Mechanical and Civil Engineering

[CodeMonkey]

Mechanical engineers build weapons. Civil engineers build targets.

 

[WKR]

Civil
Gain experience with a company that does structures
Obtain a PE
Go self employed or atleast do side jobs after he has enough experience and knowledge

Thats a good way to make a few million and retire early.

It all depends on how ambitious a person is though

 

[mooretitan]

Thanks for the input. I did tell him more than likely after a few years in he would be moving up into management or sales. I really think that is where he will be best at. He is a people person by nature but also has a good work ethic and responsibility. The degree will just be the starting point that will open up more opportunities.
He talked about getting a summer job this year and working through his senior year to save money. Unless he gets some good scholarships he will be starting out at a JC and then transferring out. He said he plans to work through JC. If he does this he should have minimum debt when he graduates.
Also by doing two years at a JC it should give him more opportunities to really look into each field before taking the final push to a university and fully committing to a field.
Idaho is probably the front runner on where he wants to go.

 

[mustelid_master]

I am an Electrical Engineer, and I would say to not overlook that. If he is interested in working in the power industry, there are utilities all over the west. They can be harder to get into, but if you get into them they have great time off, good pay (electricals usually make more then civils or mechanicals), and a good work life balance. I work for a company that makes electronic devices for the industry and got a job in idaho straight out of college from michigan.

Most utilities I am aware of can't fill electrical spots. Too many people retiring and not enough people coming out of school with the right skillset.

 

[CodeMonkey]

Yea but if you do EE you'll have to do lots of stupid math involving Maxwell's equations.

 

[FruitSnackEnthusiat]

Yea but if you do EE you'll have to do lots of stupid math involving Maxwell's equations.

Just for college, then we don't worry about it after. Plus we get to make more money

 

[IdahoBeav]

Great thread until you bashed the Imaginary Engineers. I am a Georgia Tech Industrial Engineer. I did very well supervising all the smarter "real" engineers over my 30+ year career and - yes - managing engineers is more lucrative than "just" being and individual contributor. Sales Engineers probably are the most lucrative roles but I am too honest.

It's not a bash. It's just a different career, and I gave my opinion based on my experience and observation as both a civil engineering student and professional in industry. My own uncle is near the end of what has been a very lucrative career as an IE with a manufacturing company, but that's a different industry than civil.

 

[S.Clancy]

Great thread until you bashed the Imaginary Engineers. I am a Georgia Tech Industrial Engineer. I did very well supervising all the smarter "real" engineers over my 30+ year career and - yes - managing engineers is more lucrative than "just" being and individual contributor. Sales Engineers probably are the most lucrative roles but I am too honest.

It's not a bash. It's just a different career, and I gave my opinion based on my experience and observation as both a civil engineering student and professional in industry. My own uncle is near the end of what has been a very lucrative career as an IE with a manufacturing company, but that's a different industry than civil.

My GF is IE and I am a CE. Really, the difference between IE and other engineers boils down to this. An IE will tell you how/why/etc something should be done, but they have no idea on how to actually do it (design). A real engineer has to design/implement it, then the IE takes credit for it. Simple

 

[kad11]

I'd strongly advise you to help him identify his natural strengths and weaknesses, and then try to determine what career fields would align with his strengths.

I graduated civil in 2010, taught for 5 years, then got a master's in environmental and have been working in air quality since 2018. I'm fortunate to have found a job that is as much blue collar as it is white collar work with good pay, flexibility and autonomy. Honestly though, I was a WAY better teacher than I am an engineer - it was just a better fit for my natural strengths.

I don't think many are wired to be traditional engineers - I know A LOT of guys with engineering degrees that are now in completely different career fields.

That said, there's lots of opportunities in engineering and it's never a bad degree to have...

 

[FruitSnackEnthusiat]

I'd strongly advise you to help him identify his natural strengths and weaknesses, and then try to determine what career fields would align with his strengths.

I graduated civil in 2010, taught for 5 years, then got a master's in environmental and have been working in air quality since 2018. I'm fortunate to have found a job that is as much blue collar as it is white collar work with good pay, flexibility and autonomy. Honestly though, I was a WAY better teacher than I am an engineer - it was just a better fit for my natural strengths.

I don't think many are wired to be traditional engineers - I know A LOT of guys with engineering degrees that are now in completely different career fields.

That said, there's lots of opportunities in engineering and it's never a bad degree to have...

I am going to add on to this, and emphasis look at the career field and the job, and let that determine what classes you take. Don't try to dodge a degree or specific classes, because they are too hard. The example I always like to give is to compare mechanical engineering (ME) vs mechanical engineering technology (MET) degree. At my college, both were 4 year degrees, costing the same amount of money, but MET was much easier then ME course wise, and that career field is usually more hands on. But you are limiting what fields and jobs you can do, and you are limiting your pay. A ME can get more of a MET style job, but the inverse is not usually true. Plus a ME will usually be paid more then a MET even for a very similar job.

 

[IdahoBeav]

My GF is IE and I am a CE. Really, the difference between IE and other engineers boils down to this. An IE will tell you how/why/etc something should be done, but they have no idea on how to actually do it (design). A real engineer has to design/implement it, then the IE takes credit for it. Simple

IEs don't take credit for my work because there aren't any IEs. Most of the ladder on up to the top (and everyone with the title of engineer) all have civil PE credentials & licensure, a civil degree, and experience serving as EOR on significant projects. They no longer do hands-on engineering work, but they put their time in years ago and fully understand civil design.

 

[Vids]

I'm a civil working in the Denver area. There are a lot of job opportunities as a civil in Colorado, we have a far more difficult time finding good graduate level engineers nowadays as compared to 20 years ago. As others have mentioned, he'll advance to better positions/higher pay if he takes the road of marketing and management after a few years rather than just designing projects.

Another thought for career advancement would be to get a masters in business or law, rather than a technical masters. I have a MBA and it has served me well. My experience has been the guys with a masters in engineering get stuck in a dark corner running more complicated analyses than the other engineers, but I don't know that it got them ahead in their career. More power to them if that's where their interests lie, but that wasn't me.

 

[CodeMonkey]

Great thread until you bashed the Imaginary Engineers. I am a Georgia Tech Industrial Engineer. I did very well supervising all the smarter "real" engineers over my 30+ year career and - yes - managing engineers is more lucrative than "just" being and individual contributor. Sales Engineers probably are the most lucrative roles but I am too honest.

Selling feet pics on the internet is also lucrative, but doesn't mean you'll earn anyone's respect. Kinda like how everyone I know who has stayed technical (yes, even in technical leadership roles) rolls their eyes at managers who can't comprehend anything that they're doing. You can stay technical and hands on and still make a living.

If you just want to make money, why not go into finance? I think the reason why there are "real" engineers is because people are genuinely interested in how things work and not how to manage a team of said people.

 

[mtntppr]

I'm a civil working in the Denver area. There are a lot of job opportunities as a civil in Colorado, we have a far more difficult time finding good graduate level engineers nowadays as compared to 20 years ago. As others have mentioned, he'll advance to better positions/higher pay if he takes the road of marketing and management after a few years rather than just designing projects.

Another thought for career advancement would be to get a masters in business or law, rather than a technical masters. I have a MBA and it has served me well. My experience has been the guys with a masters in engineering get stuck in a dark corner running more complicated analyses than the other engineers, but I don't know that it got them ahead in their career. More power to them if that's where their interests lie, but that wasn't me.

Yeah, MBA or finance. Mathematical/computational finance tends to pay very well. Same with law. Intellectual Property (IP) law with an engineering background. Those are scarce skill sets.

It's a trade-off. It's a lot of school, but it can be worth it in the long run. I don't know what those jobs look like in ID, MT, WY...in Denver, he'd be fine.

 

[Mighty Mouse]

1. Job availability in these states
2. Pay
3. Time off for hunting and fishing
4. Quality of life
5. Job growth opportunities

I can't speak to #1 in the locales you mentioned. #2-5 can vary widely between specific industries and companies. IME two weeks per year of time off is pretty typical for new hires, but there are exceptions.

Get as much non-core and 101-level coursework out of the way as possible while he's still in high school. I started college with 21 credit hours earned via combination of dual-credit high school classes, CLEP exam, and an online summer class at a local community college. This allowed me to get my bachelor's degree in mechanical engineering in 7 semesters with a moderate courseload per semester.

While he's in college, he should use the summers to intern at different companies to get a look from the inside. Also, he should take the Fundamentals of Engineering (FE) exam during his senior year. Even if he thinks he doesn’t need/want to get a PE license, get the FE knocked out anyway while the content is fresh.

If he can stomach living in Denver and the volatile nature of the industry, pay and benefits at an oil & gas company are hard to beat. Petroleum engineering would be the logical choice for an O&G career, but it pigeonholes you into that industry. Lots of folks with mechanical and chemical engineering degrees get hired into O&G, and those degrees give you more flexibility to change industries. You meet some electricals and civils in O&G too but not as many. I spent my first 11 years post-college in Texas then Oklahoma in various engineering roles for O&G companies. I enjoyed the work well enough but was ultimately in it for the money and left the industry once I saved up enough to buy some land back home in Missouri. I'm now making less than half what I was previously, but I'm where I want to be long term and close to family.

 

[Crowmangler]

I'm a civil/ structural PE.
I started out in ME. After taking thermodynamics, heat transfer, etc. I decided I was no longer going to be a ME & switched to civil. That shit is hard & it takes a completely different mindset so I would suggest he visit a couple schools in person & get and idea what each program entails.
Also talk to some companies to get an idea what that career path will look like as well.

The best suggestion I would give is to work his 4 years, get his PE and network along the way to leverage his connections to start his own business. That's where it's at

 

[hikenhunt]

I was in your sons shoes about 22 years ago, trying to select between CE and ME. I ultimately chose ME because it seemed to have a slight advantage for types of careers afterwards and wanted to leave that as open as possible. I thought it was hard enough just narrowing down a major at the time. In the end, I work where CE and ME are pretty much interchangeable.

 

[Shortschaf]

I did civil initially in college and hated the curriculum. After an internship found I hated the work I'd be in in my state. It is all road construction.

Switched to mechanical and never looked back. As long as he gets internships to try-before-you-buy, he'll be good. Both degrees are great in their own way

Great thread until you bashed the Imaginary Engineers. I am a Georgia Tech Industrial Engineer. I did very well supervising all the smarter "real" engineers over my 30+ year career and - yes - managing engineers is more lucrative than "just" being and individual contributor. Sales Engineers probably are the most lucrative roles but I am too honest.

I tend to agree with IdahoBeav that choosing one of the big three (Civil, Mech, or Electrical engineering) is wiser than doing a "more niche" engineering degree like industrial, biomedical, aerospace, environmental, etc. UNLESS the candidate is in love with it.

Leaves options open

 

[Cheesy]

ME here, not in the mountain west. Graduated in 2003. I work for a mega-large dairy company. Started out of college as a maintenance supervisor, then got into special projects, then became a project engineer, now a project manager building food plants, buying the equipment and overseeing the installation and startup. Every day is something different for me. One day might be planning a building, the next is spec'ing equipment, the next is writing contracts, the next day is actually twising wrenches to keep me grounded and back to my roots. I've worked in 8 states, plus built a plant in Mexico. Something new everyday, and when I work in Utah I get to do a lot of fishing in Utah and Idaho. Fly out in 2 days for 'work' and taking a new fly rod with me...I think I get 6? weeks vacation plus personal days. I don't really know. I don't use it all.

Bro in law is an ME, he does stress analysis for aircraft parts all day (and other aircraft stuff).

Old roomie is an ME, he flies to Wyoming on Monday and back on Friday on the company jet and oversees drilling rig operations.

Classmate is a bigshot manager at CAT after doing design for 15 years.

Another classmate is in the refineries in Houston.

Another classmate is in a nuke plant in Nebraska.

Another classmate has a custom race car part business he owns.

Another classmate is a row crop farmer.

My point is, just because you're an ME, or CE, or IE, or EE, doesn't mean squat. The possibilities are endless on which direction you go. Get your foot in the door somewhere, work hard, grow, be teachable, put in the hours and advance.

I'd also highly suggest he gets work experience during school that is not just McDonalds/Wal-Mart/7-11.

Work construction. A machine shop. Fab shop. Engineering Internships. It is all out there. I told my intern the other day that I'd 100 times rather hire a college graduate that came off the farm, or a construction site, or did several engineering internships that only had a 3.0 GPA, than some kid with a 4.0 GPA that only saw the inside of a lab and the library for the last 5 years.

 

[Shortschaf]

ME here, not in the mountain west. Graduated in 2003. I work for a mega-large dairy company. Started out of college as a maintenance supervisor, then got into special projects, then became a project engineer, now a project manager building food plants, buying the equipment and overseeing the installation and startup. Every day is something different for me. One day might be planning a building, the next is spec'ing equipment, the next is writing contracts, the next day is actually twising wrenches to keep me grounded and back to my roots. I've worked in 8 states, plus built a plant in Mexico. Something new everyday, and when I work in Utah I get to do a lot of fishing in Utah and Idaho. Fly out in 2 days for 'work' and taking a new fly rod with me...I think I get 6? weeks vacation plus personal days. I don't really know. I don't use it all.

Bro in law is an ME, he does stress analysis for aircraft parts all day (and other aircraft stuff).

Old roomie is an ME, he flies to Wyoming on Monday and back on Friday on the company jet and oversees drilling rig operations.

Classmate is a bigshot manager at CAT after doing design for 15 years.

Another classmate is in the refineries in Houston.

Another classmate is in a nuke plant in Nebraska.

Another classmate has a custom race car part business he owns.

Another classmate is a row crop farmer.

My point is, just because you're an ME, or CE, or IE, or EE, doesn't mean squat. The possibilities are endless on which direction you go. Get your foot in the door somewhere, work hard, grow, be teachable, put in the hours and advance.

I'd also highly suggest he gets work experience during school that is not just McDonalds/Wal-Mart/7-11.

Work construction. A machine shop. Fab shop. Engineering Internships. It is all out there. I told my intern the other day that I'd 100 times rather hire a college graduate that came off the farm, or a construction site, or did several engineering internships that only had a 3.0 GPA, than some kid with a 4.0 GPA that only saw the inside of a lab and the library for the last 5 years.

Machine and fab shops are an amazing recommendation