Explain the use case for synthetic insulation

[<cascadehunter>]

When/how do you use a syntethic insulation piece like the Arc Atom or Kuiu Kenai? I know a lot of guys like them, and im trying to evaluate how/if it would fit in for me personally. Say you have a basic 4 piece system. Base, mid layer (grid fleece), puffy (down), hardshell. Are you replacing the grid fleece as an active layer in colder temps? Are you just adding it as piece #5?
In addition, how does a synthetic insulation compare in use to a fleece with a soft-ish shell like the Sitka Ambient or FL Navigator? These I really know nothing about.

 

[lost_in_the_wma]

I hadn’t heard if these particular jackets but from looking at them they’re trying to do contradictory things, it said something like “stay warm without overheating” ok well nothing can do everything, a lot of times when weather is variable the reality is you just have to take off layers and pack them. This is coming more from backpacking experience than hunting, I’m in south Florida now where generally cold is not the issue lol.


To answer more specifically though, base layers have some use cases for being able to dry relatively quickly (because sweat is often inevitable), being fairly anti microbial (because multi day trips doesn’t always allow laundry) but personally I prefer merino because it’s quite anti microbial and dries quickly enough usually.

For puffy stuff like jackets and sleeping bags, the only use case is if you’re allergic to down and must sacrifice quality to avoid getting allergy symptoms or if you want to avoid the supply chain of down production.

That’s all my two cents I can throw at you, hope something in there was useful lol

 

[ozyclint]

Synthetic sleeping bag in cold damp conditions. That's what I use in Westland New Zealand.
Think PNW, SE AK but wetter.

 

[TaperPin]

Many guys who spend a lot of time outdoors don’t like down because wet down is as useful as wet newspapers and they would rather have all synthetic, even if that includes synthetic fill in a puffy. When I first came here it was a surprise that everyone either has a down puffy and pants or wants them.

Growing up there was a well respected guy in town I had never met who pushed his luck too far wearing a puffy in freezing rain as his primary insulating layer under a shell of some kind and didn’t make it back to his truck before hypothermia got him. Of course now I think it was poor judgement to not better manage moisture, and to not stop and build a fire sooner, not the fault of the puffy, but it had a chilling effect on the adults at the time who started teaching us young kids to not rely on down. Down is so light and comfortable it has a place, but I bet half the guys that use it don’t fully understand or respect its limitations.

 

[PathFinder]

1. In extremely wet conditions, where keeping stuff dry isn't realistic.
2. For more active pieces.

Lighter synthetic jackets are good for high exertion in extreme cold.

Sent from my Pixel 6 using Tapatalk

 

[Maverick1]

Synthetic for damp or wet conditions. And, as an outer layer for bowhunting. (The outer face fabric of most down garments is typically nylon, which is not quiet, and gets worse the colder it gets.) Down for greater warmth / lighter garment. Couple of examples:

• Sitting over a waterhole with the bow: synthetic (quieter)
• Sitting at camp: down (warmer, lighter)
• Glassing: down
• Anything when rain expected: synthetic

Fleece is kind of useless, IMO. Have not used it in about 10-15 years.

• Very low CLO value (much lower insulation value than either down or synthetic).
• No real CLO value when wet. And absorbs water, weighs a lot when it gets wet.
• Quiet (but that's about it). Can get the nearly the same level of quietness with a synthetic outer face garment.

 

[ozyclint]

What's CLO?
I'm trying to piece together the acronym but I'm not getting it.

 

[Poser]

Heavy, wet snow conditions pretty much suck for down. Sure, you can put your shell on over your down puffy, but heavy wet snow, falling from the sky, falling from branches and brushing up up against you in the timber will overwhelm a shell fairly quickly and then you will start building condensation up inside of the shell and wet out your down. Heavy wet snow will also cave your tent walls in significantly and cause crazy condensation build up inside of a single wall tent for the same reason.

 

[justinspicher]

Synthetic user here. I switched from merino and down about two years ago after having durability issues and bigger issues with the customer service from the parent companies.

So far my synthetic has worked very well for me, I’m always learning on how to manage moisture, every outing is a bit different.

I’m probably a bit different from most folks as I don’t use a rain jacket or soft shell as my outer layer, I just use a synthetic puffy.

 

[mtnbound]

When/how do you use a syntethic insulation piece like the Arc Atom or Kuiu Kenai? I know a lot of guys like them, and im trying to evaluate how/if it would fit in for me personally. Say you have a basic 4 piece system. Base, mid layer (grid fleece), puffy (down), hardshell. Are you replacing the grid fleece as an active layer in colder temps? Are you just adding it as piece #5?
In addition, how does a synthetic insulation compare in use to a fleece with a soft-ish shell like the Sitka Ambient or FL Navigator? These I really know nothing about.

Going off your 4 piece system. The Kuiu Kenai is your puffy layer I also have down puffy’s if the weather will cold and dry.

The FL Navigator could replace your grid fleece, but for me active insulation doesn’t really work. It’s designed to work for certain types of folks, in certain temp ranges doing certain amount of physical exertion. I run warm and I find it best to only be in a base layer if I know I have some big exertion coming up. If after the physical exertion I need insulation then I’ll throw another layer on.

For my experience I would not use an active insulation layer under a puffy because you are limiting its effectiveness with an over-layer and if you are wearing a puffy likely it’s cold enough that you would benefit more from a regular insulation layer. There could of course be times when a puffy is needed first thing in the morning but it warms up a bit and then an active insulation layer might be beneficial, but again it’s all based to your body type, temp and activity level.

Synthetics do a couple of things great, wick moisture off your body and dry fast. For me wool allows for better temperature management than synthetics and feels better.

Each have the place and you need to test for yourself to see what’s works for you.

 

[lost_in_the_wma]

This has been extremely enlightening for me. I have friends who got in situations where their down fill sleeping bag got wet and spent a miserable night trying to dry it over the fire, burning it some in the process. A lot of people use waterproof stuff sacks for their down sleeping bag for that reason.

Great points from you guys. These days as I’m getting finally just getting into hunting in a very hot climate I’m just wearing the lightest layer of camo possible which is also synthetic now that I think about it. But I’ve learned from the experience of you guys here for when I’ll be back in the cold.