Medrino back to synthetics?

[Matt W.]

Merino may take longer to dry than synthetics, but there isnt a synthetic on the planet yet that retains the heat retention abilities when wet like merino does.

I hunt the PNW, which is dry most of the summer/early season then a monsoon in the late seasons and spring. I love merino in all conditions over synthetics. You may be right that synthetics will dry slightly easier, but are not as warm when they are wet and wick away moisture far better than any of the synthetics I have tried. To me it feels like you sweat less in merino, since it wicks away the mositure so much better than synthetics.

In fact I often go for a run up in the coast range. Its raining/misting almost every day during the fall/spring and merino is best for running in wet weather without overheating, yet still staying warm.

This was my assumption as well. I swear this has been my experience yet this guy's studies make me doubt... I to prefer to run in a light merino layer when its raining. (See Post #36)
http://woodtrekker.blogspot.com/2012...nsulation.html
http://woodtrekker.blogspot.com/2012...-when-wet.html

 

[charvey9]

This was my assumption as well. I swear this has been my experience yet this guy's studies make me doubt... I to prefer to run in a light merino layer when its raining. (See Post #36)
http://woodtrekker.blogspot.com/2012...nsulation.html
http://woodtrekker.blogspot.com/2012...-when-wet.html

Can't get those links to work.

 

[charvey9]

Also....

"Synthetics" might be a generalized term. Maybe there are some materials out there that compete with Merino. My experience with synthetics has been primarily Under Armour and Nike athletic apparel and base layers.

 

[jquarnberg]

I have sworn off merino base layers for the reasons in the OP. It seems heavier and hotter, stinks bad when its wet, less durable, and the cost is high. I always have on cotton or blend underwear on top and bottom so I feel like that takes from any of the merino benefits.

 

[dangerousD]

I have sworn off merino base layers for the reasons in the OP. It seems heavier and hotter, stinks bad when its wet, less durable, and the cost is high. I always have on cotton or blend underwear on top and bottom so I feel like that takes from any of the merino benefits.

Like you said, seems like wearing cotton would totally negate the advantage of merino. Maybe try it again as the base layer.

I have pretty much transitioned to merino for the majority of my base layer and mid layer. Sometimes mid layer is still synthetic of some sort. Like others, I love to wear a thin merino top when running in the cold or misty conditions when training. I still wear synthetic for some workouts and summer training, but it's pretty much all merino for hunting. Many of my synthetics are just permanently scarred with pit stank. I can't hardly wear synthetic for 10 minutes of exertion before the smell gets offensive... Sometimes I will still wear synthetic underwear for a hunt just for the fit, but pretty much require a wash everyday.

 

[Matt W.]

Can't get those links to work.

http://woodtrekker.blogspot.com/2012/11/fleece-vs-wool-insulation.html
http://woodtrekker.blogspot.com/2012/03/does-wool-keep-you-warm-when-wet.html

They work for me? I posted them again, hopefully that does it for you. ??

 

[worx53]

This was my assumption as well. I swear this has been my experience yet this guy's studies make me doubt... I to prefer to run in a light merino layer when its raining. (See Post #36)
http://woodtrekker.blogspot.com/2012...nsulation.html
http://woodtrekker.blogspot.com/2012...-when-wet.html

Some comments about the tests: cool test and data but I think whats missing is what we perceive and what actually happens on our skin vs. plastic etc. . I believe because merino pulls moisture off/away from the skin it actually feels warmer than synthetics when wet. The test cant duplicate this. Why does a breeze feel cool if the temperature is the same?> There are complicated processes of convection, evaporation, conduction and I don't know what else that keeps us cool or warms us up. To me my thin merino dries faster, doesn't smell, and keeps me warmer than any synthetics I've tried. I think the moisture pulled away from the skin and the natural body heat creates a warmer feel than any of my synthetics. The tests don't show that part of the process.
Real neat stuff though.

 

[Matt W.]

Worx53, I'm with ya. I like the thicker merino for casual use, but for field use I much prefer the thin stuff and layer as needed. It works great for up here in Alaska.

 

[todd kelly]

some interesting testing....



[video=youtube;ptL0jRgEjks]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ptL0jRgEjks[/video]

 

[todd kelly]

[video=youtube;AaZqAfgHXvE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AaZqAfgHXvE[/video]

 

[justinspicher]

I have always used synthetics, but I want to try merino wool. I think when it slows down here at work I am going to check those two videos out.

 

[Travis1984]

Merino IMO is far superior to synthetics.

 

[rodney.black]

I use all merino for my baselayers and have been really happy with it. If a company comes out with a synthetic that has the same performance benefits as merino I would be willing to try it. For what is on the market right now, Merino is my top choice.

 

[elkmtngear]

Merino for me after years of synthetics...mostly for the "funk factor". Can't see switching back.

And, between the rain shell and the umbrella/decoy, I'm not really getting very wet on my elk hunts.

 

[DaveC]

People still wear cotton underwear in the woods? Seriously? 20 bucks on some nice synthetic or wool boxer-briefs is the best money you will ever spend on clothing, in your life.

Merino can feel warmer when damp because the wool fibers and hydrophilic. They absorb water, thus moving it away from your skin, and then allow it to evaporate in a controlled manner, thus taking the edge of convective cooling. Of course, under some conditions it's easy to max out the materials ability to absorb moisture, and thus you end up wet.

Polyester on the other had is hydrophobic, and when poly layers get wet they're really only getting wet in between the fibers. Ergo, faster drying and more immediate evaporative cooling.

It's a good idea in cool to cold weather to build some manner of partial vapor barrier into your clothing system, i.e. a layer which slows down evaporative cooling, ideally without becoming a sponge itself. Merino layers against the skin serve this purpose, but the approach doesn't allow for any modulation in the rate of evaporation. Powerdry HE against the skin moves water super fast, and you can put another layer over top of it which then slows down evaporation.

If stink is a concern, I suggest golf.

 

[Hunt'nFish]

Merino when it warm-hot, synthetic when it's cool-cold.
It all boils down to rate of evaporation, some times you want moisture to evaporate slow (Merino) and other times you want it to evaporate fast (Synthetic).
That said, I know all synthetics are NOT created equal.

But I sure like my Polartec stuff. Not sure if it's polygiene stuff or not,
I'll have to pay attention to the labels in the future.
Hunt'nFish

 

[ohoopee]

Woolpower is very comfortable and very warm. (60% Merino, 25% Polyester, 13% Polyamide and 2% Elastane).

 

[Evan Williams]

Merino! Merino! Merino! Read the article Merino Wool ;-)

 

[Wood Trekker]

Just a comment on the above links to my blog, since they were brought up, and the test they show:

For what they are worth, the tests show the insulation loss and retention by synthetic vs. wool fabrics when wet. The tests largely showed that both materials lose about the same amount of insulation when they get wet, and that the insulation loss is significant. So in that sense, wool is not warmer when wet than synthetic fabrics.

There is however another side to all this, and it's the reason why many people think that wool retains its insulation when wet, even though it does not. The faster drying time of synthetic insulation (in many cases much faster), creates a feeling of coolness against the skin. The fabric dries by letting the water evaporate faster. The evaporation process creates cooling. That is why we often feel a chill after getting wet in synthetic clothing. The insulation loss from getting wet is about the same, but the faster drying material feels cooler while drying. Wool spreads out that chill over a longer drying period, so it is less noticeable, even though it persists for a longer period of time. The overall amount of cooling from evaporation is the same, it is just that it is concentrated in a shorter period of time with synthetic insulation, so we feel it more.

At least that's my understanding.

 

[2ski]

I'm curious how everyone dries their synthetics after washing. A few years ago I came across a company called Fire in the Gut that made some baselayers. The owner claimed you were supposed to dry your synthetics in the dryer and that kind of "reactivated" the material and it performed better. I had been drying mine prior to that by hang drying them. My experience was the same as above where it didn't take much excursion to make them start to smell. Not unbearable but still they smelled. Since then, I have started drying my sythetics in the dryer on low or med. heat and have noticed a huge difference. I'm not saying they can't get a smell, but it has lessened it greatly.