Low light glassing options

[Lil-Rokslider656]

Hey All,

Looking for some advice on low light glassing.

I have the sig zulu6 10x30. They are my workhorse. From archery hunting timber to glassing. But not great in low light.
I've also got a Leupold 20-60 Alpine 2 ( and its pretty poor)
Diamondback HD 10x42s that are surprisingly ok.

Recently picked up a vortex mini razor 13-39. Figured this would be a great replacement for my leupold Overall really impressed with it. Recently took all my glass through some testing and realized my 10x42s allow for the longest effective glassing. I was surprised by this and sat down for some internet learning. Learned about exit pupil, and light transmission.

Now I'm debating some low light glass. Looking at some Swaro SLC 8x56 or equivalent to get that high 7ish exit pupil. But before I go making a ton of assumptions I figured I'd ask for some real world usage:

How much would this this increase my twilight glassing time? Like are we talking 5 mins, 15 mins, 30 mins?

 

[gr8fuldoug]

A GREAT options for not a great deal of $$$$ is the Kowa BD56-8XD 8x56mm Prominar XD Binoculars
Features
● Use of phase-coated prism surface
● Close minimum focusing distance
● Use of twist-up eyecup for easy viewing
● Rubber coating that is comfortable for holding
● Waterproof structure filled with dry nitrogen gas
● Polcarbonate body

 

[180ls1]

Same issue with that glass. Love/Hate for sure.

I really wish they gave them the Pro lenses and possibly a bump in objective size.

 

[eyeguy]

My 7x42 slc are pretty great in low light. If low light long range then maybe 8-10 x would be nice but otherwise lower mag is nice. Really need a spotting scope with big objective if need long range and low light and need to see those first or last few min of the day.

 

[Lil-Rokslider656]

I considered

A GREAT options for not a great deal of $$$$ is the Kowa BD56-8XD 8x56mm Prominar XD Binoculars
Features
● Use of phase-coated prism surface
● Close minimum focusing distance
● Use of twist-up eyecup for easy viewing
● Rubber coating that is comfortable for holding
● Waterproof structure filled with dry nitrogen gas
● Polcarbonate body

I considered this, but with less light transmission than swaro or maven i’ve pushed it to the low end (for now)

My guess is that the kowa would give me 5-10 minutes, but an slc would give me 15-20 or more (than my current diamondbacks).

If I can’t get 15-20 out of the swaros I’ll probably pick up some Maven.

Starting at the top and working backwards.

 

[Lil-Rokslider656]

Same issue with that glass. Love/Hate for sure.

I really wish they gave them the Pro lenses and possibly a bump in objective size.

They’re great for what they are, but if I’m really going for low light they would need a really big objective: 10x50 which I don’t forsee anytime soon.

I don’t mindthe tripod for first and last light, heck I usally have it. I glued a arca mount to my 10x30 and they really do work from the tripod: smooth and fast scanning, they buck the wind a lot, and give me a comfortable eye relief. Not to mention my traps get really sore after those things are glued to my face all day.

 

[Lil-Rokslider656]

My 7x42 slc are pretty great in low light. If low light long range then maybe 8-10 x would be nice but otherwise lower mag is nice. Really need a spotting scope with big objective if need long range and low light and need to see those first or last few min of the day.

I thought I was going to get more time with the spotter but now realize my errr. My 20x60 by 80
Is a 4 exit pupil and looses light faster than everything else I have, even at 20. Maybe a 115 someday, but no time soon.

I’m not planning to glass super long range at first and last light. So some binos should do the trick. Mainly an elk hunter; and in September if I find a group of elk I’m assuming there will be a bull so I’m going that direction

 

[Sadie]

The 8x56 you mentioned should be really good. I use 7x50 stieners.

 

[Lil-Rokslider656]

The 8x56 you mentioned should be really good. I use 7x50 stieners.

how do you like those?

I was looking at the Stiner night hunter 8x56. On paper they edge out the slc for the lowest of low light, but the slc would be more useful in other scenarios and I’m told has better color, and while i don’t own and swaro glass I understand you can’t really go wrong with them

 

[RockAndSage]

How much would this this increase my twilight glassing time? Like are we talking 5 mins, 15 mins, 30 mins?

This absolutely depends on terrain and weather - the difference between being at the bottom of a heavily wooded draw on the north side of a steep mountain, vs open country and clear skies, can be an hour or more of usable light at the same time of day.

If money's not an issue and you want max lowlight performance, look at the Blaser 8x56s.

If you want a spectacular all-around set of binos, for all conditions and uses including low light and tripod glassing, check out the Swaro NL Pure 10x52s.

 

[hand skills]

I like 10x50's, I find the extra mag is helpful for discerning details in the shadows. Also more fun for astronomy.

Everyones eyes are different, but for me personally it's gotta be pitch black for my pupils to exceed 5mm. For old guys, 5mm might be the limit.

A 7mm exit pupil does make for a super 'comfy' eyebox in a lot of cases. Handheld, I do prefer 8x, but if a tripod or rest is available 10x hands down.

As above, the Swaro NL 10x52 is on another level (to which I aspire)

 

[Sadie]

how do you like those?

I was looking at the Stiner night hunter 8x56. On paper they edge out the slc for the lowest of low light, but the slc would be more useful in other scenarios and I’m told has better color, and while i don’t own and swaro glass I understand you can’t really go wrong with them

Mine are 40 years old. True military type $350 when I bought them, they are heavy. The new binoculars I would guess are lighter and have better light transmission.

 

[Lil-Rokslider656]

Mine are 40 years old. True military type $350 when I bought them, they are heavy. The new binoculars I would guess are lighter and have better light transmission.

You may be surprised, there is a current version of the Stiener that is still using the porro prisms, it is the bulky style you’re referring too. Porro transmits more light than roof, and that old glass can be quite good. Some new glass is starting to get hindered by environmental manufacturing (non leaded) .
Not saying old glass is always good, or new glass is bad. Just saying old glass can be really good.

 

[Lil-Rokslider656]

I like 10x50's, I find the extra mag is helpful for discerning details in the shadows. Also more fun for astronomy.

Everyones eyes are different, but for me personally it's gotta be pitch black for my pupils to exceed 5mm. For old guys, 5mm might be the limit.

A 7mm exit pupil does make for a super 'comfy' eyebox in a lot of cases. Handheld, I do prefer 8x, but if a tripod or rest is available 10x hands down.

As above, the Swaro NL 10x52 is on another level (to which I aspire)

I’m considering 10x56, but I’d probably go maven vs Swaro to save a few dollars. I have a $1500 price cap; but would love to spend less than 1/2 of that.

I’ve seen the NLs, great but out of my current reach.

If you tell me I’d get an extra 2 mins of marginal quality glassing from SLC over Maven, i’d go maven. But if you’d say I can get 10 extra mins of quality glassing with SLC or stiner over Maven i’d spend the $$.

This is already assuming i can get about an extra 10 min over my current diamondbacks.

 

[eyeguy]

From your description of sept elk and just finding elk and not trying to count points or care if 280 0r 320 class bul... I would agree you dont need a big spotter or maybe spotter at all. Dont get to hung up on exit pupil as point af diminishing returns hits some where btw 5-6mm. Unless you are pretty young you are very unlikely to get your pupils to 7mm even in the dark. Look into twilight factor where they take exit puplil an magnification both into account... I will carry a 50 mm obj but much prefer 42 on my bino's. If all you are looking to do is find elk 10x50 would be largest and most mag i would consider and 7x42 would be lowest and smallest i would consider. ymmv

 

[RockAndSage]

I have a $1500 price cap;

In this case, find a pair of used SLCs - lots of them being sold the last few years, as guys upgrade to the NLs.

Here's the thing with glass - the longer you expect to be inside of any particular optic across a day, the more you want to spend on it. There very much is a direct correlation between quality and price on this, and the better stuff gives better performance in minimizing eye strain, and seeing deeper into the shadows, whether twilight or midday sun over brush hiding animals in the shade. Cut corners on the stuff you'll spend less time using.

 

[Lil-Rokslider656]

In this case, find a pair of used SLCs - lots of them being sold the last few years, as guys upgrade to the NLs.

Here's the thing with glass - the longer you expect to be inside of any particular optic across a day, the more you want to spend on it. There very much is a direct correlation between quality and price on this, and the better stuff gives better performance in minimizing eye strain, and seeing deeper into the shadows, whether twilight or midday sun over brush hiding animals in the shade. Cut corners on the stuff you'll spend less time using.

SLCs are (high) on the list. I use my Sig10x30 for long glassing. The stabilization has really reduced my eye strain and allowed me to glass for long periods of time. They're my work horse and I don't know if that will change.
Still trying to guesstimate how much time I'll be using them between when the Sigs10x30 fade out and as long as I can glass with my "low light" setup. IDK if thats 5 mins, 10 mins, 30 mins.
To your point; the longer that is (longer I think it will be), the more likely I am to spring for higher quality glass. But if you told me optionXYZ I'd get 10 mins and SLC I'd get 12. I'd probably go optionXYZ

 

[Lionhound1975]

For under $1500 I would look at the following:

used SLC 8x56, 10x56 or 7x42

Meopta Meostar (not MeoPro) 7x42 or 8x56. I know there are lots of valid concerns about Meopta service now but I had Meostars for years before switching to NLs and never had any issues with them.

Swarovski Habicht 7x42 or 10x40. The porro design is brighter than comparable roofs. I used to have the SLC 8x56 and my Habicht 7x42 was just about as bright in a much smaller package.