Finally, a bolt rifle I can love!

There is no need to shoot dozens of 10 shot groups. Once I have a load developed, I confirm zero. After that, the group shooting is done.

For the record, I'm not a precision shooter either. However, there is absolutely nothing wrong with 1) wanting to know what kind of accuracy the gun is capable of in my hands and 2) the gun has a zero that is based on a large enough sample size to eliminate most randomness. I guess if these are bad things then I'm doing it all wrong.
 
I see what your what your saying. To me I see it as shoot a bunch of rounds through your rifle/find a load you like, then spend all summer shooting from different positions and distances.
 
Bwana said:
It's larger because the steel expanded, and the inside expanded too...making the diameter smaller
Click to expand...

I mean this in the nicest possible way: this is a very common misconception. The fact is that the bore of a hot barrel is larger than when it was cold. The barrel expands in both ID and OD.

Think of it this way: imagine a plate of steel. Now draw a circle on it (representing the bore in cross-section). Now heat the plate uniformly. The whole plate gets larger, right? And the circle that you drew on it is larger now, too. Right?

To put some numbers on it: the thermal expansion coefficient for carbon steel is around 11x10-6 per degree Kelvin. So if you go from freezing (32F) to too hot to touch (140F) that's about 60K difference, and your bore would expand by a factor of 6.6x10-4. So if you were shooting a .338 it would expand by .0002" (two tenths).
 
oenanthe said:
I mean this in the nicest possible way: this is a very common misconception. The fact is that the bore of a hot barrel is larger than when it was cold. The barrel expands in both ID and OD.

Think of it this way: imagine a plate of steel. Now draw a circle on it (representing the bore in cross-section). Now heat the plate uniformly. The whole plate gets larger, right? And the circle that you drew on it is larger now, too. Right?

To put some numbers on it: the thermal expansion coefficient for carbon steel is around 11x10-6 per degree Kelvin. So if you go from freezing (32F) to too hot to touch (140F) that's about 60K difference, and your bore would expand by a factor of 6.6x10-4. So if you were shooting a .338 it would expand by .0002" (two tenths).
Click to expand...

Yep, this is why you can get a bearing off by applying heat.
 
Is this Benchrest Central? Ha! You gotta sprinkle pixie dust too..

Cold bore hits at random distances are really the only shots that matter. Once you've established dope, you can get more out of 10 shots than 100 groups.

Anyway, analysis paralysis.
 
aclawrence said:
I see what your what your saying. To me I see it as shoot a bunch of rounds through your rifle/find a load you like, then spend all summer shooting from different positions and distances.
Click to expand...
The best practice I've found is to find a bunch of rock chucks, practice glassing, ranging, and shooting them. They are great targets out to the 1k line. Then when your driving around scouting etc, look for targets, set up and engage them at various distances with the goal being 1 shot hits. Shoot off sticks, bipod, prone, whatever to mimic real hunting situations.
 
I'm fortunate to have a 300 yard range set up in my backyard. When I get a new rifle, I work up a load, shooting multiple shot (usually 5) groups, till I have my load. Then in the days ahead, I will shoot "first shot" shots at 100 - 200 - & 300 yards and if the first shot is hitting where it is supposed to at each of those distances, consistently, it stays in the safe. If it doesn't, it may get tinkered with or it will go into the trading group and will become someone else's project rifle. That is what I expect/demand out of my hunting rifles.

I have other guns that I own for just sitting at the bench and seeing if on that day, I am able to hold that rifle steady enough to put 3, 5, or however many rounds I decide, into the tiniest hole that I can.

Sounds like to me that the OP has a great hunting rifle in his hands.
 
WRO said:
The best practice I've found is to find a bunch of rock chucks, practice glassing, ranging, and shooting them. They are great targets out to the 1k line. Then when your driving around scouting etc, look for targets, set up and engage them at various distances with the goal being 1 shot hits. Shoot off sticks, bipod, prone, whatever to mimic real hunting situations.
Click to expand...

That sounds like a lot of fun!
 
Congrats on the new rifle. Looks like you shoot it well and are enjoying it. The two most important aspects of happy and successful ownership.:)
 
IMO you guys are busting "Form's" chops for comments which I see as well informed from experience, that's what he's offered - I don't do it exactly that way and nobody else need's to either but to get snippy with him for adding his $0.02 is what ruins these otherwise informative threads for a lot of us - Since everyone else has said their "what I do is ......", I'll do likewise (it's sort of "methodical" so you that are skeptical just pass on by) I work up and decide which load(s) for which bullet(s) is promising (or outright what I was hoping for) and shoot a 3 shot group - IF that group sticks together I'll shoot 2 more 3 shot groups of the same load, if they all look equally good I'll then shoot 2 separate groups of however many rounds THAT gun holds - I shoot them as quickly as I can get back solidly on target and usually set that rifle aside to shoot another rifle coming back to the original gun as I get time, NOT worrying about how "cold" the barrel is - After that LOAD has proven itself (to me) I'll do another fully loaded group from a bipod on the bench, then another from the bipod prone, oftentimes on another day - Still all good ? GREAT
From that point on until hunting season, each time I come to the range to shoot other guns or sometimes to just shoot that rifle if I have time, I'll set up and hang the same original target used with the last group and shoot at the same POA once, if the shot's in the group I pack up and carry on, in MY perfect world I'll be able to do that 8-10 times before going hunting and if it all went as hoped I'll not question my rifle for anything, if I miss it's ALL ME - that is one point of going through all of this because it's a hunting rifle and I will be hunting with it .....
anyone who fears "shooting out" their barrel need rest assured that I've not done that with ANY rifle I worked up a load for or trouble shot, ever

in the case of the 7mm/300 Win Mag 900 rounds is pretty much right on what I got out of 2 PacNor barrels, 900 rounds each which is ALOT of rounds for one rifle, yet another reason why I now shoot an '06 AI Tikka superlight that's been pillar bedded and rechambered (smith said it was "perfectly squared" from the factory) and that's all
 
Form is a smart dude, I've read a bunch of his posts.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk
 
WRO said:
Form is a smart dude, I've read a bunch of his posts.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk
Click to expand...


Yes, and he tests and uses equipment in ways that most of us would never dream of.
i appreciate his knowledge and experiences.

Randy
 
mtnwrunner said:
Yes, and he tests and uses equipment in ways that most of us would never dream of.
i appreciate his knowledge and experiences.

Randy
Click to expand...
Same here. He provides good insight from solid experience and conveys the knowledge in a non oppressive way.

Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk
 
Ten shot groups are considered a true test of a rifles capabilities and pretty much the gold standard in the ELR crowd.
 
Jason Snyder said:
There is no need to shoot dozens of 10 shot groups. Once I have a load developed, I confirm zero. After that, the group shooting is done.

For the record, I'm not a precision shooter either. However, there is absolutely nothing wrong with 1) wanting to know what kind of accuracy the gun is capable of in my hands and 2) the gun has a zero that is based on a large enough sample size to eliminate most randomness. I guess if these are bad things then I'm doing it all wrong.
Click to expand...

Jason uses different words but his and my intentions are alike ....
 
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