Looking to step up my first aid kit. Any suggestions?

[lchavez]

I always have the typical first aid stuff on me, but I want to step up both my kit and my training. Looking for suggestions on both. Wanting a kit that can move from bag to bag.

 

[Ironman8]

Depends on what you're trying to treat. I actually just bought that ITS Fatboy pouch and will fill it myself...but with a kit like that, it's geared more toward heavy hemorage and gunshot wounds. If that's what you're after, then that's good kit.

As for training, again, it depends what kind of medical situation you want to be able to treat. With the kit you listed above, you definitely need training, otherwise it's just about useless. As an example, I'm going to a "Tactical Medicine" course in Feb taught by a former PJ. Not sure where you're located, but this one is in Dallas and he has a few others scheduled around the country. Look him up here (Josh Vandenbrink): http://aliastraining.com/joshvandenbrink.aspx. There are plenty of other courses like this depending where you look too.

Hope that helps.

 

[lchavez]

Yes, I'm usually out in remote locations hunting or running mining equipment and i want to know how to handle both. Thanks for the info on the course, I'll check it out.

 

[Justin Crossley]

I heard a rumor that Rokslide will be coming out with a couple first aid kits.

 

[Becca]

Depends on what you're trying to treat....

As for training, again, it depends what kind of medical situation you want to be able to treat. With the kit you listed above, you definitely need training, otherwise it's just about useless.

Hope that helps.

This is good advice. It's easy to get sucked into "what if??" Scenarios, but ultimately if you don't know how to treat a particular life threatening injury, then it doesn't matter whether you have a chest seal kit dressing in your first aid kit or not. Even with advanced medical training, a lot of times it isn't possible or practical to have something dedicated for all particular injuries or illnesses. Furthermore, you can improvise a lot of dressings, splints and bandages in the field with supplies you already have iif that's what it comes down to. In the event of a bad enough emergency, your best bet is going to be the ability to call for help anyway so a Sat Phone is at the top of my list for first aid/emergency gear, as well as a list of emergency contact numbers.

The rest of my kit is mostly focused on treating minor to moderate injuries (cuts, scrapes, sprains, diarrhea, allergic reactions) as well as a few things that would buy time if I had to wait for help in a more serious emergency (quick clot). Keep in mind that many of our trips are fly-in or way off the road system...running back to town for supplies or emergency dental work isn't a realistic option, or at the very least ends the trip. Also keep in mind that we carry other survival gear (fire starting material, para cord, lighters matches, etc) elsewhere. Because of a previous injury to my leg, I usually have a small bottle with Tylenol and ibuprofen either in my bino pouch or my bathroom bag.

Iridium Sat Phone with emergency contact numbers

Medical Supplies
Moleskin 1 4x4" piece
Large Band aids-4
Small band aids-4
Non adherent dressings- 2
4"x4" gauze pads-4
2"x2" gauze pads-2
Triple antibiotic ointment packets- 4
Alcohol pads-6
Sting relief pads-2
Cotton tipped applicators-2
Nitrile Gloves- 1 pair
Quick Clot Pack 3.5"x3.5"-1
Needle nose tweezers-1 set
Derma bond applicator- 1
4' of 1" transpore tape
10cc syringe- 1
Den temp temporary dental filling- One kit

Medications
Alkaseltzer- 3 packets
Tylenol- 4 packets (500mg each)
Ibuprofen- 4 packets (400mg each)
Vicodin- (5/3251) bottle left over from dental procedure, probably around 20 pills
Benadryl- 4 packets (50mg each)
Diflucan- 1 pill (150mg)

Repair Kit
Sewing kit: 3 needles, assorted thread, 3 buttons of varying sizes, 6 safety pins, small scissors
Superglue
Aqua Seal UV
(If pack rafting, we have a separate raft repair kit with the boats)

We store everything but the sat phone (it has its own dry bag) in a small 2L roll top dry bag, and the interior contents are divided up into other ziplock bags to keep things organized. If I remember right, the kit in the dry bag weighs around 14oz.

 

[Where's Bruce?]

My First Aid kit got so big I leave it in the truck and figure...

 

[kodiakfly]

I like to think of First Aid kits as what they are meant to be- FIRST aid or FIRST responder. You aren't trying to repair a massive wound, you're trying to stop the bleeding and stabilize it until a surgeon or doctor can. You aren't trying to set a broken or shattered bone, you're trying to stabilize it until a doctor or surgeon can. My backpack first aid kit has gotten more and more simple as I've gotten older. Band-Aids, gauze rolls, gauze patches, tape, motrin, scissors and tweezers is about it for me.

For my truck or a boat-in or raft trip, my first aid kit will grow some because I've got more room and can carry more weight.

 

[striker3]

My absolute minimum kit is a tourniquet, I prefer SOF-T because of the ease to use one handed, and there is no chance of the windlass breaking, quickclot, a pressure dressing, a chest seal and a decompression needle. In the backcountry, my main worries are massive hemorraging and a thoracic puncture. Pretty much anything else that happens won't kill me before I can get help through my sat communicator.

 

[striker3]

For training, I haven't taken their course yet myself, but I have heard very good things about this company https://darkangelmedical.com/product-category/training/ and they travel around the country.

There are also wilderness medical courses offered at many community colleges that would be worthwhile to take.

 

[Lawnboi]

Many first aid situations can be improvised, with stuff you Likly already carry. I don't carry just a first aid kit, but it's kind of my all around emergency kit. It's always changing, depending on the trip. As far as medical supplies all I really carry is some gauze, paracord, tape and some sort of wound cleaner. Tylenol pm if I'm at altitude, to put me to sleep when my head is killing me, and a few bandaids.

Other odds and ends that almost always in my kit include tweezers, a needle and thread(for fabric not skin), emergency water treatment, emergency fire starting supplies including a secondary means to make fire and my spot.

A kit like the one posted above will require some training, quite a bit of training and alot of hands on practice. Even being a paramedic, I wouldn't not carry all that backpacking personally.

I wouldn't shoot you down for wanting to learn and carry some supplies. But keep in mind the above kit is designed for combat. Most if not all of those pieces are used to treat life threats. You still have to think about minor injuries when backpacking, they can prove to be a big problem if not taken care of

 

[Ironman8]

Many first aid situations can be improvised, with stuff you Likly already carry. I don't carry just a first aid kit, but it's kind of my all around emergency kit. It's always changing, depending on the trip. As far as medical supplies all I really carry is some gauze, paracord, tape and some sort of wound cleaner. Tylenol pm if I'm at altitude, to put me to sleep when my head is killing me, and a few bandaids.

Other odds and ends that almost always in my kit include tweezers, a needle and thread(for fabric not skin), emergency water treatment, emergency fire starting supplies including a secondary means to make fire and my spot.

A kit like the one posted above will require some training, quite a bit of training and alot of hands on practice. Even being a paramedic, I wouldn't not carry all that backpacking personally.

I wouldn't shoot you down for wanting to learn and carry some supplies. But keep in mind the above kit is designed for combat. Most if not all of those pieces are used to treat life threats. You still have to think about minor injuries when backpacking, they can prove to be a big problem if not taken care of

You don't carry a TQ?

 

[Becca]

You don't carry a TQ?

I don't...we always have a webbing strap, belt, etc that could be improvised. Good hard manual pressure will stop most bleeding better than a tourniquet in most circumstances, and we also carry a quick clot gauze as well although I would only use it in the event of a last ditch effort if nothing else worked.

 

[Ironman8]

I don't...we always have a webbing strap, belt, etc that could be improvised. Good hard manual pressure will stop most bleeding better than a tourniquet in most circumstances, and we also carry a quick clot gauze as well although I would only use it in the event of a last ditch effort if nothing else worked.

All that is said below is with the utmost respect for your medical and backcountry background:

I'll have to disagree on improvised TQ's. I'm not a certified medical professional, but I do have training, and I firmly believe that if a TQ is needed, it is needed NOW. The time it would take to improvise a TQ, is far longer and less effective than something purpose built. Especially with something thin like paracord or 1" webbing (due to possible tissue damage - 2" width is typically considered minimum for TQ use). It's one of the few single use items that I'll bring, but for the 2 oz penalty (CAT TQ), it's not even an option to leave behind IMO.

RE: Hard pressure being better - for something like a femoral artery bleed on a person with thick musclar thighs (me), I would much rather trust a TQ + QC gauze to get the bleeding to stop. Not only because the TQ is more likely to apply deep pressure better than fingers, but because it doesn't get tired and loosen up like someone will if they are the ones applying the pressure. Also, it would leave the responders' hands free to call for Emergency Services. And I'd be using that ASAP if it was a bright pulsating bleed, as opposed to last resort.

You have a pretty extensive kit listed above, and I'll be taking notes on some of the items to add to my BC kit, but the minimum 3 things I would bring for heavy hemorage trauma is a (CAT) TQ, Olaes Bandage (for it's multi use functionality), and QC Gauze. All in should weight less than 5 oz.

 

[striker3]

When I went on my first combat deployment, we we're not issued tourniquets. Turns out that improvised tourniquets are difficult to fashion and apply correctly in the ~90 seconds before the person finishes bleeding out. We lost far too many guys to massive hemorraging. By my 5th deployment, the chance of a person surviving a massive hemorrhage was amazingly high, and that was due to having purpose designed tourniquets and quickclot.

 

[Ironman8]

When I went on my first combat deployment, we we're not issued tourniquets. Turns out that improvised tourniquets are difficult to fashion and apply correctly in the ~90 seconds before the person finishes bleeding out. We lost far too many guys to massive hemorraging. By my 5th deployment, the chance of a person surviving a massive hemorrhage was amazingly high, and that was due to having purpose designed tourniquets and quickclot.

Bingo. I've forgotten some stats, but survival rates for combat related hemorage trauma when the use of a TQ was applied quickly/correctly was somewhere in the 90%. Also, loss of limb due to TQ application was literally zero. I can dig those up if anyone is really interested...although I'm sure a Google search would be easy enough.

 

[striker3]

Lawnboi, maybe we are just getting lost in translation. In reality, I carry two first aid kits. One is a trauma kit that has stuff meant for strictly life threatening circumstances. The other is for minor stuff, cuts and scrapes, medications and the like. I do have them in seperate containers, the minor kit is at the bottom of my pack while the trauma kit is in a blaze orange pouch and placed on the outside of the pack.

Based on the OPs questions, I just assumed that he was talking specifically about a trauma kit, but you are right that you should have the basics for the minor stuff. Ending a trip because the scrape on your arm gets infected would suck pretty bad.

 

[Becca]

No offense taken Ironman8, thank you for your thoughtful response...you make some good points and have likewise given me some food for thought. For a 5 oz penalty, the items you listed seem like cheap insurance (at least from a weight perspective), and if they make you feel more comfortable/confident to handle an emergency in the field, then by all means you should bring them along. I suspect I won't start carrying a TQ, because I feel the risk of needing one is probably relatively low ( if we were talking about a combat type situation it would be a different story!) and I feel comfortable accepting the risks in having to improvise a tourniquet in a field scenario if I can't use manual pressure to control bleeding.

Keeping our first aid kit light, while still including the items I can reasonably expect to need/want in an emergency, helps ensure I will bring it along and not be tempted to leave it behind under any circumstances (making trips packing meat, for instance). I recognize I can't possibly carry all the Equiptment I need for all potential issues, and so I bring the items that make me feel most comfortable, and recognize the risk in leaving some others behind.

A conversation like this is a great way to get all of us thinking through what we carry with us into the backcountry, and truly there isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to do it....what works for me might not be what works for you.

 

[dvm_hunter]

the only thing extra I carry with me is sterile surgical gloves, needle holders w/scissors, forceps, and a small pair of metzenbaums (scissors) and some 2-0 and 3-0 monocryl. I've dealt with a few mishaps in camp where someone cut themselves while processing an animal. I will say this stays in the vehicle though, so it's limited access.

 

[Ironman8]

Understood Becca, and agree that there's not a "right way". It's all about perceived risks. Combat is one thing, and I think we would both be agreeing 100% if that's what we were talking about. However, fairly recently there was a famous Crossfit athlete out mountain biking in the backcountry who took a spill over his handle bars and somehow punctured/severed his femoral. His wife is a Wilderness EMT and treated him there till emergency services arrived (not sure if she had a TQ)....but the moral of the story is that arterial bleeds can happen outside of combat situations. For 2 oz (even for the remote chance) a TQ makes me feel all warm and fuzzy

Just a secondary note here: I carry the trauma supplies (TQ, QC Gauze, Olaes, Nitrile gloves) in a ziplock in my cargo pocket. It's always there and available quickly. It doesn't do anyone any good somewhere in the bottom of my pack (as striker mentioned). All other med supplies ("boo boo kit") is kept in the pack.

 

[5MilesBack]

I guess if I was hunting in Afghanistan I'd rethink my first aid kit a little bit. Otherwise I'm, sticking to some simple basics.

In the end, stuff happens. I'll deal with that when I come to it. I'd need a truckload to take stuff that I'd need for every possibility out there.