we got our dog from the shelter, so I too am a bit shell shocked from $25 14/15 years ago to now $800-$1200 for a dog. Hard to swallow.

 

[jjohnsonElknewbie]

If you are really set on getting a dog who should hunt, I would expand your range to a drive you can do in a day LONG round trip, or a one night stay over.

Aux Lake, Coppershot, AND I would 100% ask both to name two to five other breeders they like. These folks cannot interbreed their lines extensively, so they must work with others to grab good traits and refine the breed. If you talk to anyone who is breeding and does not have a good list of folks they would buy a dog from, do not buy a dog from them. Any good breeder should have the idea of the breed standards and traits coming first, rather than selling their own dogs. I would genuinely start by calling both Cliff and Larry and BSing with them, I have spent a few hours on the phone with both.

I think this is very sound advice. I can tell you that I spent a couple hours on the phone with Cliff before I committed. I told him back in February that I wasn't in the market until Feb. 2022, and he called me cold in April to let me know about a special repeat breeding between Flat Brooks Walker and his dog Jenta. FBW is a supremely talented hunting dog and has the NAVHDA credentials to support it. Jenta is also a very good hunter in her own right, and the first indication of the pups from their first litter were very strong.

FBW owner is seriously ill and moved to CA for medical treatment, and it is unlikely that the dog will sire any more pups in this area. As a result, Cliff wanted me to have an opportunity at getting a pup if I could make it work.

Fast forward to August, and my family went to pick out our pup from Cliff's kennel. The outfit was immaculate and the dogs were clearly treated with tremendous respect, care, affection, and love. My daughters, wife, and I spent 2 hours romping and wrestling with the 8 pups, and eventually picked out Oscar. Even though he was the runt, we picked him out of 2 dogs Cliff recommended based on my desired traits- unending prey drive, courage, and intelligence. Oscar was the only dog that stayed awake the entire visit, and even when outnumbered by his litter mates 2 and 3 to 1, he never gave up and scrapped with the larger pups until they relented. His show of tenacity made him the clear winner for us and he is an amazing pup. At 5.5 months he has already pointed and flushed 5 roosters and 3 hens. He is a close working and methodical hunter, and eagerly responds to simple whistle and hand commands. I AM NOT A PROFESSIONAL TRAINER. We have learned from each other and with tips from Cliff, Oscar is fixing to be the best hunting dog I've ever owned. He is also a loving and devoted companion, and we are locked at the hip in the house and outside.

One of the key reasons I bought from Cliff was because when you get a dog from him there are no hairy contracts or strings attached. In his words, "...when you buy a dog from me, he's your dog. All that I ask is that if it doesn't work out, that you bring him back to me instead of taking to the shelter or giving away to someone else." Other breeders I researched had lengthy requirements and contracts including fines/penalties up to $10k for inappropriate breeding, etc... These were a huge turnoff to me, and Cliff just made the process smooth and easy.

 

[TSAMP]

The cheapest expense in dog ownership is the initial price. That goes triple for a good gundog.

 

[RyanMurphy]

Have had a male griffon for 12 years now. They love birds and swimming so versatile they are. Great family dogs!

 

[svivian]

I was in a semi similar situation about two years ago for a dog. My now wife wanted a dog that didn't shed and I wanted a hunting dog..... We ended up getting a golden doodle and it was the best decision I think we made. My buddy has a purebred lab who he trains professionally for duck hunting. We worked with my dog for the first 8 months and he is awesome at retrieving and hunting. I also worked with him since 8 weeks on finding sheds and he has done surprisingly well at that too.

The other thing I love about the dog is I've seen him be protective of my wife which is something I never thought about, but only when he needs to be. I came home late one night for the first time and she was already in bed. When I came in the door he jumped on the bed covering her whole body while snarling at me and then came after me until I could flip the light on. I shit pants a little but damn I was impressed.

 

[jjohnsonElknewbie]

I was in a semi similar situation about two years ago for a dog. My now wife wanted a dog that didn't shed and I wanted a hunting dog..... We ended up getting a golden doodle and it was the best decision I think we made. My buddy has a purebred lab who he trains professionally for duck hunting. We worked with my dog for the first 8 months and he is awesome at retrieving and hunting. I also worked with him since 8 weeks on finding sheds and he has done surprisingly well at that too.

The other thing I love about the dog is I've seen him be protective of my wife which is something I never thought about, but only when he needs to be. I came home late one night for the first time and she was already in bed. When I came in the door he jumped on the bed covering her whole body while snarling at me and then came after me until I could flip the light on. I shit pants a little but damn I was impressed.

I had to retire my current golden at 9 due to arthritis in his front legs. However, I had a very similar experience training him as yours with the doodle. He was super easy to train and the best dog I ever hunted birds behind, and his drive and pure joy for hunting was just humbling and amazing. I get a little choked up watching Oscar learn to hunt, and he certainly has big shoes to fill.

My goldens have always been extremely protective of my wife and daughters, especially when my wife was pregnant and the kids were babies. I had a couple of those "oh $hit" moments too in the dark. When my wife was pregnant, our first golden would always keep the two of us apart. He wouldn't even let us sit by each other on the couch! They are an amazing breed.

 

[svivian]

I had to retire my current golden at 9 due to arthritis in his front legs. However, I had a very similar experience training him as yours with the doodle. He was super easy to train and the best dog I ever hunted birds behind, and his drive and pure joy for hunting was just humbling and amazing. I get a little choked up watching Oscar learn to hunt, and he certainly has big shoes to fill.

My goldens have always been extremely protective of my wife and daughters, especially when my wife was pregnant and the kids were babies. I had a couple of those "oh $hit" moments too in the dark. When my wife was pregnant, our first golden would always keep the two of us apart. He wouldn't even let us sit by each other on the couch! They are an amazing breed.

Yes I forgot to mention the amount of drive and wanting to work that this dog has. I never thought i would get that kind of attitude out of a golden doodle. I have to give mine jobs like bringing in the mail or when i need to give my wife something across the house, he takes it over to her.

 

[jjohnsonElknewbie]

That’s awesome man

 

[jorswift]

Thanks guys. Some good looking dogs! I guess the wife and I have a lot to discuss. Thanks for the help.

 

[jorswift]

Do their coats have to have any special treatment? I have been talking to a guy that said their coats need to be stripped. They have Griffon/poodle mix they breed. Not sure how that coat works.

 

[sndmn11]

Do their coats have to have any special treatment? I have been talking to a guy that said their coats need to be stripped. They have Griffon/poodle mix they breed. Not sure how that coat works.

Mine is a tight coat, I disliked the fluffy look, and we don't do anything with her other than a bath before Christmas.

 

[CoffeeGoat]

Yes I forgot to mention the amount of drive and wanting to work that this dog has. I never thought i would get that kind of attitude out of a golden doodle. I have to give mine jobs like bringing in the mail or when i need to give my wife something across the house, he takes it over to her.

I'll add the opposite - we got a golden doodle as a family pet with the hope he might make a retriever. He's a great family dog, a little anxious, but pretty great. He is hopeless at retrieving though...

 

[passinggas33]

Like many have mentioned, we too have a doodle mix. Ours though is a mini Irish Doodle. Really dark red coat. Fantastic family dog and we are working with her slowly to figure out some skills for being able to hunt with me. But I will echo many sentiments that have been expressed about good breeders if you are looking for a specific type or breed of dog. We waited almost 18 months for this dog but knew we would be getting a great dog with great lines. Puppy mills will deliver the puppy sooner, but you will possibly have problems in the long run due to the lack of attention, early training that can often benefits certain dog breeds. Just my thoughts. If you aren’t tied to a specific breed, may be worth it to look at a shelter dog.

 

[jjohnsonElknewbie]

Do their coats have to have any special treatment? I have been talking to a guy that said their coats need to be stripped. They have Griffon/poodle mix they breed. Not sure how that coat works.

Griff coats require very little maintenance. In fact the breed standard is for them to look a little disheveled and unkempt. If they get into briars or burs that actually stick to the wiry coat, a coarse comb is all that is needed.

Per AKC, "Coat is hard and coarse, never curly or woolly, with a thick undercoat of fine hair, giving an unkempt appearance. His easy trainability, devotion to family, and friendly temperament endear him to all. The nickname of "supreme gundog" is well earned."

"Coat: The coat is one of the distinguishing features of the breed. It is a double coat. The outer coat is medium length, straight and wiry, never curly or woolly. The harsh texture provides protection in rough cover. The obligatory undercoat consists of a fine, thick down, which provides insulation as well as water resistance. The undercoat is more or less abundant, depending upon the season, climate, and hormone cycle of the dog. It is usually lighter in color. The head is furnished with a prominent mustache and eyebrows. These required features are extensions of the undercoat, which gives the Griffon a somewhat untidy appearance. The hair
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covering the ears is fairly short and soft, mixed with longer harsh hair from the coat. The overall feel is much less wiry than the body. The legs, both front and rear, are covered with denser, shorter, and less coarse hair. The coat on the tail is the same as the body; any type of plume is prohibited. The breed should be exhibited in full body coat, not stripped short in pattern. Trimming and stripping are only allowed around the ears, top of head, cheeks and feet."

 

[KurtR]

Can’t believe the prices people pay for mutts . If you buy a well breed dog that is of hunting lines and don’t work them expect bad behavior and stuff getting chewed up. I would be looking standard poodle from a good breeder and then talking to some one with experience training them. Seen a few good ones that would make a hell of a shed dog with a good off switch.

 

[jjohnsonElknewbie]

Can’t believe the prices people pay for mutts . If you buy a well breed dog that is of hunting lines and don’t work them expect bad behavior and stuff getting chewed up. I would be looking standard poodle from a good breeder and then talking to some one with experience training them. Seen a few good ones that would make a hell of a shed dog with a good off switch.

I've had both. My retired Golden Retriever had zero pedigree and cost me $250. I read and followed Wolters book to the tee and he was an accomplished pheasant hunter before the end of his first year after starting hunting at 6 months. He lived in the house with my family and hunted hard every season until we had to retire him at 9 due to arthritis. He is turning 11 on 12/11/21, and is enjoying his golden sunset years being a big spoiled baby. He earned it.

I never looked at standard poodles, becuase the breed is larger than what I was looking for in my house. However, they are traditional sporting dogs and there are many good breeders out there with hunting lines. Get ready to spend $$$ for one from a good sporting kennel.

Anytime you go into specialty breeds for one trait or another you can expect to pay more money. Trust me, if you are looking for an excellent sporting dog with minimal shedding, the list immediately gets very short. In addition, these breeders all understand they are filling a unique and desired niche. Thus they can get whatever people are willing to pay. When I was searching for my Griff I found non-pedigreed dogs for $7-800. However, dogs from kennels with proven NAVHDA credentials started around $2k to over $4k with years long waiting lists in some cases.

I spent $2k on our Griff, and I never thought I would ever spend this much on a dog. However, early indications are that he is going to be an amazing hunter. He is already a beloved companion.

 

[KurtR]

I've had both. My retired Golden Retriever had zero pedigree and cost me $250. I read and followed Wolters book to the tee and he was an accomplished pheasant hunter before the end of his first year after starting hunting at 6 months. He lived in the house with my family and hunted hard every season until we had to retire him at 9 due to arthritis. He is turning 11 on 12/11/21, and is enjoying his golden sunset years being a big spoiled baby. He earned it.

I never looked at standard poodles, becuase the breed is larger than what I was looking for in my house. However, they are traditional sporting dogs and there are many good breeders out there with hunting lines. Get ready to spend $$$ for one from a good sporting kennel.

Anytime you go into specialty breeds for one trait or another you can expect to pay more money. Trust me, if you are looking for an excellent sporting dog with minimal shedding, the list immediately gets very short. In addition, these breeders all understand they are filling a unique and desired niche. Thus they can get whatever people are willing to pay. When I was searching for my Griff I found non-pedigreed dogs for $7-800. However, dogs from kennels with proven NAVHDA credentials started around $2k to over $4k with years long waiting lists in some cases.

I spent $2k on our Griff, and I never thought I would ever spend this much on a dog. However, early indications are that he is going to be an amazing hunter. He is already a beloved companion.

People don’t understand the money involved a good breeder puts into dogs. A good breeder will match a puppy to peoples needs and not in it just for the money. From the genetic testing to ofa certs in the lab world. I paid just shy of why you did for my lab now and he is a nice dog and now that I have really got into dog games and understanding pedigrees our goal is to get an grhrch and a master national pass but I don’t know that he will have enough horse power to run a ft or an srs event but in a few years we are going to try. He is only 2 and a lot of puppy. Were north of 200 retrieves on ducks and geese and will start pheasant hunting now that water has froze up. He has a great off switch in the house.I have a guy we train together 6 nights a week and we are member of an hrc club. He has a female that is out of field trial lines and she is a fire breather I love watching her run but she is not the kind of dog who would just lay around 9 months of the year but she can just chill out and watch tv in the evening. We have followed Mike Larry’s and Freddy kings programs .I will get another dog in a couple years I have a few studs who I have an eye on and the srs is a goal of mine to run. I want a high roller for my next guy. If I knew what I did now when I was young dog training would be my profession . I get pure enjoyment watching something click when you see them get what your teaching them and that happy tail wag.

 

[jjohnsonElknewbie]

People don’t understand the money involved a good breeder puts into dogs. A good breeder will match a puppy to peoples needs and not in it just for the money. From the genetic testing to ofa certs in the lab world. I paid just shy of why you did for my lab now and he is a nice dog and now that I have really got into dog games and understanding pedigrees our goal is to get an grhrch and a master national pass but I don’t know that he will have enough horse power to run a ft or an srs event but in a few years we are going to try. He is only 2 and a lot of puppy. Were north of 200 retrieves on ducks and geese and will start pheasant hunting now that water has froze up. He has a great off switch in the house.I have a guy we train together 6 nights a week and we are member of an hrc club. He has a female that is out of field trial lines and she is a fire breather I love watching her run but she is not the kind of dog who would just lay around 9 months of the year but she can just chill out and watch tv in the evening. We have followed Mike Larry’s and Freddy kings programs .I will get another dog in a couple years I have a few studs who I have an eye on and the srs is a goal of mine to run. I want a high roller for my next guy. If I knew what I did now when I was young dog training would be my profession . I get pure enjoyment watching something click when you see them get what your teaching them and that happy tail wag.

^^^ x10 buddy and couldn't agree more!