Looking for good cartridge and budget rifle for 14 y/o

[HappyHuntr]

For your hypothetical - .243

Real world where you can buy bullets on the internet - 6.5 creedmoor.

Can't imagine how good that one felt .

 

[keystone112]

Mostly deer, 243

Most shots further out and maybe something bigger, 270

Deer and maybe something bigger at closer distance, 308

All great options. Look for a good deal on a rifle and get that one.

 

[HappyHuntr]

Most shots further out and maybe something bigger, 270

Deer and maybe something bigger at closer distance, 308

You're suggesting that the 270 is better for "bigger things" at long range than the 308?

 

[Ringbill27]

6.8 western there I said it!

 

[HappyHuntr]

If so, thank you.

 

[HappyHuntr]

6.8 western there I said it!

What about the 6.8? That's your choice.

 

[Ringbill27]

What about the 6.8? That's your choice.

It’s good. Other then rifle selection. None of which are 450 or less.

Honestly 300yd is a long shoot for deer. I’ve shot all cartridges you listed. 243, 7mm08 and 308 all are based on the 308. I’ve not noticed a real difference in recoil. There is a reason they are all made in youth model rifles. 243 and 7mm08 shoot flatter then the 308 but ammo and rifle availability are less then the 308. The 270 is a necked down 30-06 which will/should recoil more then the 308. The 270 will require a long action rifle where the 243,7mm08, 6.5 and the 308 will be a short action so slight heavier.

For 300yd and in on all cartridges you are looking at will work. For just deer and maybe cow elk I’d choice 243, 6.5 or 7mm08. For deer and more I’d go 308 or 270.

Like I’ve stated before 6.5 and 308 ammo and rifles on the shelf are the most popular right now.

So I guess for 300yds max.
On deer 6.5 due to rifle and ammo selection.
On elk 308 due to rifle and ammo selection.

Sorry if I’m rambling.

 

[Gravel Road]

Due to what close duck hunting friends have said I'm between 270 and 243.

So you ask a bunch of guys on here who actually shoot rifles a lot, get kind of pissy with most responses, then go with your DUCK hunting buddies answer...

 

[Gorillatransfers]

I like the axis idea though. Buddy has one of those that he started his kid on in 243 when he was like 11.

Agree

 

[HappyHuntr]

It’s good. Other then rifle selection. None of which are 450 or less.

Honestly 300yd is a long shoot for deer. I’ve shot all cartridges you listed. 243, 7mm08 and 308 all are based on the 308. I’ve not noticed a real difference in recoil. There is a reason they are all made in youth model rifles. 243 and 7mm08 shoot flatter then the 308 but ammo and rifle availability are less then the 308. The 270 is a necked down 30-06 which will/should recoil more then the 308. The 270 will require a long action rifle where the 243,7mm08, 6.5 and the 308 will be a short action so slight heavier.

For 300yd and in on all cartridges you are looking at will work. For just deer and maybe cow elk I’d choice 243, 6.5 or 7mm08. For deer and more I’d go 308 or 270.

Like I’ve stated before 6.5 and 308 ammo and rifles on the shelf are the most popular right now.

So I guess for 300yds max.
On deer 6.5 due to rifle and ammo selection.
On elk 308 due to rifle and ammo selection.

Sorry if I’m rambling.

No worries on rambling, this was extremely helpful!

 

[HappyHuntr]

So you ask a bunch of guys on here who actually shoot rifles a lot, get kind of pissy with most responses, then go with your DUCK hunting buddies answer...

These guys are the reason I'm getting my kid a rifle. They completely opened me up to the idea of hunting with rifles and muzzleloaders. I trust a guy who kills a bull every year for 28 years and has 2 in B&C club. The duck hunting has diddly squat to do with this. The duck hunting is just how I got to meet these guys.

 

[Gravel Road]

Then why ask here?

 

[MTN BUM]

1. There is potential energy and kinetic energy. When the arrow is drawn back it has its highest potential energy(PE) and low KE. When the arrow is released, that PE is transformed into KE and the more KE there is the more impact will hit the animal.

2. I’m not saying a arrow shot with (just for example to keep it simple) 10 newtons of KE and a field point is gonna be more effective than a arrow shot with 7 newtons and a razor sharp broadhead.

But.... you are ignoring the second half of projectile kinetics. After transforming PE into KE and travelling, that projectile has to hit something. At the point of impact KE is dispersed as the projectile enters the target. The point is that, holding weight constant, the more dense and smaller diameter a projectile is (assuming 100% retention) the more penetration it generates. BUUT, also the smaller diameter projectile creates less wound damage. BUUT, also that part of the equation negates what I will term the "Spomer/JVB" phenomena- which is that the wider a projectile is the more efficiently and quickly it transfers projectile KE into the target. IE, shock and awe. These variables are why there is no one answer to the question you have. It is a balance of energy/recoil/ballistics/availability/bullet composition/gayness/moon phase/coreolis effect, etc.

KE/PE is too simplistic to make reliable conclusions about bullets and ammo.

 

[Ringbill27]

But.... you are ignoring the second half of projectile kinetics. After transforming PE into KE and travelling, that projectile has to hit something. At the point of impact KE is dispersed as the projectile enters the target. The point is that, holding weight constant, the more dense and smaller diameter a projectile is (assuming 100% retention) the more penetration it generates. BUUT, also the smaller diameter projectile creates less wound damage. BUUT, also that part of the equation negates what I will term the "Spomer/JVB" phenomena- which is that the wider a projectile is the more efficiently and quickly it transfers projectile KE into the target. IE, shock and awe. These variables are why there is no one answer to the question you have. It is a balance of energy/recoil/ballistics/availability/bullet composition/gayness/moon phase/coreolis effect, etc.

KE/PE is too simplistic to make reliable conclusions about bullets and ammo.

This… seems too complicated for a 300yd deer rifle/cartridge for a 14year old.

 

[HappyHuntr]

But.... you are ignoring the second half of projectile kinetics. After transforming PE into KE and travelling, that projectile has to hit something. At the point of impact KE is dispersed as the projectile enters the target. The point is that, holding weight constant, the more dense and smaller diameter a projectile is (assuming 100% retention) the more penetration it generates. BUUT, also the smaller diameter projectile creates less wound damage. BUUT, also that part of the equation negates what I will term the "Spomer/JVB" phenomena- which is that the wider a projectile is the more efficiently and quickly it transfers projectile KE into the target. IE, shock and awe. These variables are why there is no one answer to the question you have. It is a balance of energy/recoil/ballistics/availability/bullet composition/gayness/moon phase/coreolis effect, etc.

KE/PE is too simplistic to make reliable conclusions about bullets and ammo.

KE can be taken advantage of with high quality bullets wether it is a 22lr, #2 shot, a 243, or 30/06.

 

[HappyHuntr]

BUUT, also that part of the equation negates what I will term the "Spomer/JVB" phenomena- which is that the wider a projectile is the more efficiently and quickly it transfers projectile KE into the target. IE, shock and awe. These variables are why there is no one answer to the question you have. It is a balance of energy/recoil/ballistics/availability/bullet composition/gayness/moon phase/coreolis effect, etc.

KE/PE is too simplistic to make reliable conclusions about bullets and ammo.

Keyword

 

[HappyHuntr]

Then why ask here?

Soak up more information. I'm a perfectionist/skeptic.

 

[bbell]

.243

I still stand by my savage axis in 6mm arc though

 

[Dobermann]

For a 14 year-old? Nothing under a 30-06 has enough oomphy knock-down KE power to kill anything.

And you definitely need to put it in a Ruger American (because 'Murica) with a Lee-opold on top (because the gold ring is a sign of quality). Don't worry about which rings to get; they're all the same.

Reducing recoil is what has made kids these days soft.

And spotting shots is just for people who can't shoot half an MOA, all day long, if they do their part.

 

[keystone112]

You're suggesting that the 270 is better for "bigger things" at long range than the 308?

Better than the 243 in my opinion.