Mule deer neck shots?

[Felix40]

I remember 10 years ago everyone said a frontal was an unethical shot. Now everyone is saying how lethal they are. The fact is that until youve tried something you are just speculating. I think all the op was asking for was actual evidence rather than ideas or theories.

I have shot a whitetail in the neck. He flipped on his back and died right there. Also have seen an elk shot through the neck and it bled more than any wound ive seen.

It may not be the best shot but its good to hear from other people’s actual experiences on stuff before making up your mind.

 

[5MilesBack]

It may not be the best shot but its good to hear from other people’s actual experiences on stuff before making up your mind.

I was always taught (just as every other hunter used to be) that you always aim for "the vitals"......period. Now I'm no veterinarian, but I don't know anyone that would consider the neck as vitals. A frontal shot IS through the vitals if done properly and has nothing to do with the neck. I've seen animals die that were shot in the femoral artery in the ham, but that certainly doesn't mean that anyone should ever aim for the ham, regardless of "other people's experiences on stuff".

 

[filthyskills]

I remember 10 years ago everyone said a frontal was an unethical shot. Now everyone is saying how lethal they are. The fact is that until youve tried something you are just speculating. I think all the op was asking for was actual evidence rather than ideas or theories.

I have shot a whitetail in the neck. He flipped on his back and died right there. Also have seen an elk shot through the neck and it bled more than any wound ive seen.

It may not be the best shot but its good to hear from other people’s actual experiences on stuff before making up your mind.

Man....thank you.

Ethics are a personal philosophy. They will vary from person to person and are likely changing over the course of someone’s life. Not exactly supposed to be in the scope of my post.

But I guess clarifying that in the initial post is not enough.


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[filthyskills]

I don't think hate even comes into the equation. This isn't an emotion-based subject........it's a logic-based one.

“Emotions”

It sounds like you are the one getting emotional. Calling folks “dumbasses” and being rude.

Nonetheless this post is no longer of any value.


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[5MilesBack]

“Emotions”

It sounds like you are the one getting emotional. Calling folks “dumbasses” and being rude.

Nonetheless this post is no longer of any value.

I haven't been rude.......just stating the facts. No need for emotions. That's when people start getting offended.

 

[Felix40]

I haven't been rude.......just stating the facts. No need for emotions. That's when people start getting offended.

I tend to always take offense when someone calls me a dumbass, as you have.

 

[neverquit]

I’ve killed 2 buck with archery neck shots. Also lost a great buck after hitting him square half way from his shoulder to his head with a grave digger. Followed pin prick blooded every 20yards for 2 days and 2 miles.

I’ll never do it again.

 

[GregB]

Here's some perspective, when I was younger I took a shot on a running doe with a 12 gauge, and the slug went through the center of the neck broadside. The slug just went through tissue and didn't really hit anything vital, but the impact knocked it out. If it had been an arrow with a fraction of the speed and energy the deer would have been gone with a hole on either side of it's neck. If you have the patience to stalk within 5-20 yards of a deer, you should have the patience to wait for a good shot on the animal.

 

[carsonkeys]

OP, I do have some perspective on this. That being said, I would never, ever, under any circumstances condone this shot. I've seen the blood trail of a deer that whirled into a 60+ yard shot, and took an arrow straight to the jugular. Did it die? Yes, it was an extremely lethal shot. Is that reason enough to ever take a broadside neck-shot? Absolutely not. It's no different than aiming for the ham hoping to hit the femoral...because that's all you'd be doing taking that shot. Hoping. You could leave a deer without a jaw and destine him to be torn apart by predators or die of starvation, at your hands. That's no accident, it's gross negligence.

 

[jmez]

There are two things in the neck that would be considered vitals. One is the carotid artery, the other is the spinal cord. The jugular vein is not a vital structure. Would be rare for an animal to die severing only one jugular vein. If you are going to sever both of them you would have to shoot completely through the neck vertebrae to get the other side. In that case it won't matter because you have to cut the spinal cord to do it.

The carotid artery runs parallel to the jugular vein the length of the neck, lying a few millimeters beneath it. Both are protected on two sides by the cervical vertebrae. Animals with massive blood loss shot through the "jugular" are actually carotid shots. Pretty hard to hit one and not the other.

The cervical vertebrae start directly behind the skull and then travel down, turn toward the shoulder and then come back up a little as they enter the thorax. At each point in the neck they are in a different place.

 

[5MilesBack]

I tend to always take offense when someone calls me a dumbass, as you have.

I used that term for a specific group without any names included. I didn't put you or anyone else in that group. If you or anyone else put themselves in that group, that's not on me. But that's the thing these days.....people actually go looking for ways to be offended. But in the context of this thread subject, ya........I would call anyone a DA that took that archery shot, just as much as I would for someone that intentionally took a rear ham shot or a Texas heart shot. On the internet or in person. Being offended doesn't change any of that. I've been called all kinds of things in my lifetime, but never got offended from that. If I was doing something stupid I'd expect someone to call me on that. That's why we're all here.........to learn and help each other out.

 

[filthyskills]

There are two things in the neck that would be considered vitals. One is the carotid artery, the other is the spinal cord. The jugular vein is not a vital structure. Would be rare for an animal to die severing only one jugular vein. If you are going to sever both of them you would have to shoot completely through the neck vertebrae to get the other side. In that case it won't matter because you have to cut the spinal cord to do it.

The carotid artery runs parallel to the jugular vein the length of the neck, lying a few millimeters beneath it. Both are protected on two sides by the cervical vertebrae. Animals with massive blood loss shot through the "jugular" are actually carotid shots. Pretty hard to hit one and not the other.

The cervical vertebrae start directly behind the skull and then travel down, turn toward the shoulder and then come back up a little as they enter the thorax. At each point in the neck they are in a different place.

Hands down the best response to this topic. A scientific explanation provided by an expert. I’d consider this better than first hand experience of what I was asking for.

Reducing “margin of error” and taking this shot only at ultra close distances, I suspect, is the logic used by those who have taken it. I have not taken it and I am I not trying to impose my ethics on others over the Internet. We’re all better than that. Gut shots and high lung shot are common, I doubt animals want a hole poked in them anywhere. As mentioned frontals used to be frowned upon, most accept them now.

I was asking the wrong question to start. Had I known we had veterinarians available I’d have asked for the anatomy lesson.

Thank you.


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[idahohikker]

Hands down the best response to this topic. A scientific explanation provided by an expert. I’d consider this better than first hand experience of what I was asking for.

Reducing “margin of error” and taking this shot only at ultra close distances, I suspect, is the logic used by those who have taken it. I have not taken it and I am I not trying to impose my ethics on others over the Internet. We’re all better than that. Gut shots and high lung shot are common, I doubt animals want a hole poked in them anywhere. As mentioned frontals used to be frowned upon, most accept them now.

I was asking the wrong question to start. Had I known we had veterinarians available I’d have asked for the anatomy lesson.

Thank you.


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Lots of attitude for guys trying to prevent you from a terrible experience. You waited around forever hoping that there would be guys saying it worked out. People were just trying to help.

 

[hobbes]

I'm not even going to read all the posts, but anyone that has any experience bowhunting knows that a neck shot absolutely is not an ethical choice. Asking for an uncontroversial discussion on a "have you attempted this" question about shot selection IS asking for a question of ethics.

The vitals for an archery are unquestionably the heart and lungs with liver as hope when you are too far back. How you get into those can even be controversial.

Shot selection that doesn't involve a way into the vitals shouldn't even be a consideration. My opinion.........Accept your limitations as a bowhunter or put down the bow.

 

[filthyskills]

Lots of attitude for guys trying to prevent you from a terrible experience. You waited around forever hoping that there would be guys saying it worked out. People were just trying to help.

PM’s I’ve received contradict this. It’s all good though man, I’m glad you’re concerned with this. It is certainly important. Nuance is left out of discussion in this format which is why my intent wasn’t to debate. I’d guess we actually have similar opinions and if you really want feel free to pm/call and we can discuss.


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[filthyskills]

I'm not even going to read all the posts, but anyone that has any experience bowhunting knows that a neck shot absolutely is not an ethical choice. Asking for an uncontroversial discussion on a "have you attempted this" question about shot selection IS asking for a question of ethics.

The vitals for an archery are unquestionably the heart and lungs with liver as hope when you are too far back. How you get into those can even be controversial.

Shot selection that doesn't involve a way into the vitals shouldn't even be a consideration. My opinion.........Accept your limitations as a bowhunter or put down the bow.

I totally hear you. But having knowledge that guys have done this prompted me to ask around to hear experiences, good and bad. Obviously a lot more bad than good.


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[MallardSX2]

I truly think a lot of people who pay high dollars for hunts are more suseptable to taking questionable shots for fear they wont have anything to show for their money after the trip.

 

[idahohikker]

I truly think a lot of people who pay high dollars for hunts are more suseptable to taking questionable shots for fear they wont have anything to show for their money after the trip.

Youtubers and some long range guys too. I think there's a lot of those issues these days and that's why you saw the response from guys here like you did. A bunch of good dudes on the site that really care about the animals and want everything to be above board. There are some shots you just don't take.

 

[MallardSX2]

I saw someone mention the other day about not shooting at a deer straight down because it was unethical. I been bowhunting for 25 years. I like them right under me. lol

 

[Gumbo]

No way. I've wounded enough animals in my day and I don't like it at all. I'd just wait for him to stand and hope I got a good shot. I would however take a short frontal standing shot but not a neck shot.