Motorcycle Recomendations

[insanelupus]

I've considered this option as well. A single bike receiver carrier on my truck and a 200cc-250cc road legal bike would seem to be a time and truck saver. Not necessarily for trails but either to access roads i dont want to beat my truck up on or for dropping off at exit points or at the bottom of a mountain.

This later point would really help as i tend to check specefuc areas for elk and if they aren't there, move to other spots. I think it would increase efficiency by limiting the time id be traveling back to the truck after checking spots. Especially in low elk density areas like i live in.

 

[TheGDog]

I would also caution the OP against thinking he's going to be able to take the Moto pioneering very much. I mean, very likely your state doesn't care about it the same as The Peeplez Republik does. but still there will likely be a lot more restrictions on it than you think. (Think pressure from militant greenies causing them to close sh*t up left and right citing *environmental* concerns, sincethey don't want the expense of fighting them in courts if they can help it)

And also... pioneering where there's no trail line? Can be very risky if for example there's tall grass ya gotta ride thru. Or lotta deep expansive washouts? "Coolies" as they say. Or maybe it wants you to meander thru some pricly-per or cholla cactus areas? Pioneering in some places has to be done fairly slowly since there could be holes you can't see or in a forest setting what if there's dead sharp tree branch on the floor you can't see due to leaf cover, that quickly ends your fun with a puncture. Also when there's not a trail line, finding traction may be trickier than you think sometimes when attempting to traverse the virgin space on the moto, since more weight on the footprint.

So just something to be aware of when considering the use of moto to access it. Until you've rode into their often enough to form a trail line, you've got to expect it's going to be a much more physically exhausting type of riding, especially since you'll be doing it with your pack on too. You'll definitely need to plan several rides into the area in a non hunting setting first to assess how much exertion that part of it is. And whether or not you have the equipment or the skills to pull of safely employing the addition of the moto into the equation. Just saying you may find that with your particular topography and land layout... you get out there and find out that it just really isn't going to offer you as much help as you thought it would because of X or Y.

I would just say if your plans involves using it on roads, and trails where for sure it's ok and they won't pull a fast one on ya last minute and close it off to vehicular traffic because it's hunting season or whatever other unforeseen thing. Then go for it. But if you don't KNOW all these things should be no problem. I'd make sure to ask about them... first.

Because if you find out they won't even let you do the things you're thinking about... better to know now rather than after you've outlaid the cash on a new bike. Cause if you find it wouldn't have panned out anyway, then maybe you'd just go ahead and buy one to bring you more joy on the sporting rides instead.

 

[tbrady77]

I use a TW200 that has heavier springs and lower gearing and I added a cycleracks rack on it. Made hauling out an elk much easier.

 

[ID_Matt]

I didn't read through all of the replies just yet but if it were for primarily hunting, I would strongly recommend a honda crf230f or the new 250F. They are great for hunting - low seat height and geared low. If you are mixing in quite a bit of trail riding for fun, I would look at a Beta Xtrainer 300. Similar power to the KTM, Husqy, etc. 300's but has smoother power and a smaller frame. I started out on big wheel bikes and I see a lot of guys recommending the TW200. I really never could wrap my head around the advantage of a big wheel - they bounce and want to track all over the trail. I moved to a honda 230 after the big wheel and it was great for hunting but didn't have much zip or fun factor for recreational riding so now I have the beta that I absolutely love. Very easy to ride, extremely light, and manageable power. Packed out several elk quarters with it this year and it worked great.

 

[ID_Matt]

I would also caution the OP against thinking he's going to be able to take the Moto pioneering very much. I mean, very likely your state doesn't care about it the same as The Peeplez Republik does. but still there will likely be a lot more restrictions on it than you think. (Think pressure from militant greenies causing them to close sh*t up left and right citing *environmental* concerns, sincethey don't want the expense of fighting them in courts if they can help it)

And also... pioneering where there's no trail line? Can be very risky if for example there's tall grass ya gotta ride thru. Or lotta deep expansive washouts? "Coolies" as they say. Or maybe it wants you to meander thru some pricly-per or cholla cactus areas? Pioneering in some places has to be done fairly slowly since there could be holes you can't see or in a forest setting what if there's dead sharp tree branch on the floor you can't see due to leaf cover, that quickly ends your fun with a puncture. Also when there's not a trail line, finding traction may be trickier than you think sometimes when attempting to traverse the virgin space on the moto, since more weight on the footprint.

So just something to be aware of when considering the use of moto to access it. Until you've rode into their often enough to form a trail line, you've got to expect it's going to be a much more physically exhausting type of riding, especially since you'll be doing it with your pack on too. You'll definitely need to plan several rides into the area in a non hunting setting first to assess how much exertion that part of it is. And whether or not you have the equipment or the skills to pull of safely employing the addition of the moto into the equation. Just saying you may find that with your particular topography and land layout... you get out there and find out that it just really isn't going to offer you as much help as you thought it would because of X or Y.

I would just say if your plans involves using it on roads, and trails where for sure it's ok and they won't pull a fast one on ya last minute and close it off to vehicular traffic because it's hunting season or whatever other unforeseen thing. Then go for it. But if you don't KNOW all these things should be no problem. I'd make sure to ask about them... first.

Because if you find out they won't even let you do the things you're thinking about... better to know now rather than after you've outlaid the cash on a new bike. Cause if you find it wouldn't have panned out anyway, then maybe you'd just go ahead and buy one to bring you more joy on the sporting rides instead.

Idaho is pretty clear about what trails are open for motorized use and which vehicles they are approved for as well as the dates it is open. Depending on the area, a dirt bike can be a huge advantage because so many trails are open for use.

 

[TheGDog]

The bike you have will work out some time in on it and refine your skillz…may also want to gear it down a little so you can low grind in 1-2 there is a fine line you will learn on single track with roots rocks climbing off camber etc and then throw an elk quarter on and watch out…..and in the dark serious pucker factor I’ve seen some nasty wrecks on single track by hunters that are not riders and it can be dangerous….my ttr 250 is geared down a 2003 bought in 2005…my brother is using my old Honda xr200 from the 80s a great reliable option but the non suspension beats you to shit be safe and good luck

WHOA... that'd be dangerous as sh*t to ride with those elk antlers all stickin' out like that! Person would have to really remember those antlers are sticking way out when they are choosing their line. For sure a moto could help, but boy you sure could end up jacking up the antlers (and yourself) darn quick by passing just a little bit too close to a tree, Eek!

 

[TheGDog]

So we went from... "Looking for recommendations on motorcycles/dirt bikes for hunting" and recommending Yamaha TW 200's to now... "I actually plan to get into riding in general and then mesh it with my hunting" and recommending $8K Austrian bikes with $1K Rekluse clutches... You gotta watch these Roksliders... they will spend tour money!!!

Go Big Or Go Home Baby! You know how they say "Buy once Cry once" with optics? Well, It's even more pronounced with Motos.

Most notable differences are suspension components and their quality of ride, and then on a high quality Moto you can get a Hydraulic actuated clutch lever too, and they'll have high quality brake calipers and rotors so you're only needing to use 1 finger on the levers and you therefore then learn and practice to just keep 1-finger on them at all times as your level of riding gets more aggressive/hardcore.

 

[TheGDog]

I went through the same dilemma a few years back. Thought the dual sport sport was gonna be the ticket so I bought a Yamaha WR250R. It’s one of the lightest dual sports there is and I even spent more money on aftermarket parts and lightening it down to 285-290 pounds. It completely sucked on single track or any tight trail that was involved to get to hunting spots. Once I had my full pack on it was even worse and borderline dangerous since maneuverability was so slow.

I sold that bike after the first hunting season and bought a 2018 KTM 250 XC. This bike comes in around 215 pounds, has the quick power to get over stuff and is like riding a mountain bike when it comes to maneuvering. It truly is a dream to ride, and in the summer I go out and ride singletrack for fun and so the bike has doubled into two hobbies. Riding dual sports on singletrack sucks, as you’ve found out.

I also wanna add that I grew up racing dirt bikes so am comfortable on them, but I would not be afraid to throw a low-intermediate rider on a KTM XC or XC-W. The low 2-stroke power doesn’t come on as rapidly as a MX geared bike like a YZ, KX, or CR. Feel free to PM if you have anymore questions.

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For cross-country type bikes like the 250 XC, they typically have a slightly heavier flywheel on them so the power comes on slightly less violently in order to make them easier to deal with on precarious tight single-track trails. Also on newer bikes the ECU programming will be adjusted to improve low and mid range power more, as compared to an MX or Desert intended machine where they might try to skew them more towards the top end of the powerband. Also XC or WR type model tend to have 6spd gearboxes, or at least 5spd gearboxes where the ratios are wider between each gear.

Personally for an application like this, I'd prefer a 6spd transmission because then for sure you've got a real low 1st gear for those precarious parts of the trail.

Hey, how do you like running that Trials tire out back? Seen a lotta guys singing their praises for DualSport bikes.

 

[Ross]

WHOA... that'd be dangerous as sh*t to ride with those elk antlers all stickin' out like that! Person would have to really remember those antlers are sticking way out when they are choosing their line. For sure a moto could help, but boy you sure could end up jacking up the antlers (and yourself) darn quick by passing just a little bit too close to a tree, Eek!

No worries the bike and rider are used to elk tinesthe trail I ride is memorized with every little root rock and off camber…still makes me pucker in the dark….wish I took pics of all the bulls packed out on it….always slow and steady tap if needed otherwise staying on pegs and grinding it out….saved the body a crazy amount of heavy walking…

 

[nwdan]

I agree with some others, a TW200 would be a great choice. I had a CRF230L and liked it as well.

 

[Supranatural]

I hunt almost exclusively off a dirt bike. If you are a new rider I would recommend a 230 honda or yamaha. I ride a Honda 250x and a Yamaha yz250x. Stay away from motocross bikes and 450's. The 230 is the perfect hunting bike.

I’m going to be elk hunting this fall in Idaho, plan on bringing the dirt bikes due to the many trails I see and the websites for Idaho that promote dirt bike riding so we can scout the week prior to opening day and for hunting the first week of Archery season. When you hunt with a bike, how much gear do you wear? I’m a long time experienced rider (been riding for 4 decades plus including MX and enduro racing) while my sons are all very good riders…so I’m used to wearing boots, pants, chest protector, helmet of course, gloves, elbow and knee protectors - but seems like that would be too much for elk hunting…plus where the heck would I put all that gear where I park the bike before hiking in further? What is your approach to the riding gear, and do you lock up your bike when you get to where you want to hunt?

 

[DAOutfitters208]

I’m going to be elk hunting this fall in Idaho, plan on bringing the dirt bikes due to the many trails I see and the websites for Idaho that promote dirt bike riding so we can scout the week prior to opening day and for hunting the first week of Archery season. When you hunt with a bike, how much gear do you wear? I’m a long time experienced rider (been riding for 4 decades plus including MX and enduro racing) while my sons are all very good riders…so I’m used to wearing boots, pants, chest protector, helmet of course, gloves, elbow and knee protectors - but seems like that would be too much for elk hunting…plus where the heck would I put all that gear where I park the bike before hiking in further? What is your approach to the riding gear, and do you lock up your bike when you get to where you want to hunt?

I wear my hunting gear and that's it. I'm not riding as fast as I would when really riding single track.

 

[Supranatural]

I wear my hunting gear and that's it. I'm not riding as fast as I would when really riding single track.

I assume you wear helmet at least correct?

 

[Peaks&Creeks]

For cross-country type bikes like the 250 XC, they typically have a slightly heavier flywheel on them so the power comes on slightly less violently in order to make them easier to deal with on precarious tight single-track trails. Also on newer bikes the ECU programming will be adjusted to improve low and mid range power more, as compared to an MX or Desert intended machine where they might try to skew them more towards the top end of the powerband. Also XC or WR type model tend to have 6spd gearboxes, or at least 5spd gearboxes where the ratios are wider between each gear.

Personally for an application like this, I'd prefer a 6spd transmission because then for sure you've got a real low 1st gear for those precarious parts of the trail.

Hey, how do you like running that Trials tire out back? Seen a lotta guys singing their praises for DualSport bikes.

Yeah the XC does have a 6 speed transmission, and first gear is very low, and like you said is great for some real tight stuff. I can start from a standstill in second gear like it’s meant to be hahaha. I’d say first is definitely a granny gear and tops out at about 5 MPH.

The trials tire is awesome and sticks to everything. I don’t encounter much mud, which that’s the one area it lacks in, but it’s still fine after some rainfall on our harder packed western mountain trails. I also got rid of a traditional tube in the tire and went with a mousse bib. No more worrying about flat tires and it’s great piece of mind when coming out late after dark and the last thing you’d wanna do is change a flat in the dark.


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[TheGDog]

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The trials tire is awesome and sticks to everything. I don’t encounter much mud, which that’s the one area it lacks in, but it’s still fine after some rainfall on our harder packed western mountain trails. I also got rid of a traditional tube in the tire and went with a mousse bib. No more worrying about flat tires and it’s great piece of mind when coming out late after dark and the last thing you’d wanna do is change a flat in the dark.

QUESTIONS for you about those mousse bib's:

I was always curious how much those mousse bib's would affect how the bike handles.
Such as flickability in the tight stuff?
And also maybe knifing her hard into a turn I figure more rotating mass like that would provide more fight against the handlebars to invoke the turning when at speed.
How would it affect blasting along on some rocky sand-whoops in Victorville? The mousse bib.... what pressure of regular inner-tube is it's ride supposed to be mimicking? As usually I liked em pretty low so it could hook-up best as possible in the sand-washes you'd encounter in Gorman.

Oh Hey! Just thought of something! When running a mousse bib.... do you even need to use a RimLock anymore? Since there'd be no valve stem to shear off? Asking cause lotta DualSports don't come with RimLocks on em from the showrooom floor. I always had to order them after purchase.

-=-=-=-

Since a lotta folks didn't used to hardly ever even ride em all that much in the dirt. But I think that's changing more nowadays. And.. at Fwy speeds a RimLock will give ya some front-end shaking from the front wheel not being balanced once that RimLock is installed. To help a little you can put adhesive lead-weights on opposing side to try to counter-balance the weight of the RimLock throwing off balance.

But if you're mostly enjoying riding it in the dirt primarily, and street secondarily/occasionally... then don't even bother trying to counter-balance the RimLock, you won't notice that hardly at all in the dirt. Just because you're mostly bombing along trails chocked full of endless whoops anyway.

Oh and also for that DualSport, yank the goofy rubber footpeg inserts they sometimes have on the pegs to tame-down buzz thru the pegs at Fwy Speeds. You need that bite into the boots sole more instead out in the Desert. And then like once you have a fall or two, or smack a rock a bit and bend the stock footpegs.... that's when... it's good to think about upgrading to some WIDE aggressive spring-loaded footpegs. Helps to prevent having as much foot strain/stresses too like when hammering whoops or landing from jumps, since more surface area under the boot to spread around the force of the landing.

If it's a kickstart bike, with aftermarket WIDE pegs ya might have to grind off one or two teeth of the forward inside most area of the peg, so the kick lever can clear enough of the peg to achieve a full kick downward, otherwise you could snap a kickstarter lever if it's prematurely smacking into that peg on the way down. THAT is something you DO NOT want to have happen to you in the field! Have the freakin' kick-lever snap! Especially when I had that KX500! Thing was a Beast to kick over, especially since she was so tall! (We're soo spoiled these days with push-button starts on dirtbikes! I started on Husqvarna's where they kicked on the LeftHandSide of the bike and you had to dismount them, pull out kick-lever, and then perform a back-kick from standing, two fingers on the front brake to help hold her steady while you're kicking it over. When they were warmed up good, you could perform that kickstart from seated on the bike, with your non-dominant leg, because it would fire-up soo easily after being warmed up. You also learned to get good at bump-starting your bike if you happened to kill-it whilst braking downhill, like maybe ya panic braked and didn't quite get the clutch pulled-in before you hit the rear brake, or something like that. Since you're already proceeding downhill, ya just make sure you're in a gear that's not to low and let out the clutch while simultaneously kind landing butt back on the seat for a sec to weight the rear wheel a lil bit to help it bite into the soft stuff so it'll kick-over, rather than have compression-braking from the resistance of the compression stroke of the piston be stiff enough to disallow the rear knobbies to grab enough to overcome, without some help from the rider, from skidding thru the soft stuff and back-end wanna possibly side-swap a lil bit. Usually not an issue, but if the trail is a particularly narrow goat-trial type of line, where it's hardpack but with loose grit over it. You're gonna want that seat bump just to make sure the back end grabs right the first time and dumping the clutch let's it turn over the engine, easily firing it back up without skipping a beat. Very important the quick recovery on goat-trails, cause sometimes you need to be accelerating on the way down into a draw, to ensure you'll have the momentum needed and speed to make the climb and continue back up on the other side of that draw, especially if there's some kinda bad spot in the middle of that uphill line you're approaching. Like maybe ya gotta try to hard-cross a rut at some point, better to be carrying more speed so you can loft the front end, and clear it cleanly.

 

[Peaks&Creeks]

QUESTIONS for you about those mousse bib's:

I was always curious how much those mousse bib's would affect how the bike handles.
Such as flickability in the tight stuff?
And also maybe knifing her hard into a turn I figure more rotating mass like that would provide more fight against the handlebars to invoke the turning when at speed.
How would it affect blasting along on some rocky sand-whoops in Victorville? The mousse bib.... what pressure of regular inner-tube is it's ride supposed to be mimicking? As usually I liked em pretty low so it could hook-up best as possible in the sand-washes you'd encounter in Gorman.

Oh Hey! Just thought of something! When running a mousse bib.... do you even need to use a RimLock anymore? Since there'd be no valve stem to shear off? Asking cause lotta DualSports don't come with RimLocks on em from the showrooom floor. I always had to order them after purchase.

-=-=-=-

Since a lotta folks didn't used to hardly ever even ride em all that much in the dirt. But I think that's changing more nowadays. And.. at Fwy speeds a RimLock will give ya some front-end shaking from the front wheel not being balanced once that RimLock is installed. To help a little you can put adhesive lead-weights on opposing side to try to counter-balance the weight of the RimLock throwing off balance.

But if you're mostly enjoying riding it in the dirt primarily, and street secondarily/occasionally... then don't even bother trying to counter-balance the RimLock, you won't notice that hardly at all in the dirt. Just because you're mostly bombing along trails chocked full of endless whoops anyway.

Oh and also for that DualSport, yank the goofy rubber footpeg inserts they sometimes have on the pegs to tame-down buzz thru the pegs at Fwy Speeds. You need that bite into the boots sole more instead out in the Desert. And then like once you have a fall or two, or smack a rock a bit and bend the stock footpegs.... that's when... it's good to think about upgrading to some WIDE aggressive spring-loaded footpegs. Helps to prevent having as much foot strain/stresses too like when hammering whoops or landing from jumps, since more surface area under the boot to spread around the force of the landing.

If it's a kickstart bike, with aftermarket WIDE pegs ya might have to grind off one or two teeth of the forward inside most area of the peg, so the kick lever can clear enough of the peg to achieve a full kick downward, otherwise you could snap a kickstarter lever if it's prematurely smacking into that peg on the way down. THAT is something you DO NOT want to have happen to you in the field! Have the freakin' kick-lever snap! Especially when I had that KX500! Thing was a Beast to kick over, especially since she was so tall! (We're soo spoiled these days with push-button starts on dirtbikes! I started on Husqvarna's where they kicked on the LeftHandSide of the bike and you had to dismount them, pull out kick-lever, and then perform a back-kick from standing, two fingers on the front brake to help hold her steady while you're kicking it over. When they were warmed up good, you could perform that kickstart from seated on the bike, with your non-dominant leg, because it would fire-up soo easily after being warmed up. You also learned to get good at bump-starting your bike if you happened to kill-it whilst braking downhill, like maybe ya panic braked and didn't quite get the clutch pulled-in before you hit the rear brake, or something like that. Since you're already proceeding downhill, ya just make sure you're in a gear that's not to low and let out the clutch while simultaneously kind landing butt back on the seat for a sec to weight the rear wheel a lil bit to help it bite into the soft stuff so it'll kick-over, rather than have compression-braking from the resistance of the compression stroke of the piston be stiff enough to disallow the rear knobbies to grab enough to overcome, without some help from the rider, from skidding thru the soft stuff and back-end wanna possibly side-swap a lil bit. Usually not an issue, but if the trail is a particularly narrow goat-trial type of line, where it's hardpack but with loose grit over it. You're gonna want that seat bump just to make sure the back end grabs right the first time and dumping the clutch let's it turn over the engine, easily firing it back up without skipping a beat. Very important the quick recovery on goat-trails, cause sometimes you need to be accelerating on the way down into a draw, to ensure you'll have the momentum needed and speed to make the climb and continue back up on the other side of that draw, especially if there's some kinda bad spot in the middle of that uphill line you're approaching. Like maybe ya gotta try to hard-cross a rut at some point, better to be carrying more speed so you can loft the front end, and clear it cleanly.

So far I have not felt any difference in ride-ability from a regular tube to the mousse bib. The bibs come in different hardnesses. Mine happens to be the equivalent to a 13 PSI tube. They also make a 8 PSI equivalent. No rimlock needed. They are a huge PITA to install and a greasy mess. I paid my local shop to install them for me last time. There’s plenty of you tube videos on how to install them and some guys make it look easy, but for me it was like fighting a greased up Michelin Man. But once they are on they are just awesome and let’s me ride over technical terrain without worry about pinch flats or any of that other flat tire nonsense. They last me about 3-5 seasons depending how often you ride. As they wear down they start to get softer. Coming up on their 4th year and the rear is starting to feel somewhere in the 8-9 PSI range, and the front maybe in the 10-11 PSI range. I would think after this upcoming season I’ll be buying a new set.


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[DAOutfitters208]

I assume you wear helmet at least correct?

Nope. I just take it easy.

 

[TheGDog]

Nope. I just take it easy.

Brother.... coming from a place of love and experience... please.... if not for yourself then for the people that depend on you... wear a freakin' Helmet Dude.

Your cranium can't even handle a Fall that's juuust right (wrong) at speeds you're capable of propelling yourself under your own power. All it takes is for the happen-stance of a rock or branch or root to just-so-happen to stick-up where your head comes down at, and you're EFF'd.

I'd have been dead at 17yo if it were not for Helmets man.

 

[Jimss]

Boy there are a lot of posts on this. I didn't read through them. What's super important to me for a scouting and hunting bike is being quiet and dependable. I had a big wheel for years and it was horrible...beat me to death with the wide tires. It was quiet though.

I then upgraded to a Honda XR250. It has plenty of power to cover lots of country, pretty quiet, extremely dependable. I just wish it had a switch start rather than having to kick start! It does take a while to start up on cold days or if it hasn't been ridden for months. I'm not even sure if they make XR's any more but if you can find a low hours one it would be a great bike to have!

 

[DAOutfitters208]

Brother.... coming from a place of love and experience... please.... if not for yourself then for the people that depend on you... wear a freakin' Helmet Dude.

Your cranium can't even handle a Fall that's juuust right (wrong) at speeds you're capable of propelling yourself under your own power. All it takes is for the happen-stance of a rock or branch or root to just-so-happen to stick-up where your head comes down at, and you're EFF'd.

I'd have been dead at 17yo if it were not for Helmets man.

You’re right. Made me reflect on my choices in the past. I feel like I am extremely cautious when riding the bike during hunting season, but even a BW 200 can get you in trouble. It has and I’m probably lucky. I tricked myself into feeling safe.

So when hunting and riding a motorcycle, wear a helmet you all!

It’s also a great idea to tuck your pants into your boots or wear gaiters to mitigate snagging your pant legs on a foot peg.