Help Setting Up Elk Hunting Arrows

[he_lives]

Hey Guys.

I'm new to the forum and new to archery in general. I purchased a PSE Freak SP and have been working through the steps to get everything set up.

Being 6'5'', I was measured for a 32.5" draw length (reason for purchasing the PSE Freak), but after my first archery lesson last night, it was decided that I'm closer to a 31.5" to 32" draw length. With my bow adjusted to 70-lbs and 31" with a ~1/2" D-loop, everything felt much better and I think I will stay at this draw length.

Now that I've practiced a bit, and have had a lesson with critiques to my form and draw length, I'd like to start working on tuning my bow with arrows. I would like to make it to a couple 3-d tournaments this summer, but ultimately, I would like to get set up for elk hunting. I have already purchased a dozen GoldTip Kinetic XT 200 arrows that have the factory 2" vanes installed and have read all that I can about setting up arrows for elk hunting. I've read that an FOC of 12-15% provides a good combination of accuracy and penetration so I figured I'd target that range.

Bow: 2015 PSE Freak SP
Draw: 31"
Weight: 70-lb

Shaft: GoldTip Kinetic XT 200 (11.6 Gr/In)
Vanes: 2" Vanes (came installed from factory - 7 grains each)
Knocks: Accutough (11.6 gr)
Inserts: Accutough (24.8 gr)
Tip/BH: 125 gr


With the recent change to my draw length, I no longer know the length of my arrows. I will measure the length of my arrow to my riser tonight, but I believe it is approximately 28.75 to 29-in. My thought was to make up arrows at 29, 29.5, and 30 inches to see how they fly, but this gives me a FOC of 11-11.25%. Should I go with a different insert that adds more weight to the tip? I'm open to any suggestions for changing components, but would like to stick with the GT Kinetic 200 unless there is a big reasons these are a poor choice. I don't currently have the ability to fletch my own arrows, but I don't mind getting a jig if needed.


Can anyone weigh in on my setup and any changes you might make?

Thanks.

 

[Bwana]

Wow I'd love to have that draw length
Whats your total arrow weight, and are you shooting fixed/expandable broadheads ?

 

[he_lives]

Thats what I keep hearing about my draw length! Downside is there is a pretty limited bow selection (helps a ton knowing I can get 31" to work though).

I haven't made up any of the GT arrows yet, but assuming I use the components that came with them and cut them to 29", my weight would be about 519-gr.

I plan to use fixed broadheads. I have 125-gr Montec and am considering trying shuttle t's or slick tricks as well.

 

[Trial153]

Only thing I would change is swapping out the half out and use I get brass HITS instead. If you really want to go top shelf order a dozen flanged VPA collars too...

 

[theleo91386]

Cut them so they're even with the front of your riser and use 125gr points. You and the elk will never be able to tell the difference in 1% of FOC.

 

[Beendare]

Cut them so they're even with the front of your riser and use 125gr points. You and the elk will never be able to tell the difference in 1% of FOC.

^ agreed. A little long is no big deal but if you cut them short...you cannot go back. FOC is no big deal.

You have a quandry as to 3D and elk. The heavier arrow performs better on elk but you want every tiny bit of trajectory in 3D.

I use my 500gr elk arrow for 3d and call it good. When I was competitive, I shot a 380 gr arrow for 3D and had 2 sights- one for hunting and one for 3D.

Or you could go for an in between say 420-450 gr arrow as a compromise.....it all works.
Good for you dialing in your form/technique. FYI, tuning is a very important component of archery....don't leave that out.

 

[he_lives]

Thanks for all the input so far!

I'm basically interested in using 3D shoots as practice for hunting season and plan to shoot whatever "elk" arrow I come up with...even if this means that the arrow isn't ideal for 3D shooting.

What I'm hearing so far is to cut the arrows to my riser length (or slightly longer), then set up the arrows with brass HIT inserts and possibly collars, then get a fetching jig and further tune with longer vanes?

 

[doverpack12]

Shoot a few test arrows if you can to determine how fast you are shooting. Fixed 125 grain heads I would want to shoot under 300 fps for sure and preferably closer to 280 fps. This will be a much more foregiving and less touchy setup for less than ideal shot conditions. With your draw and that bow I think you need to be way over 500 grain arrow. I shoot a 330 fps Ibo bow with a 500 grain arrow at 280 fps with a 29.5" draw.

 

[he_lives]

I re-measured my arrow length tonight and came up with 28.75" from the nock to the front edge of the arrow rest and then 1.75" from the rest to the front edge of the riser...so I'm thinking of cutting the arrows to 30.5".

doverpack12 - If a lower velocity is preferable, would I be better off shooting my bow at 65-lb? Or trying to get the arrow weight up high enough to slow the velocity.

 

[doverpack12]

I re-measured my arrow length tonight and came up with 28.75" from the nock to the front edge of the arrow rest and then 1.75" from the rest to the front edge of the riser...so I'm thinking of cutting the arrows to 30.5".

doverpack12 - If a lower velocity is preferable, would I be better off shooting my bow at 65-lb? Or trying to get the arrow weight up high enough to slow the velocity.

Really either will work. I'm not sure I can say one is better than the other. Some people say bows shoot more consistent at max poundage but I cannot confirm that as I have not checked it for myself.

 

[theleo91386]

I re-measured my arrow length tonight and came up with 28.75" from the nock to the front edge of the arrow rest and then 1.75" from the rest to the front edge of the riser...so I'm thinking of cutting the arrows to 30.5".

doverpack12 - If a lower velocity is preferable, would I be better off shooting my bow at 65-lb? Or trying to get the arrow weight up high enough to slow the velocity.

Use the GT inserts and collars and you should end up with an arrow in the 550-560gr range with a 125gr point. Your bow IBO's at 354 @ 33", considering you'll be shooting 1"-1.5" shorter draw length (deduct 10-15fps from IBO) and your arrow is 200gr heavier than an IBO shaft you should be below the 300fps mark, probably closer to 290fps or a bit slower. Broadhead flight shouldn't be a problem, but if you get a jig you can play with the helical and different vanes to get them flying how you want them to provided that your bow is tuned correctly.

 

[Beendare]

OP, I get you are shooting for the 'perfect setup' ...

THE most important thing is not to be underspined with a hunting arrow. Now a guy with great form CAN shoot an underspined arrow...but its a bad idea when hunting. Stiffer arrows tune just fine and overall save you grief in many ways...don't add so much weight on the end of your arrow to get higher FOC then create an underspined condition [as many internet wonders incorrectly recommend!]

Everything else is gravy. Just about every vane will work to stabilize your arrow from the small blazers to big 4" vanes as long as there is a little offset or helical. Then you tune for perfect arrow flight and done. Archery is all about technique....and not so much about FOC, a perfect speed,weight, etc

 

[he_lives]

Appreciate all the comments and advice.

I realize there is no perfect arrow and the only way that I can determine what works for me is trying a few combinations out.

Since it was recommended, and I already have most the components, I think I'll just make up 3 arrows using the GT Kinetic XT 200's with the supplied accutough inserts and order the ballistic collars to go with. It doesn't sound like there are any accuracy/ durability concerns with that setup and from GT's arrow chart I should have plenty of spine.

 

[5MilesBack]

Just make sure you keep the shafts at least 30" carbon to carbon, so that I can take those arrows off your hands if they don't work out.

My 532gr Kinetic XT 200's are going 289fps at 32 1/2" draw and 70lbs. So at 31" draw I'd expect closer to 275fps. But if you add weight to your arrows you'll be slower than that.

If the XT 200's don't work out for you, I have a dozen BE Rampage 250's already made up that would probably work well for you too. They come in right around 480gr.

 

[StoneMtnSteel]

I would only run gold tip products in gold tip shafts buddy. I tried the Easton brass inserts and could not get them to stay in there. Currently I'm running kinetic 300's with gold tip inserts with a 10 gr fact weight, I pulled the factory nocks out and run x nocks now also. Havnt had any issues since.

 

[Beendare]

OP,

I was thinking about your good for 3D/ Elk hunting question on arrows.

I have a few friends that are very competitive at 3D [not pros....but they win local tournaments and place at our state BH tournament] that kind of thing....plus they are died in the wool elk hunters. All of them shoot the same arrow that they hunt with and they are between 420-440gr. You can bet that they have their bows tuned well and have perfect arrow flight. So though I think there is an advantage to a little heavier arrow on elk....these guys have found this to be a happy medium and its what I would do if trying to be more competitive in 3D.

If you asked them what is important, I can guarantee they would say your shooting form by a wide margin trumps everything else....then tuning....and good ranging skills. Hope that helps....

 

[5MilesBack]

I would only run gold tip products in gold tip shafts buddy. I tried the Easton brass inserts and could not get them to stay in there. Currently I'm running kinetic 300's with gold tip inserts with a 10 gr fact weight, I pulled the factory nocks out and run x nocks now also. Havnt had any issues since.

I run HIT's in all my .204" ID arrows including the Kinetic XT's without issue. Maybe it is just the brass ones that have trouble????

 

[he_lives]

That's great advice, thanks for the input. With my draw length, I'm not sure I would be able to get down to the 420-440 Gr range...but I think your point is they don't make their arrows overly heavy for elk hunting.

I couldn't find the ballistic collars locally in my shaft size, so I have them ordered. It's my understanding that they do not necessarily have to be glued on, which gives me a chance to tweak my setup. I can setup my arrows with just the GT shafts/inserts and a 100gr tip and be at 507 Gr, or go all the way to 547 Gr with GT arrows, ballistic collar, and 125 Gr tip.

I'll continue to work on form and hopefully can find a combo of ballistic collars and tips that tunes well.

 

[StoneMtnSteel]

Yeah I ran brass hits in all my arrows with the Easton glue. None gave me trouble except the kinetics. It worked out though the gold tip insert plus the weight I run now is +- 35 gr plus a +-14 gr for the ballistic collar.

 

[doverpack12]

I still wouldn't loose track or thought of speed. I like your plan moving forward but keep speed in mind. Sure there are some really good archers who shoot 300 fps + and do it well with fixed blades but the majority or people I run into who shoot a lot and work on tuning etc. it still have issues are shooting really fast. A lot of the time they have good arrow weight 420 grains plus but because everyone has a different bow and draw weight I think speed is just as much of a factor if not more than weight. Keep them under 300 fps and preferably closer to 280 fps and you will. E happy.