ELD-X issues

[AKAV8R]

From SG3 video in gelView attachment 964832 …

That resembles two 338 WM Hornady ELDX 230’s we took out of a moose back in September. Killed it just fine, but both hit ribs on entry and fragged between there and the off side hide, with minimal damage to exit rib and scapula. 60-70 yd broadside shots. Was able to bull grunt and stop the running bull. Glad we didn’t have to use the Texas heart shot with those. My first observation of those bullets on Ak game.

 

[alexnelon]

That resembles two 338 WM Hornady ELDX 230’s we took out of a moose back in September. Killed it just fine…

Glowing endorsement.

 

[Jstumbaugh]

Interesting experience with the ELDX a few weeks ago. Shot a bull headed away from me at 125 yards with a texas heart shot. Bullet penetrated from the taint to the base of the spine between the shoulders. Never found that bullet. Second shot from about 60 yards was head broadside , right in the crease. Bullet ended up under the hide on the far side with core separation. What was surprising to me was the lack of bloodshot meat. Bullets didn't hit any solid bone and minimal meat loss. 175gr .284 ELDX at 2800mv. Found bullet retained weight was 60gr. I would have liked more retained weight but I am very happy with the result and also the lack of meat loss on the "violent" bullet disruption. We went gutless with the quartering so really didn't get to check the full damage internally.

 

[hibernation]

The only “consistent” performance that most care about is “killing quickly”. And ironically, in legitimate testing, by far they highest failure rates are from conventional monolithic bullets.

When you say conventional monos, does that include hammers, cutting edge, etc? I've only ever used the Barnes lineup, but animals do seem to travel further and the wound channel really seems to depend on what I hit. If I get a rib or shoulder on entry, it can be great, but if I miss ribs on entry it's a pretty narrow wound.

For the folks less concerned with time to incapacitation, I'm guessing you hunt wide open spaces like farm fields or sagebrush? Thick timber and reprod in the PNW is godawful for blood trailing, animals disappear fast after the first shot.

 

[Formidilosus]

When you say conventional monos, does that include hammers, cutting edge, etc? I've only ever used the Barnes lineup, but animals do seem to travel further and the wound channel really seems to depend on what I hit. If I get a rib or shoulder on entry, it can be great, but if I miss ribs on entry it's a pretty narrow wound.

“Conventional monos”= Barnes TAX/TTSX/LRX, Hornady CX, etc. The fragmenting monos do better than conventional monos, but still not nearly the terminal effects of the best lead core bullets.

For the folks less concerned with time to incapacitation, I'm guessing you hunt wide open spaces like farm fields or sagebrush? Thick timber and reprod in the PNW is godawful for blood trailing, animals disappear fast after the first shot.

I hunt all over- from FL and AL swamps, to NE reprod and old growth, to the mountain west. In truly thick timber/brush I want the most destructive bullet I can get for the caliber, and put it through bone. The last thing I want is narrow wounding bullets.

 

[IDElkmagnet]

I wish people would realize that you can be "pro" something without justifying it by being "anti" another. You can be pro monolithic bullets and not be anti cup and core. You can be pro magnum caliber without being anti small caliber. You can be pro mule without being anti horse. Like what you like and use what you like without claiming everything else sucks.

This is just un American!

 

[Thegman]

To know that this is what controlled expansion actually looks like…
View attachment 964833

As mentioned just above, it is interesting to me that some companies making monolithic bullets are attempting to improve bullet performance by designing monolithic bullets to come apart, rather than stay together like this.

For the record, I don't have dog in this fight as far as one bullet "working well" and another not. I've used all kinds of bullets, and to me, they all work in different ways; I could make a Pros/Cons chart for every one of them. Use whatever you think is best for your particular cartridge and situation.

All these came out of dead animals and no rodeos related to "bullet performance" that I can recall. A couple even managed to kill just fine with jacket/core separation. In those cases "bullet failure" never even remotely entered my mind. To me, core/jacket separation is about as non-issue as non-issue can be. I just don't see the problem other than it makes for a crappy bullet picture.

 

[Q_Sertorius]

As mentioned just above, it is interesting to me that some companies making monolithic bullets are attempting to improve bullet performance by designing monolithic bullets to come apart, rather than stay together like this.

For the record, I don't have dog in this fight as far as one bullet "working well" and another not. I've used all kinds of bullets, and to me, they all work in different ways; I could make a Pros/Cons chart for every one of them. Use whatever you think is best for your particular cartridge and situation.

All these came out of dead animals and no rodeos related to "bullet performance" that I can recall. A couple even managed to kill just fine with jacket/core separation. In those cases "bullet failure" never even remotely entered my mind. To me, core/jacket separation is about as non-issue as non-issue can be. I just don't see the problem other than it makes for a crappy bullet picture.
View attachment 965989

I’ve never cared what the bullet from a dead animal looks like.

 

[KHntr]

This one came from a rodeo. 168 TSX at roughly 3350 impact velocity.
Shot a bull elk quartering to me at about 8 yards with my 300 RUM. Went in between the knuckle at the bottom of his scapula and rib cage, got one lung, liver, stomach, hip bone, and found it just under the hide.
Shot him again when he spun around and was shucking and jiving around blowdown at about 25 yards, but just skimmed the hide at the bottom of his belly and went through his left front leg back to front but didn’t break the bone.
Shot him a 3rd time through both shoulders 3 hours and 600 yards away when he got up from his bed at 40 yards after still hunting pin pricks of blood every two steps. (To this day, still the hardest trailing job I’ve encountered in the spruce and alder jungle.)
Finished him at 10 yards with one to the base of his skull.

Pretty sure a softer bullet would have killed him quicker. Especially considering I’ve taken the same shot more than once since then with softer bullets and it killed those bulls quicker.

And I don’t classify this as a failure, it just didn’t have the result I wanted. Or expected. It wasn’t my first introduction to narrow wound channels, but it was the first time that it started to make me question the effectiveness of long narrow wound channels.

 

[BLJ]

As mentioned just above, it is interesting to me that some companies making monolithic bullets are attempting to improve bullet performance by designing monolithic bullets to come apart, rather than stay together like this.

For the record, I don't have dog in this fight as far as one bullet "working well" and another not. I've used all kinds of bullets, and to me, they all work in different ways; I could make a Pros/Cons chart for every one of them. Use whatever you think is best for your particular cartridge and situation.

All these came out of dead animals and no rodeos related to "bullet performance" that I can recall. A couple even managed to kill just fine with jacket/core separation. In those cases "bullet failure" never even remotely entered my mind. To me, core/jacket separation is about as non-issue as non-issue can be. I just don't see the problem other than it makes for a crappy bullet picture.
View attachment 965989

What’s the gray mushrooms in the middle?

 

[Thegman]

What’s the gray mushrooms in the middle?

Those are 30 caliber 150 Interbonds. I bought a big bag of seconds years ago, found a load with them that my Kimber Montana really likes, and have been using them in that rifle for about 14 years. 150 GMX and 150 TTSX shoot to the same POI so have used those interchangeably on occasion.

I know I have examples of both of those around here somewhere from deer and moose, but they're not in this "tray of death" that sits on the kitchen counter (take that back, the top two, far right are 150 GMX. I remember noticing they tended to expand to a smaller diameter than other monos.)

 

[Tmac]

Interesting debate. My take is Hornady’s advertising set an expectation of some weight retention and no jacket core separation. Had they said something similar to Berger, bullet goes in a few inches and partial or complete fragmentation occurs, there would no debate about bullet performance. But the debate on what bullet performance is best would remain.

When they first came out I used 150 gr. eld-x’s out of. 280 Rem on some WT doe meat hunts, fairly close range, classic lung shots, big mistake. Lots of blow back into the shoulders for my meat goals. They were too destructive, but extraordinarily lethal. That said I would not hesitate to use them for a big buck hunt where I wanted to drop it fast, meat be darned.

I like to pick among the bullets a rifle likes based on my goal for a hunt, usually meat vs horns. I’ve used mono’s, bonded and cup n core, all with great results.

For my son’s recent WY rut MD deer hunt his goal was antlers with meat being secondary. A 115 gr Nosler BT out of his 25-06 at 50 yards resulted in a bang, two steps and a flop. Meat loss was noticeable, lethality was excellent.

Two of my grandsons dropped mule deer this season with 77 gr TMK’s out of 223’s. One had almost no meat loss due to his placement. The other lost about 1/3 of his meat due to placement. Bullet choice was made to optimize shootability with max lethality.

How I roll anyway.

 

[AKAV8R]

Glowing endorsement.

Not at all from my perspective. Where I hunt, and what I hunt, in the calibers I carry, that particular performance is a clear example of what that bullet will not do for ME. I'm not out here shooting deer at long ranges like many do. We have drastically different needs and expectations. I'm hunting to fill several family's freezers, or kill some of the largest land predators on the planet. I expect my bullets to smash through massive shoulders and or massive bones and destroy vitals that may be feet away from the initial impact point. One of my hunting pals is a thoracic surgeon, so we have some pretty informative necropsies. My inexperienced hunting companion bought the only ammo available to him, so that's what he brought. I read the box; it didn't live up to the words printed there. My wolf hunting rig is set up differently altogether. Cheers