How high @ 100 for 140gr 6.5cm for best POI

[solarshooter]

Sure, I know that. But again, imo there’s a better way. Zero at 100, again so you can maximise precision, but then just twist the scope up a a few clicks for a higher “walking around” mpbr.

THIS. Or don't and just hold over based on range estimate/measurement, exactly like you would with your duplex reticle, except much more precise and repeatable.

 

[Stinky Coyote]

Every time you write, you think you are owning us, but you are just showing more and more of your ignorance. OP was respectful and received respectful replies. He acknowledged the limitations of his chosen method and his ignorance of other methods. Even if some of your boasting is true, you are not as good of a shooter as you think, and if you ever bothered to actually quantify your shooting prowess or compare it to others who use the methods favored by this forum, you would realize the reality of the situation.

To be frank, shooting at things sub 400yds is easy, and you SHOULD have a high hit rate (>75%) with decent equipment and shooting practice. Boasting about hit rates and techniques that get you hits on a 12" vital zone under 400yds is like a guy rolling up to a car meet with a stock civic with the loud exhaust and bragging about his 1/4 mile times. Yes we believe you can do it and there are many ways to do it successfully.

Now if you went and tried to do an NRL 22 or PRS competition with a duplex reticle and inches of drop written on your scope caps, you and everyone around you would learn a valuable lesson.

do you get a tag and get to break out the knife and fill the freezer at these events?

not owning anyone except those, like axle nut, who decide to slam someone completely ignorant of the other tools in the bag used successfully over long time who would likely mop the floor with him when trying to fill a tag, being hyper focused on his one trick pony solution from his very high horse

 

[Stinky Coyote]

maximize precision? we building piano's here? you can easily get down the rabbit hole chasing the impractical when it comes to fillin' tags, this is a hunting forum right? take your steel playtime to another section

 

[solarshooter]

at 400 yards they are all within an inch of 10” low with Partitions. Pick one blindfolded and milk jugs are about 10” tall. Using junior high math, or grade school geometry, that’s going to require holding half a milk jug over the top

Can you point to the milk jug on this image for me?


And what about at 420yds? How many imaginary milk jugs high at 360?

 

[WoolyBugger]

do you get a tag and get to break out the knife and fill the freezer at these events?

not owning anyone except those, like axle nut, who decide to slam someone completely ignorant of the other tools in the bag used successfully over long time who would likely mop the floor with him when trying to fill a tag, being hyper focused on his one trick pony solution from his very high horse

I don’t think many competitive people at these PRS and NRL matches are one trick ponies, when they actually understand mpbr really well. But they zero at 100 and are thinking about everything in mils instead of inches and use reticle subtensions. Using a duplex reticle zeroed at 217 or whatever yards and inch holdovers leads to a long frustrating day of shooting, seen it happen.

But yeah, it’s not hunting. Just helps you learn what works.

 

[solarshooter]

do you get a tag and get to break out the knife and fill the freezer at these events?

not owning anyone except those, like axle nut, who decide to slam someone completely ignorant of the other tools in the bag used successfully over long time who would likely mop the floor with him when trying to fill a tag, being hyper focused on his one trick pony solution from his very high horse

You're probably one of those guys that thinks he can win any fist fight, even against a trained opponent, because he just "sees red" and "you can't practice like you fight in the street", huh?

The only thing I've seen proof of from you is ignorance and ego.

 

[Stinky Coyote]

THIS. Or don't and just hold over based on range estimate/measurement, exactly like you would with your duplex reticle, except much more precise and repeatable.

who recalls that honest 2 threads from this past year or so about those who've been caught off zero? post them links here if so, great reads and honest feedback, but bit of derail as it's just focusing on zero and the amount of guys that have had opportunities blown by these variable zero setups being inadvertently not where they wanted them, from kids in the carseat in the back twisting turrets while dad driving to rubs in the field and so much more, it was a lot of folks, that not just had the issue once but several times, and thinking it through...through the eyes of Murphy, applying the; 1 we suck at shooting and 2 loss of zero as biggest reasons we miss rules...don't think guys were connecting the dot on the loss of zero thing though the way Murphy connects those dots , don't wanna argue about that here, just go read those two threads and choose your gear, and zero, wisely...but if there's a way to manipulate your zero outside of rifle crashing down the mountain then you're asking for it to happen to you, if it already hasn't, that sort of variable zero setup won't lend well to guys who intimately know their zero and trajectory and never mess with it afield and do everything to keep that zero where it should be, caps being the ultimate solution

 

[Stinky Coyote]

You're probably one of those guys that thinks he can win any fist fight, even against a trained opponent, because he just "sees red" and "you can't practice like you fight in the street", huh?

The only thing I've seen proof of from you is ignorance and ego.

nah, we all make assumptions, you make yours, just providing logic and full picture, with spice to counter spice, not bragging about our success, just adding the other ways to skin cats that been going on a long time and still very effective at fillin' tags, you may not get why I post like this at times, but it's just a response when someone like axle-nut pops off on another poster with his spice and ignorance combined, like where the fack did that come from bro? seriously...was anything S-3 or other posters said worthy of that pop off?

 

[solarshooter]

who recalls that honest 2 threads from this past year or so about those who've been caught off zero? post them links here if so, great reads and honest feedback, but bit of derail as it's just focusing on zero and the amount of guys that have had opportunities blown by these variable zero setups being inadvertently not where they wanted them, from kids in the carseat in the back twisting turrets while dad driving to rubs in the field and so much more, it was a lot of folks, that not just had the issue once but several times, and thinking it through...through the eyes of Murphy, applying the; 1 we suck at shooting and 2 loss of zero as biggest reasons we miss rules...don't think guys were connecting the dot on the loss of zero thing though the way Murphy connects those dots , don't wanna argue about that here, just go read those two threads and choose your gear, and zero, wisely...but if there's a way to manipulate your zero outside of rifle crashing down the mountain then you're asking for it to happen to you, if it already hasn't, that sort of variable zero setup won't lend well to guys who intimately know their zero and trajectory and never mess with it afield and do everything to keep that zero where it should be, caps being the ultimate solution

Like anything, this is a skill/practice issue. I'll save you the thread finding, I've seen it happen first hand. And now all the shooters that were present that day run scopes with zero stops and religiously reset 0 after any dialing/shot. You must remember to do this, just like you must remember to load the gun, chamber a round, and click off the safety.

Though I have no data to really back this statement up, I would bet that far more animals are lost due to bad kentucky windage/holdover than to misdialed scopes. In any sort of competetive shooting, intentional practice, or hunting I've seen or been a part of, an incorrect dial is nowhere near the top of reasons why people miss.

 

[Stinky Coyote]

Like anything, this is a skill/practice issue. I'll save you the thread finding, I've seen it happen first hand. And now all the shooters that were present that day run scopes with zero stops and religiously reset 0 after any dialing/shot. You must remember to do this, just like you must remember to load the gun, chamber a round, and click off the safety.

Though I have no data to really back this statement up, I would bet that far more animals are lost due to bad kentucky windage/holdover than to misdialed scopes. In any sort of competetive shooting, intentional practice, or hunting I've seen or been a part of, an incorrect dial is nowhere near the top of reasons why people miss.

no debating it, we all win or learn and end up trying many things, I am as gear junky as anyone and try and use it all, don't compete, just hunt and take what I can from what comes along and apply it to hunting and see what sticks, not sure that will ever stop, don't care what people choose, was just pointing out the multitude of issues with not just 100 yard zero but the field adjustable variable zero systems layered on top of it, even if locking, guys still getting meeting Murphy out there as the variables to loss of zero are still not fully removed

 

[solarshooter]

.was anything S-3 or other posters said worthy of that pop off?

I agree, I also found this post rude:

I'm going to bookmark this thread so I can use it as an example of how stupid it is to make a conscious choice to not use MILs.

My main criticism of Rokslide is how rude people are to those who are inclined to ask questions and attempt to educate themselves. Sometimes it's warranted, often times it's not. There is some really valuable info here that can genuinely improve people's effectiveness as hunters, shooters, and lots of other topics.

That being said I don't think S-3 took too much offense, and like I said, he has demonstrated awareness of the limitations of his chosen method, his comfort and experience with it, and ignorance of the method many here evangelize.

You, on the other hand, are arguing that you know both/all the methods, and that there is no advantage to mils/dialing/using an FFP reticle. Except many of your comments have (probably inadvertently) shown your ignorance of the mil/dial/reticle method, and we've all tried to tell you, and you've doubled down, citing your apparently perfect and superior success as a hunter.

So again, if you want any of us to take you seriously please go measure yourself against other shooters/methods and report back.

 

[Max2491]

Zero at 100 and then use a calculator for further shots. If you go above you can use a ballistics calculator.

 

[Stinky Coyote]

Can you point to the milk jug on this image for me?
View attachment 920105

And what about at 420yds? How many imaginary milk jugs high at 360?

I can see the ~28" I need to hold or tell my kid to hold for my 308 and 205 zero, decal on scope cap has 25" for 400, I think decal also has 9" for 5 mph beside it, can suggest which side of kill zone to lean to and where to hold in reference to tip of ear for height. Build piano or win a match precise? No, but fill tag precise? Bet on it. This example prolly outer edge distance wise but doable for those that are intimate with their stuff and have practiced plenty. I'd get the kids closer as they have less practice, this wouldn't be an issue, all I need is range and if just a breeze that's a dead dear awful quick. If you have not shot like this at all or practiced on range then just don't comment, it's really not that hard, go see for yourself before you comment.

 

[Stinky Coyote]

I agree, I also found this post rude:


My main criticism of Rokslide is how rude people are to those who are inclined to ask questions and attempt to educate themselves. Sometimes it's warranted, often times it's not. There is some really valuable info here that can genuinely improve people's effectiveness as hunters, shooters, and lots of other topics.

That being said I don't think S-3 took too much offense, and like I said, he has demonstrated awareness of the limitations of his chosen method, his comfort and experience with it, and ignorance of the method many here evangelize.

You, on the other hand, are arguing that you know both/all the methods, and that there is no advantage to mils/dialing/using an FFP reticle. Except many of your comments have (probably inadvertently) shown your ignorance of the mil/dial/reticle method, and we've all tried to tell you, and you've doubled down, citing your apparently perfect and superior success as a hunter.

So again, if you want any of us to take you seriously please go measure yourself against other shooters/methods and report back.

goes both ways, don't care to be taken seriously or what anyone thinks, take or leave what any of us says, I've talked to guys on here went so far down competition rabbit hole their freezer was empty, mine is not, anyone can argue with my freezer if they like, I didn't say the other methods don't work, time and place, and I USE THEM, moa, mils, inches, there's tapes at both ends, pop off buddy said there's only tape at one end and anyone not using that is stupid...he clearly needed to be 'brought up to speed'

this isn't a competition, pick your poison, get good with it, you'll be fast enough, most of the time, but I'll point out, but if you have guys practiced at close end tape and far end tape on game to 350-400 the one that can reference and solve the quickest will fold tag quickest, trying to say that is archaic or stupid is bad form, I migrate to what works quickest for me, for fillin' tags, merely pointing out the FULL picture

 

[SDHNTR]

maximize precision? we building piano's here? you can easily get down the rabbit hole chasing the impractical when it comes to fillin' tags, this is a hunting forum right? take your steel playtime to another section

This is funny. I’m no steel banger or nerdy shooting gamer. I’m a hunter through and through and that’s all I care about I. The firearm (or archery) world. My filled tags are well into the double digits every year. But yes, I still appreciate precision. You can make a precise gun also do quick shots at easy, closer ranges, but the opposite is not true at the same time. I like to be prepared so that I have maximized my chances at both a quick opportunity, and a longer shot that requires precision. Why would you not want both?

 

[SDHNTR]

I can see the ~28" I need to hold or tell my kid to hold for my 308 and 205 zero, decal on scope cap has 25" for 400, I think decal also has 9" for 5 mph beside it, can suggest which side of kill zone to lean to and where to hold in reference to tip of ear for height. Build piano or win a match precise? No, but fill tag precise? Bet on it. This example prolly outer edge distance wise but doable for those that are intimate with their stuff and have practiced plenty. I'd get the kids closer as they have less practice, this wouldn't be an issue, all I need is range and if just a breeze that's a dead dear awful quick. If you have not shot like this at all or practiced on range then just don't comment, it's really not that hard, go see for yourself before you comment.

Wow. I’m not trying to be rude, but what you just described here, while I’m glad it works for you, is undoubtedly more difficult, takes far more thought (for me), and would actually take longer than a well practiced hunter who is good with a MOA/mils system and a reticle, or even dial, and it’s far more precise.

It just sounds like you are trying to convince us that riding bicycle backwards is better than the traditional way. It’s not going to change minds.

 

[Stinky Coyote]

This is funny. I’m no steel banger or nerdy shooting gamer. I’m a hunter through and through and that’s all I care about I. The firearm (or archery) world. My filled tags are well into the double digits every year. But yes, I still appreciate precision. You can make a precise gun also do quick shots at easy, closer ranges, but the opposite is not true at the same time. I like to be prepared so that I have maximized my chances at both a quick opportunity, and a longer shot that requires precision. Why would you not want both?

guess you don't also have a fishing addiction then? You're pretty tied up in all things shooty lol, I'm across the board so the few hundred rounds a year practical works for the distances we generally kill at plus some insurance solutions and enough competency to go a little further and in the natural laws where most dies anyway despite how much extra shooty people do, fish or hunt as much as possible so we are much the same, there was a time where I was all shooty like you and both bow/gun but fishing has been going hard now for a few years as well so the bow stuff dropped off, it's freezer filling priorities primarily here, pre-tie almost everything I can before any fishing trip to maximize on water time, same for hunting stuff, bow or gun, learned the lessons of 'over practice' and getting too far past practical rabbit holes long ago, enough to have confidence and limits and work within it, you know when you're competent and confident for goals and when not and get to work when you're not, no outside verification needed...internal, competing against other people when could be fishing or hunting would never make my list, reminds me, gotta touch up the filet knife here and tie more stuff for the weekend,

go until we can go no more

 

[mxgsfmdpx]

First off I am a diehard 270win shooter, but I was given a ruger America predator 6.5cm by a friend
And have zero clue where to setup the rifle for 0-350 shots with a non dial up turret scope
( my damn AI computer search just kicks out 0 at 100 and dial for range)
My 270’s just shoot way different then a 6.5cm ,
Or am I just over thinking it and sight it in same as my 270win and 375Ruger
These computer models are confusing me
( with stuff like this “” A 6.5 Creedmoor pushing a 142-grain Nosler AccuBond Long Range 2700 fps and zeroed 3.45 inches high at 100 yards has a MPBR of 310 yards.”)

You're making this way more complicated than it needs to be for 0-350 yard shots with a 6.5CM.

Zero at 100 yards. Ensure you have a good and solid 100 yard zero with 10+ shots. This should land you somewhere around 1.5-2 MOA for shooter and "system" capabilities. From there, using a good/known scope with good/known reticle and simply use your reticle hold over for elevation and wind.

"Holding inches" is not a thing. Holding "half animal" or "quarter" animal is do-able, but if you think you have the honest ability to break it down and "hold inches" you need to go shoot more.

Despite what folks on the internet will tell you, there isn't a single shooter I've shot with who is consistently, shot to shot, on demand, holding a "certain amount of inches" on a deer or elk at 350 yards. You already have 1.5-2 MOA of "error" just in the shooter and gun, someone trying to then "hold inches" on top of that is laughably inaccurate and not repeatable. Particularly when any wind hold is then also factored into the "inches of hold guessing game".

We've had dozens of shooters convinced that they can "hold inches" on deer and elk sized targets painted to blend into terrain. Then when tested in the field, the amount of first round vitals hits from shooters claiming to be successful with this is method is such a low percentage that it makes your head spin that guys still hunt this way and claim to be "ethical" or "successful". Let alone what their 5-10 shot "groups" look like at 300+ yard using "inches holds" for elevation and wind.

 

[S-3 ranch]

Can you point to the milk jug on this image for me?
View attachment 920105

And what about at 420yds? How many imaginary milk jugs high at 360?

Yes lol it’s on the shoulder
0 wind @ 360 it’s 2 milk jugs and 1/2 a water bottle high about hairline
10 mph left to right wind it’s about 4 jugs across the back towards the Texas heart shot unless you’re shooting a 6.5-300 Roy mag
But I’m not burning my tag to shoot that dinky Dan ! lol

And I’m with coyote it’s fishing season and time to fill up ice chest with red snapper and grouper ! Yellowfin tuna in September

 

[Stinky Coyote]

Wow. I’m not trying to be rude, but what you just described here, while I’m glad it works for you, is undoubtedly more difficult, takes far more thought (for me), and would actually take longer than a well practiced hunter who is good with a MOA/mils system and a reticle, or even dial, and it’s far more precise.

It just sounds like you are trying to convince us that riding bicycle backwards is better than the traditional way. It’s not going to change minds.

I can see that as fast or faster than I could find whatever the mil output might spit out of my sig might be and apply it to the reticle or for the quick math guys that nearly as fast as the sig, same thing. You are getting the info and referencing it, at one end or the other, and trying to do that with minimal steps. Dialling even slower adding steps. When you get beyond that type of range yes you need the internal rulers for added precision but not up to certain ranges where most of the killy happens. We are wired spatially and visually, it's very fast. It is not hard to see 2-3' and any inch segments of that against all the animals we chase including coyotes, we instinctively know their sizes subconsciously, like people standing in a room, can prolly land within 1-2" of their heights and can prolly land within 5-10 lbs on their weights by looking at them also...if asked, just hope it's a room full of men not women.

Gotta go try it if you never have, you may be surprised. If you don't have a lifetime based in working with units of measure and institutionalized to a tape measure then this likely won't work for you but most of us hunter types are very familiar with inches and feet and maybe don't even realize how easy that is to gauge. Like fishing, calling fish within an inch is easy, do it lots and it's down to the cm, doing it every weekend right now lol.

So I have to laugh, if not feel offended, when a guy pops off like buddy on another guy who also understands this and has been doing it for a lifetime successfully and quickly. If guys are truly trying to fill their quiver with all the tools and try all the stuff...then here ya go, you may find this tool very useful for filling tags. I would never need anything other than a rangefinder and some 50 yard drop inches but I'm glad to have some of this other stuff too, but I don't forgo what works really well just to use the other. Time and place. For fillin tags there's options and just because some are old options does not mean they weren't occam razor'd from the get go.

Don't get me wrong, if time avails I'll use the precision onboard, but say guiding the kids it's so much faster to just tell them where to reference the crosshair on the animal, they just get'r'done from there. And like I pointed out in those other members examples, the one guy with elk at 300 but could no longer read his turret to dial, if he knew his inches he would have moved up and killed the elk, slam dunk. For the dad/daughter, if he was on his zero and knew his inches...he could have told her where to hold on the elk and also slam dunk. There are so many examples where understanding your trajectory intimately at this level fills the tag and super super fast with minimal think, almost instinctual speed. Add these tools boys, your freezers can thank me later.