Kids rifle...again.

[Chris in TN]

Unknown….but after some googling I’d argue that the AT ONE may miss the mark on the short side of LOP at 12.5” for some of the youth we are after.

Those that are starting real young ones need about 11-11.5” range. I chopped a OEM tikka for that.

My kiddo is at the 12” ish range now at 7 and not quite to the tikka compact length.

If he was 9 I’m betting the 12.5” would be solid though.

So, the AT-ONE fully collapsed is indeed about 12.5" but you can pull the entire collapsing butt out of it and get down to about 11.625", at least on ours.

Also - the model they supplied as OEM for the CZ457 has a nice vertical grip. The forend is a bit big for offhand shooting, certainly, but the butt itself, I really like. I do, however, see that what they offer as aftermarket, doesn't have the same grip. Not sure about that.

Whether removing the entire slide to get that 11.625" LOP is worth the expense of losing all recoil absorption (without adding some sort of temporary pad), is another question. There's always reduced loads, even for .223, if that's an issue. Or some sort of slip-on thin pad?

Either way - it's a suggestion, and no more. When my little boy was 6ish if his older sisters were shooting, he wanted to shoot too, badly enough to crawl the stock in whatever way he had to. I didn't make it a habit but I did let him shoot stuff if he insisted on it. I have a picture somewhere of all three kids standing in front of a 16" steel plate that all three of them had hit (and well) at ~400 yards, prone, and it was comical how my little boy looked crawling up over a fixed A2 stock on an AR15....but, again, he made it work.

I sort of think that when it comes to making stock lengths work for multiple shooters there are no perfect solutions, there are always tradeoffs, and I just wanted to offer the Boyd's stock as an option to consider. For what they cost they aren't terrible at all. But I'll freely concede that they have their own set of issues.

 

[Tahoe1305]

So, the AT-ONE fully collapsed is indeed about 12.5" but you can pull the entire collapsing butt out of it and get down to about 11.625", at least on ours.

Also - the model they supplied as OEM for the CZ457 has a nice vertical grip. The forend is a bit big for offhand shooting, certainly, but the butt itself, I really like. I do, however, see that what they offer as aftermarket, doesn't have the same grip. Not sure about that.

Whether removing the entire slide to get that 11.625" LOP is worth the expense of losing all recoil absorption (without adding some sort of temporary pad), is another question. There's always reduced loads, even for .223, if that's an issue. Or some sort of slip-on thin pad?

Either way - it's a suggestion, and no more. When my little boy was 6ish if his older sisters were shooting, he wanted to shoot too, badly enough to crawl the stock in whatever way he had to. I didn't make it a habit but I did let him shoot stuff if he insisted on it. I have a picture somewhere of all three kids standing in front of a 16" steel plate that all three of them had hit (and well) at ~400 yards, prone, and it was comical how my little boy looked crawling up over a fixed A2 stock on an AR15....but, again, he made it work.

I sort of think that when it comes to making stock lengths work for multiple shooters there are no perfect solutions, there are always tradeoffs, and I just wanted to offer the Boyd's stock as an option to consider. For what they cost they aren't terrible at all. But I'll freely concede that they have their own set of issues.

All good. They look sweet and I think being able to adjust for multiple shooters is awesome.

I think the options expand quite a bit at 12.5”+ .

I was just point out that getting shorter than that is tougher. Albeit if you can get another 1” or so without the pad that solves it.

I can’t imagine anyone needing much less than that…..in my experience that’s about a 4-5 year old.

 

[Chris in TN]

When the action was in the At One it was cool to pass it back and forth between myself and a boy and just pop out the LOP. After a while I stopped messing with it and just shot it the same length they were using it at. We were using blade front and peep rear so it was easier to go back and forth than with a scope. I can't remember why I swapped it back to the factory stock but they were both like "dang, this is way better."

I'll shoot their scoped rifles sometimes to confirm or re-zero. I'm noticing that that "too short" is much worse than "too long" i.e. tunnelling is worse for shooting than reduced FOV.

Comb height is more important than LOP.

Right now my house is in a season of life where the guns the kids shoot, are all 'too short' for me, and the guns the kids shoot, are the ones wearing all the suppressors - so I do a whole lot of shooting with 'too short' stocks right now.

I won't say length doesn't matter, at all - of course it does and there's an optimum length and at least some range that is close enough to ideal - but I'll just say that using their too-short stocks (not only less than optimum, but completely out of the ideal range) doesn't bother me now half as much as it used to. I'm not even sure it bothers me at all. I hunted with their 6.5cm this year with the youth length stock and when I hunted with their collapsible stocked AR I didn't even bother extending it. I'm not saying it's ideal, but it isn't a limiting factor right now.

 

[WRO]

Option 5 Ruger precision rifle..

They all started with a Ruger precision 22

My kids have killed both killed there first critters with one.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[43.6N]

Adjustable stock is a must. Ideally this 223 would suffice as a trainer for me and a hunting/trainer rifle for both kids.
Son (6) has a shorter LOP than daughter (9)

Brandon, I did this with my two daughters last summer/fall (9,11).

We tried the buffer tube chassis, a cut down tikka stock, and KRG Bravo. Far and away the KRG was the best for them to feel comfortable with.

The KRG bravo has a touch under 12” LOP when the factory recoil pad is removed.

KRG sells a short recoil pad at 3/8” thick. https://kineticresearchgroup.com/product/recoil-pad-slim/

I tried sourcing a pad that was even thinner, but ultimately just took the KRG pad down to 1/4” with a belt sander. This left a total length of pull of 12”, and let us use the adjustable cheek pad. Just be sure to go with low low rings.

The extra weight was preferred by my daughters and wasn’t a hindrance to safe weapon handling at all. And obviously with the included spacers, it was very easy to adjust right back to fit me.

 

[Frozenlead]

Something like this chassis might interest you. I know he’s built some 18 and 20” rigs in it that were around 5.5lbs before scope

https://rokslide.com/forums/threads/pr-precision-tikka-micro-chassis.437781/

 

[Tahoe1305]

Brandon, I did this with my two daughters last summer/fall (9,11).

We tried the buffer tube chassis, a cut down tikka stock, and KRG Bravo. Far and away the KRG was the best for them to feel comfortable with.

The KRG bravo has a touch under 12” LOP when the factory recoil pad is removed. View attachment 1015940

KRG sells a short recoil pad at 3/8” thick. https://kineticresearchgroup.com/product/recoil-pad-slim/

I tried sourcing a pad that was even thinner, but ultimately just took the KRG pad down to 1/4” with a belt sander. This left a total length of pull of 12”, and let us use the adjustable cheek pad. Just be sure to go with low low rings.

The extra weight was preferred by my daughters and wasn’t a hindrance to safe weapon handling at all. And obviously with the included spacers, it was very easy to adjust right back to fit me.

Errrrr. Didn’t know about this and it would have worked great. Love the KRG.

 

[Brandon.miller.4]

I have a krg. May give it a try.

 

[43.6N]

Errrrr. Didn’t know about this and it would have worked great. Love the KRG.

In all seriousness, KRG NEEDS to make a reduced LOP rear module for the bravo. So many short kings and their kids could finally have stocks that truly fit and grow with them very easily.

 

[Chipnalong]

Go look at a Ruger sfr in the dreaded 6.5 . My granddaughter was 7 when she started . She does shoot with a bog pog ,but she has to move the rifle up /down/ sideways .

 

[Dirty30]

Option #1

Chassis grows with them. Also easily changed to another tikka 6cm in the future when they start hammering steel at 800 yards….


I started my youngest off with sig cross in 6.5cm. Last year she got a tikka 223 24” trainer and 18” 6cm and that cross is a 22cm now that my youngest 9 year old and I shoot

What’s the recoil difference between the 223 and 22 creed? Do the kids do ok with 22 creed?

 

[43.6N]

What’s the recoil difference between the 223 and 22 creed? Do the kids do ok with 22 creed?

To a 60lb preteen girl? The difference in recoil is about 10% her body weight.

For these really small kids, you gotta think of 223 as the equivalent of you and me shooting full strength 6.5cm.
The 22cm is equivalent to 300win mag to a little girl.
But add 40lbs and 6 inches of growth, and to a 12 year old, 22cm is a nothing burger.

At least for my kids, that’s been the experience.

 

[Nine Banger]

What’s the recoil difference between the 223 and 22 creed? Do the kids do ok with 22 creed?

I wouldn't do it.

My younger kid scoped himself with 22-250 batting out of his weight class. The recoil is significant when you weigh 60 lbs.

My kids jumped from 22lr to 223 and won't shoot 22lr anymore. We're running thru boxes of ADI Blitzkings like paper towels. 22 Creed will be expensive.

My 9 year old can sit there with a 10 round mag of 223 and wear out a piece of steel. I'm not going to push them into a standard case. They can do that on their own and wear out all the deer in the woods with their trainer rifles while they are in my care.

 

[Brandon.miller.4]

In all seriousness, KRG NEEDS to make a reduced LOP rear module for the bravo. So many short kings and their kids could finally have stocks that truly fit and grow with them

I wouldn't do it.

My younger kid scoped himself with 22-250 batting out of his weight class. The recoil is significant when you weigh 60 lbs.

My kids jumped from 22lr to 223 and won't shoot 22lr anymore. We're running thru boxes of ADi Blitzkings like paper towels. 22 Creed will be expensive.

My 9 year old can sit there with a 10 round mag of 223 and wear out a piece of steel. I'm not going to push them into a standard case. They can do that on their own and wear out all the deer in the woods with their trainer rifles while they are in my care.

Im in agreement with this. Though my kids haven't shot 223 yet, it just makes sense from a lot of angles. Price being one of them. I would love for krg to make a shortened bravo with a smaller grip for kids.

 

[cuerro viejo]

What’s the recoil difference between the 223 and 22 creed? Do the kids do ok with 22 creed?

On paper a lot more as a percentage, real world felt recoil wise, not much more but the youngest will comment on longer shot strings. There is a substantial difference in cost to plink though. They use 223 to practice from 100-450 as it is a 3:1 cost difference. Hunting wise they don’t notice the difference.

The 223 is 24” and 22cm is 16”. I think I’m only +-80 ft/s difference between two using 556 77TMK NAS2 and 77TMK 22 CM. Both rifles are suppressed

Putting rifle on a tripod will also reduce felt recoil alot. My kids rarely shoot from a bench. Prone, tripod, bipod