Glassing Distance Question

[SteveTX]

Quick question on glassing distance for muleys.

Using a 20-60x65 spotter, is it reasonable to expect to tell whether a buck is worth going after from 2.5 miles away? Not necessarily judging a score or points, but just by size of frame, etc. If not, what would be your max distance for making that call?

Thanks guys.

 

[mtnrunner260]

All spotters can do that in ideal conditions
Alpha glass will do it better and more so in less than ideal conditions

 

[Bull_n_heat]

Agreed. Lots hinge on that question. I'd think if you just see that a deer has a lot on it's head and that's all that makes you want to go after it, your setup should do the job.

 

[Mykolaivka887]

Yeah, at 2 miles and 45x magnification or possibly higher - if atmospheric conditions allow - you should be able to tell if a mule deer buck at that distance is worth getting a better look a little closer in, or staying put and looking for something else.

 

[AZ_Hunter_2000]

Clarity of glass trumps magnification. You're better off with a Kowa 554 (15-45x) than with a Vortex Diamondback (20-60x) due to the significantly better glass in the Kowa.

Those that often provide hard numbers (ex: consistently field judge a bull elk to the inch at 3 miles with hand-held 10x binoculars) are full of cow excrement. There are too many variables to put a hard number on maximum distance for any optic.

Here is a real life example of what I encountered while scouting for a Coues hunt (overlapping terrain for mule deer and Coues):

Glassed up a bedded deer with my SLC 15s less than 1200 yards away. Kept glassing and decided to use my spotter (STX 95) to get a closer look at that deer. Yep, looked like a mule deer doe. So I moved on which happen to cut the distance to the deer. So I looked at my SLCs and it still was a doe. Kept glassing for Coues, checked and the doe was still there. Took a look through my STX 95 and yep, it was a doe. That was until she turned her head and had a large rack (170 class).With the buck tucked tight up in a bush, I could not make out the rack until it moved. This is with alpha glass at under 1000 yards under a bright and clear afternoon (damn near ideal conditions).

Focus on getting the clearest glass you can in your budget even if it means taking a hit on magnification.

 

[sndmn11]

Get a digiscope adapter and use your phone. Then you'll be able to keep the optic's zoom at a level that avoids shakes, mirage, and light issues while using the digital zoom on the phone. You can also take video and use it for evaluation while zooming in on that video itself.

 

[Mykolaivka887]

Clarity of glass trumps magnification. You're better off with a Kowa 554 (15-45x) than with a Vortex Diamondback (20-60x) due to the significantly better glass in the Kowa.

Those that often provide hard numbers (ex: consistently field judge a bull elk to the inch at 3 miles with hand-held 10x binoculars) are full of cow excrement. There are too many variables to put a hard number on maximum distance for any optic.

Here is a real life example of what I encountered while scouting for a Coues hunt (overlapping terrain for mule deer and Coues):

Glassed up a bedded deer with my SLC 15s less than 1200 yards away. Kept glassing and decided to use my spotter (STX 95) to get a closer look at that deer. Yep, looked like a mule deer doe. So I moved on which happen to cut the distance to the deer. So I looked at my SLCs and it still was a doe. Kept glassing for Coues, checked and the doe was still there. Took a look through my STX 95 and yep, it was a doe. That was until she turned her head and had a large rack (170 class).With the buck tucked tight up in a bush, I could not make out the rack until it moved. This is with alpha glass at under 1000 yards under a bright and clear afternoon (damn near ideal conditions).

Focus on getting the clearest glass you can in your budget even if it means taking a hit on magnification.

Yeah, no one but God can estimate a bull elk that's moving around 3 miles away by peering at it through a 10x binocular.

 

[SteveTX]

Get a digiscope adapter and use your phone. Then you'll be able to keep the optic's zoom at a level that avoids shakes, mirage, and light issues while using the digital zoom on the phone. You can also take video and use it for evaluation while zooming in on that video itself.

Good tip! Thank you.

 

[Dioni A]

Your going to be hard pressed with most optics under most conditions to judge a deer at 2.5 miles. The air usually isn't clear enough until late fall when most the west coast fires get put out. I feel lucky get much over a mile most of the time using Swarovski 80mm and 95mm scopes. Bigger lenses help cut through bad air too.

 

[Poser]

Lots of factors including sun angle and air quality. 2.5 miles is pretty far.

I took this pic recently with a 16x45x65 Gen 1 Vortex Razor at a little under 2 miles. The sun angle had to be right just to see antlers. Sun angle was across the slope.

 

[Mykolaivka887]

Lots of factors including sun angle and air quality. 2.5 miles is pretty far.

I took this pic recently with a 16x45x65 Gen 1 Vortex Razor at a little under 2 miles. The sun angle had to be right just to see antlers. Sun angle was across the slope.

Yep, gives you a pretty good indication at that distance as to whether a mule deer buck is worth getting within a mile of, for a better look.

 

[AZ_Hunter_2000]

Yeah, no one but God can estimate a bull elk that's moving around 3 miles away by peering at it through a 10x binocular.

Been some posts (previous threads) that have alluded to being able to do some accurate field judging with low(er) powered optics at distance.

But there are times (albeit rare) where the light/atmosphere/etc all line up and it is crazy how clear you can see things at very long distances. But those are rare times.

 

[wytx]

Heat mirage will be a limiting factor on how far your can judge them through glass too.
The digi scope is a great idea.

 

[Mykolaivka887]

Been some posts (previous threads) that have alluded to being able to do some accurate field judging with low(er) powered optics at distance.

But there are times (albeit rare) where the light/atmosphere/etc all line up and it is crazy how clear you can see things at very long distances. But those are rare times.

My guide and I were hunting elk one year down there in Arizona and just before sundown on the last day of season, we finally spotted the bull that I would of put my tag on. Definitely a 400-ish type bull (+/- 20 inches or so).

Setting sun was beaming right on him at about 2.5 miles and the rain/snow earlier that day had cleared every particle of dust and pollen from the air. He stuck out like a sore thumb in my 20x binos.

Even still, the 20x binos weren't enough at that distance to measure antlers to the inch, other than to confirm that he was freaking enormous.

Nevertheless, I do hear what your saying .....

 

[SteveTX]

Thanks everyone for the inputs.
Been e-scouting a unit for ‘23 and looking at potential glassing spots. This is helpful.

 

[Calbuck]

If you can see significant antlers, yes, you should make a play to get a better look. Period.

 

[Jimss]

Quality glass, heat waves, and light conditions are 3 of the top variables. Also the background is important. If antlers blend with the background it will be tough. Notice that the buck antlers in the above photo are lit up by the sun. If those same bucks were in the shade the antlers would be extremely tough to see. Sometimes you can wait for game to move so they have a contrasting background. Sometimes it may be worth waiting for bucks to hit the horizon with light sky behind them to contrast their antlers. Obviously it's a lot easier to view antlers with snow in the background than dirt or vegetation.

I compared digiscope vs spotter vs superzoom telephoto camera vs superzoom camcorder a couple years ago while sheep scouting. I took ram photos/video several trips across a giant canyon. The very worse quality photos/video was with the digi-scope. The best was my superzoom camera. I actually could field judge better with my super zoom than my Swaro spotter on a tripod. I also have a small camcorder that was actually pretty close to the quality of my Swaro but had higher zoom. I guess a digi-scope is better than nothing and is lighter/less bulky than other options. My limited experience is that digi-scoping is over rated and horrible for field judging game!

 

[Mykolaivka887]

Quality glass, heat waves, and light conditions are 3 of the top variables ...... Notice that the buck antlers in the photo are lit up by the sun. If those same bucks were in the shade the antlers would be extremely tough to see.

These are true statements and most if not all of us have experienced it at one time or another, even at close range. As an example, my outfitter and I spotted what appeared to be a super-size Coues buck a few years ago right at last light, on an east-facing slope of an open mountainside. The buck was about a mile away and the light had become so dim, that we both had already switched over to our 10x binos. We tried putting the buck in a spotting scope, but it was so dark that we couldn't even find the buck in the scope. Ditto for the 20x binos. Nevertheless, even at a mile and in approaching darkness, and with the better light gathering ability of our 10x binos, we could both tell that it was a heck of a buck. Oh well, can't kill 'em all.