Most reliable and shootable 9mm semi auto pistols

[atmat]

Good point, and more importantly, can't say it does/will work, without some data there as well.

Sure. But certainly there are gel tests that show penetration through flesh. There are likely some with barriers, as well.

And you can test shootability/accuracy/speed between it and larger calibers.

And you can logic that 9mm isn’t much larger than 5.5mm in comparison to the size of a bear.

All of that would seem to paint a picture of it being a viable, if not good, option.

 

[HuntHarder]

This is really the crux of the debate.

If we don’t have data on this because people haven’t tested it, then we can’t and shouldn’t say it doesn’t work.

Most people having success against bears with 9mm and above is probably correlation (to the high number of users of 9mm+) than causation.

I don't think anyone said " it can't or doesn't work"

 

[HuntHarder]

9mm isn't much larger than 5.5mm? . Quit it

 

[atmat]

9mm isn't much larger than 5.5mm? . Quit it

I know your schtick is to jump into logical conversations with silly arguments. But why don’t you include the whole quote:

9mm isn’t much larger than 5.5mm in comparison to the size of a bear.

You think 3.5mm is a large percentage of a bear’s size? . Quit it.

 

[HuntHarder]

Easy hype man.. Form doesn't need your terrible argument help...

I know your shtick is to try and ride, but carve your own trail....

 

[Schmo]

It’s really okay, no one said anyone else has to use a 22 WMR. Use what you want, I’ll use what I want

 

[HighUintas]

Good point, and more importantly, can't say it does/will work, without some data there as well.

I had no issues beta testing the 223 on a frontal shot grizzly...but I had lots of personal data, and data from others before testing that idea out. Someone else can beta test this one. That said, especially with better information, a lot of people have come away from "44 mag at a minimum for bear defense", maybe this will be the same (?).

Hang on.... You killed a grizzly with 223? Is that in a thread somewhere?

 

[ElPollo]

Hang on.... You killed a grizzly with 223? Is that in a thread somewhere?

T

Post in thread '.223 for bear, mountain goat, deer, elk, and moose.'

May 31, 2024

Never fear, the 77TMK is here...


I got this bear last night. Only squares around 7' so not a big boar, but plenty big to ruin your day if he so decided.

I wasn't interested in a broadside lung shot...boring...I have zero doubt a 77TMK makes it through the lungs/heart in that situation and kills the bear. I really wanted to test the "but what about hunting with a 223 around grizzlies/brown bears?" question that continues to come up here and there. So, yes, let's see what happens with a non-preferred shot, at least in an example of one.

I really was hoping for a full...

• Thegman

• 
• 
• 

 

[doc holiday13]

If you're okay with glock the s&w m&p 2.0. amazing gun. easy to. Shoot good triggers

 

[jonpall]

Also OP, I believe you're in my same zip code and I have a P365xl, hellcat pro, pmr30 and a few others if you ever want to borrow them and test them out you are welcome to it.

 

[HighUintas]

T

Post in thread '.223 for bear, mountain goat, deer, elk, and moose.'

May 31, 2024

Never fear, the 77TMK is here...


I got this bear last night. Only squares around 7' so not a big boar, but plenty big to ruin your day if he so decided.

I wasn't interested in a broadside lung shot...boring...I have zero doubt a 77TMK makes it through the lungs/heart in that situation and kills the bear. I really wanted to test the "but what about hunting with a 223 around grizzlies/brown bears?" question that continues to come up here and there. So, yes, let's see what happens with a non-preferred shot, at least in an example of one.

I really was hoping for a full...

• Thegman

• 
• 
• 

Thanks! I somehow missed that post

Also OP, I believe you're in my same zip code and I have a P365xl, hellcat pro, pmr30 and a few others if you ever want to borrow them and test them out you are welcome to it.

Thanks for the offer. I may PM you

 

[omicron1792]

This is really the crux of the debate.

If we don’t have data on this because people haven’t tested it, then we can’t and shouldn’t say it doesn’t work.

Most people having success against bears with 9mm and above is probably correlation (to the high number of users of 9mm+) than causation.

I’ve never jumped off a roof and flown before. Doesn’t mean you “can’t and shouldn’t say it doesn’t work.”

 

[Lonewolf72]

It seems to me for those that like Glock reliability yet despise Glock ergonomics, that a Glock-clone such as a Shadow Systems with a more-vertical grip angle could be a solution for a lot of people.

After being a longtime Sig carrier (228, 229, 220 and 365 X/XL), experience with 226, 239 and 320s as well as other brands, and suffering through several Glocks, I selected the Shadow Systems MR920 and DR920 as the foundation for self-defense. That said, the 365XL is my all-occasions carry piece with it's relatively small/flat footprint, good reliability and decent trigger. IMHO opinion, the longer XL barrel carries slightly better than the standard 365 or X, and less likely to rollover or lever out from your waist. It seems to me the 365XL with one of the 12 or 15 round mags or one of the Macros would make for an ergonomic, compact, controllable and reliable woods carry if not opting for something larger.

 

[atmat]

I’ve never jumped off a roof and flown before. Doesn’t mean you “can’t and shouldn’t say it doesn’t work.”

Lol what? This is an asinine comparison.

But, okay, I’ll play along:

• You know you can’t fly taking off from the ground
• You know other humans can’t fly
• You can study anatomy to compare flying animals vs humans and see they’re different.

Thus, it would be dumb to think you could fly from a building and even dumber to test it.


This is fundamentally different than being able to take analytical data and extrapolate it to a viable hypothesis.

 

[atmat]

Easy hype man.. Form doesn't need your terrible argument help...

I know your shtick is to try and ride, but carve your own trail....

I don’t know what any of that is alluding to.

I rarely shoot handguns and do not carry in the woods. I don’t care what you or others carry or don’t carry. My original post in this thread was strictly in relation to someone making inferences from data that may not be appropriate based on the data shared.

With that said: you can engage in logical debate, or you can hop in with pithy one-liners and use the laugh emoji anytime you disagree with someone. You traditionally choose the second one, so I’ll just toss you on ignore for now.

 

[Timjohnson11]

CZ Shadow 2 Compact if you have to have a 9mm… Walther PDP Pro E would be runner up.

That said, you should consider the M&P 5.7. It’s the most shotable compact handgun on the market today in my opinion. I sold all my 9mms, I just feel more lethal and accurate with it. It’s the 6 creed of the pistol world

 

[Stache Attack]

Shield arm mags will get you 15 and have extended capabilities for the Glock 48. Stick to the recent gens as the first gen reliability was a little lower.

Sent from my SM-S916U using Tapatalk

Yes they will, exact reason I said with stock mag. I have become to love stock reliability. I do run shields in my wife’s gun when we go to the range, Magpul/ets in mine, very little issues, but, and I say but… I have had every one malfunction depending on ammo where as a stock Glock mag hasn’t failed with steel, brass, or nice plated

 

[Lawnboi]

CZ Shadow 2 Compact if you have to have a 9mm… Walther PDP Pro E would be runner up.

That said, you should consider the M&P 5.7. It’s the most shotable compact handgun on the market today in my opinion. I sold all my 9mms, I just feel more lethal and accurate with it. It’s the 6 creed of the pistol world

Re the 5.7 m&p. Guaranteed to scare the bear, that pistol is loud as hell! I couldn’t get along with the skinny wide grip, maybe with a hogue grip or similar maybe I could have made it work. It’s an interesting option for sure. Wish they sold it without the threaded barrel.

 

[HighUintas]

It seems to me for those that like Glock reliability yet despise Glock ergonomics, that a Glock-clone such as a Shadow Systems with a more-vertical grip angle could be a solution for a lot of people.

After being a longtime Sig carrier (228, 229, 220 and 365 X/XL), experience with 226, 239 and 320s as well as other brands, and suffering through several Glocks, I selected the Shadow Systems MR920 and DR920 as the foundation for self-defense. That said, the 365XL is my all-occasions carry piece with it's relatively small/flat footprint, good reliability and decent trigger. IMHO opinion, the longer XL barrel carries slightly better than the standard 365 or X, and less likely to rollover or lever out from your waist. It seems to me the 365XL with one of the 12 or 15 round mags or one of the Macros would make for an ergonomic, compact, controllable and reliable woods carry if not opting for something larger.

In your experience with the sigs why do you think the 229 sao is not more popular since the trigger might be vastly better than a striker pistol?

I am liking the idea of the 365 fuse's size. The grip felt great and the longer barrel seems that it could help with accuracy. Basically a macro with a 0.6" longer barrel and a mag well

 

[Dioni A]

What is a high enough round count through a pistol and number of failures to call a pistol reliable? what conditions should the gun be run under?

I watched @Formidilosus throw a staccato to prove it's reliability. He's got somewhere around 60,000 rounds on that gun with only having to replace one part. At this point I don't question his gun advice any more. Lol