Mid-Layer Shootout Review ***Updated 2/18/23***

[Texasbuckeye]

^ had to look that one up; funny they didn't add a dwr to the Heavyweight too????

The hvywt hoody is not designed to be an outer. It is a grid fleece base/mid deaigned to go under something else.

I know we all know that.

 

[mtwarden]

The Origin fleece had DWR on it; was surprised, but it actually works decently. Might have to refresh it down the road, but that's true with all DWR's.

If you look at the Grinder, it sure looks very (very) similar to the Heavyweight- they added DWR to it.

 

[Fins_N_Tines]

I wonder how the KUIU strongfleece 260 compares to the FL Origin hoody? They both have hard face fleece with non grid inner fleece. Also both have kangaroo pocket.

 

[Texasbuckeye]

I wonder how the KUIU strongfleece 260 compares to the FL Origin hoody? They both have hard face fleece with non grid inner fleece. Also both have kangaroo pocket.

I like my strongfleece 260 but if is a warm piece that does not breathe well, in my experience. I feel the temperature range for the strongfleece 260 is much narrower than these reviewed.
Just my 2cents.

 

[Icelk]

I use mostly kuiu peloton and merino pieces but in the budget category I also think the condor base is a decent option for only around $25

 

[Farmerlentz]

yup- that's a good one too

https://www.rokslide.com/sitka-arrowhead-equipment-mdwi-hoody-review/

Is this still a contender or does the ambient surpass it. I had been eyeing the arrowhead before your review.

 

[mtwarden]

Thanks Folks!

Is this still a contender or does the ambient surpass it. I had been eyeing the arrowhead before your review.

IMHO they are about the same performance wise. Very similar performance between Alpha Direct and Evolve is my conclusion; the two jackets use similar weight insulation-so about equal warmth wise. The Ambient outer fabric might be slightly more permeable, but not much. The MDWi is full zip which is a plus for me, as well as hand pockets- no outer pockets on the Ambient. Ambient is a couple of ounces lighter though.

 

[feanor]

Thanks for the write up and the time spent on the review. Great to see the pieces get put through a test that gives some thought to moisture management in cold temps.

 

[Bbell12]

@mtwarden you mentioned wind shirts in your review, what are some good ones you can recommend?

 

[mtwarden]

Thanks!

@mtwarden you mentioned wind shirts in your review, what are some good ones you can recommend?

The two I use for hunting are the Black Diamond Alpine Start and the now hard to find Patagonia one made for the military, both of these are a little heavier denier (more durable) than the standard fare ultralight ones, but do a good job in slowing the wind (and light precip) and breathability.

Outside of hunting, I use a Patagonia Houdini- it works well and is very light, but not durable enough for hunting imo.

I purchased a Sitka Flash some years ago (discontinued now), but it's lack of breathability has rendered it an rain jacket when there is low probability of rain. It stops the wind great (Gore Windstopper) and is on the verge of waterproof, but doesn't breathe enough on the move.

 

[Bobrunner06]

Thank you MtWarden for this great review. It's funny that while they are all "mid Layers" they all have somewhat of their own hunting use niche. Pretty strong trend between warmth and price too (which I kind of expected). I was definitely curious about the new Cirque lite. As you are aware SG also has their Helio hoody that would be more comparable to the Vigor. Different stokes for different uses I suppose. The crux of the mid layer battle would be the most versatile, which I think you demonstrated with your categories (temp range, wind proofness and water resistance). Great job!

 

[BadBrian]

What?....4 brands is a shootout??? NOPE!!

Where is:
Kuiu
Pnuma
North Face
Mountain Hardware
hell, even Condor
etc etc etc.....

 

[twall13]

What?....4 brands is a shootout??? NOPE!!

Where is:
Kuiu
Pnuma
North Face
Mountain Hardware
hell, even Condor
etc etc etc.....

Given the nature of the review process on this one I think it would have been incredibly difficult to accurately test more than 4 pieces under similar circumstances. Sure we'd all like to see more pieces included but I value the process on this one much more than the number of pieces tested. I think it gives you a good mix of midlayer types and how they perform. Find a similar layer that has the features you like from whatever brand and it's likely to perform similarly to those tested depending on the fabric characteristics you go for. Waffle fleece, vs. hard face fleece, etc.

Sent from my Pixel 6 using Tapatalk

 

[jlively]

Given the nature of the review process on this one I think it would have been incredibly difficult to accurately test more than 4 pieces under similar circumstances. Sure we'd all like to see more pieces included but I value the process on this one is much more than the number of pieces tested. I think it gives you a good mix of midlayer types and how they perform. Find a similar layer that has the features you like from whatever brand and it's likely to perform similarly to those tested depending on the fabric characteristics you go for. Waffle fleece, vs. hard face fleece, etc.

Sent from my Pixel 6 using Tapatalk

I agree with that. There was an incredible amount of work put in by @mtwarden in this review and adding pieces would probably have diluted the content.

Another piece of great information provided @mtwarden.

 

[mtwarden]

Thanks Guys!

Yeah we definitely wanted to limit the numbers to four or five- and include a variety of styles of mid-layers. The guys did try several times contacting Kuiu (was looking at the Kenai) to include one of its pieces, to no avail.

 

[sawsington]

What?....4 brands is a shootout??? NOPE!!

Where is:
Kuiu
Pnuma
North Face
Mountain Hardware
hell, even Condor
etc etc etc.....

Looking forward to your review of those.

 

[WeiserBucks]

@mtwarden thanks for the effort and great write up! But you need to cheer up a little, in most of the pictures you look like you're about to review a punching bag

 

[mtwarden]

thanks

@mtwarden thanks for the effort and great write up! But you need to cheer up a little, in most of the pictures you look like you're about to review a punching bag

did my wife put you up to that? she says we have a total of maybe three pictures where I'm smiling!

 

[WeiserBucks]

thanks did my wife put you up to that? she says we have a total of maybe three pictures where I'm smiling!

I don't know your wife but in some of the pictures you look like you're preparing to fight some guy who just kicked your puppy

 

[Neumie]

Nice review! Probably the most thorough I’ve seen.