Idaho NR general tag going to draw?

[LFC911]

That's 12k people who came to Idaho and spent money on one day. Some flew, all drove and most bought food and fuel. That's an economic win vs internet sales.

Some people worked remotely for a week (me), rented an Airbnb, scouted every night a week before season, shopped/ate in town, and spent the next two weeks on the mountain once the season opened. My Airbnb host was a bear hunter and saw her a few times and got some intel from her too. She even let me come back and take a shower before the next customer checked in. Good times.

 

[sasquatch]

Agreed. Draw systems, random or points, make things equal and minimize effort. Current system: more effort, you get a tag. Yup, for those stuck to just online, not as "fair" as those who put in effort to fly out or get a buddy to stand in line. Such is life. I prefer systems where effort can yield results vs. everyone gets the same chance. If tags are selling out, why change? Maybe alter, like some capped zones, where 1/2 are sold in person, 1/2 online. Don't go to a draw.

Like outfitter welfare too where they buy up a long list of tags? Even though they also get their own quota


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[wnelson14]

I wonder how many NR are buying both deer and elk tags. In theory, we could have as few as 15,500 NR hunters every year if they all got deer tags and the same hunters also bought up the 12,800 elk tags. Or there could be as many as 28,300 NR hunters if they each only buy one tag. So in any given year the actual number of NR hunters is between 15,500 and 28,300.

With that in mind I wonder if the current system results in fewer NR hunters overall and if a draw system will result in more.

Out of the people in front of me and behind me in line. I and the three guys bought elk tags only I bought a deer tag. Most people in line and discussions I overheard was extremely elk heavy virtually no mention of deer. The people in line that were buying tags for “clients” was mostly elk that I’m aware of, seemed like deer was all second thought for everyone.

 

[Z Barebow]

That's 12k people who came to Idaho and spent money on one day. Some flew, all drove and most bought food and fuel. That's an economic win vs internet sales.

You hit on something that has boomed with current system. There is a cottage industry in Idaho with in person sales. EX a local (Business person, relative, friend etc purchasing tags as a proxy) Not to mention local businesses benefitting from NR's who show up in person. I never would have guessed in person sales would surpass internet sales.

 

[IdahoBeav]

Like outfitter welfare too where they buy up a long list of tags? Even though they also get their own quota


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The hunters put in the effort and resources to make connections. The non-outfitter tags are never issued to the outfitter. They are always in the hunter’s name.

 

[Customweld]

Some people worked remotely for a week (me), rented an Airbnb, scouted every night a week before season, shopped/ate in town, and spent the next two weeks on the mountain once the season opened. My Airbnb host was a bear hunter and saw her a few times and got some intel from her too. She even let me come back and take a shower before the next customer checked in. Good times.

Are you coming back this year?

 

[IdahoBeav]

Not necessarily. Unless you can show how many people logged in for the sale on several computers you can’t compare the odds of getting a low number in line

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The number of devices and online sales both went down. The number of people logged in is somewhere between 22k+/- and 80k+/-, which also went up from the previous year.

If it goes to a draw, everyone that was attempting online and in-person and a lot of extra people that didn’t want to deal with in-person or the online queue will be applying; the number of tags remains the same.

It’s basically a situation where those that won’t put in the effort are asking for a system that makes it worse for everyone.

The lazy blame the hardworking and scream that things would be better if everyone were at the same level, which in this case is worse than the lazy had previously.

 

[sasquatch]

Effort and resources? “Hiring an outfitter”

Tags should be tags, I don’t like welfare. Those same guys wouldn’t play the same if not for outfitter welfare

Im also game for those who put out EFFORT. As in, get your own a** out there and buy YOUR tag


Online numbers jumped because every year more and more people are learning to log in on every computer at their place of work. Including me.

I’m game for this system and think it’s good with tweaks. Simple ones too. Buy YOUR own tag with your own drivers license like almost everything else in the world, and log in FIRST before entering the waiting line

This system is, and will continue to become a game of crooked schemes. As of now you can basically pay a license sales store owner money to buy the tags for you. If you can’t see how that can get totally out of hand I don’t know what else to say.

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[ez_willie]

The number of devices and online sales both went down. The number of people logged in is somewhere between 22k+/- and 80k+/-, which also went up from the previous year.

If it goes to a draw, everyone that was attempting online and in-person and a lot of extra people that didn’t want to deal with in-person or the online queue will be applying; the number of tags remains the same.

It’s basically a situation where those that won’t put in the effort are asking for a system that makes it worse for everyone.

The lazy blame the hardworking and scream that things would be better if everyone were at the same level, which in this case is worse than the lazy had previously.

I don’t think a new system will make it worse for the tens of thousands of people that tried to buy online.

 

[IdahoBeav]

I don’t think a new system will make it worse for the tens of thousands of people that tried to buy online.

It might make it less frustrating, but the odds to get a tag will go down.

 

[sasquatch]

Likely only for the “connected” not so much on pure number statistics I bet. Maybe I’m wrong


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[IdahoBeav]

Tags should be tags, I don’t like welfare. Those same guys wouldn’t play the same if not for outfitter welfare

Im also game for those who put out EFFORT. As in, get your own a** out there and buy YOUR tag


Online numbers jumped because every year more and more people are learning to log in on every computer at their place of work. Including me.

You do realize that outfitters are not the only people able to purchase for others, right? You don’t dislike welfare that much if you want the people willing to travel or pay to lose their tags so people sitting at home on the couch can get them.

The online numbers didn’t jump, they dropped drastically, which indicates that using multiple computers and browsers is not as successful as rumored to be.

 

[WRO]

You hit on something that has boomed with current system. There is a cottage industry in Idaho with in person sales. EX a local (Business person, relative, friend etc purchasing tags as a proxy) Not to mention local businesses benefitting from NR's who show up in person. I never would have guessed in person sales would surpass internet sales.

It’s not 12k people. I know people who buy tags for multiple people (myself included) and there’s a lot of others that buy for their families etc. Maybe 1k people actually come to the state.

 

[sasquatch]

What part of my above post are you missing

“Buy your own tag with your own drivers license”

It’s not effort to have someone else do things for you. Nobody who drives or flys to travel loses that right, only the ones who hire others to do it for them

I assume you live in Idaho. You’d change your tune if it was different for residents and there was some limit with a way for only certain people to benefit as in “hire someone running the store to buy all the tags before customer #1 in line can buy them himself”

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[IdahoBeav]

Finding someone to buy your tag for you is effort.

FYI, there are also capped elk tags for residents. You guys aren’t the only ones having all the fun, and the resident sale has been a rodeo for many years longer than the NR sale has been. And yes, you can buy for others in the resident sale.

 

[sasquatch]

Since you really like effort based systems

Should tags be sold in order based on effort? Should a guy who drove to Idaho get preference over one who flew? More effort=more reward

Or what about the guy who drove there, having to wait in an invisible line to buy his tag? You know, after the guy who is running the counter buy tags for his list of people that paid him?

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[rodney482]

Wyoming erases points if you don't apply every year?

2 yrs in a row…. poof

 

[LFC911]

Are you coming back this year?

Absolutely!

 

[IdahoBeav]

Since you really like effort based systems

Should tags be sold in order based on effort? Should a guy who drove to Idaho get preference over one who flew? More effort=more reward

Or what about the guy who drove there, having to wait in an invisible line to buy his tag? You know, after the guy who is running the counter buy tags for his list of people that paid him?

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Nice straw man argument

The unfounded rumors about the store owners/clerks taking money for spots in line are also a good laugh.

 

[WRO]

What part of my above post are you missing

“Buy your own tag with your own drivers license”

It’s not effort to have someone else do things for you. Nobody who drives or flys to travel loses that right, only the ones who hire others to do it for them

I assume you live in Idaho. You’d change your tune if it was different for residents and there was some limit with a way for only certain people to benefit as in “hire someone running the store to buy all the tags before customer #1 in line can buy them himself”

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They do that too fyi. I watch guys in capped lines by for all their buddies.