Double Barrel Rifle

[Wapiti1]

One thing to understand about doubles is balance. Kreighoffs are not balanced. They are well made, but not balanced correctly. Not unusable, but they feel odd compared to a properly balanced rifle.

What am I talking about? Balance should be at or just in front of the hinge pin. But that is just the balance point. The bulk of the weight should be between the hands. Meaning the stock and barrels should be as light as possible and the action should carry the weight. Kreighoff and Blaser have very small actions and the barrels carry most of the weight. They aren't as fast to point, and don't point as easily as a better balanced rifle (Merkel, Chapuis).

Take a stick 4 feet long and put 10lbs of weight on it. If the weight is near the middle the ends swing easily, and stop easily. If the weight is at the ends, they become hard to swing and hard to stop. This applies to all arms that are intended to be pointed quickly and react quickly.

Just a nuance of doubles. But an important one if you need it in an emergency.

Jeremy

 

[Maverick1]

I have a Savage, break action. 22LR on the top, 20 ga on the bottom. I used it to hunt squirrels when I was a young teenager. Somehow, I don’t think it fits the mood of this conversation……LOL.

 

[TNTBR]

I know this is an older thread but thought I would bring it back to life as I encourage everyone that has interest in owning one to do so. There are some great deals to be made on second hand doubles in the common big bore calibers.
I went through Heym for my first double in 470 and has put 2 buff bulls and 1 cow under its belt thus far, next year Ele bull and hippo if I can get one on land.
One thing most double owners will tell you is that after you get the first you will most likely be looking for a 2nd or 3rd.

 

[Happy Antelope]

I have several doubles and they are worth every dime if you plan on hunting dangerous game someday. I have a 1912 Rigby in a .375 flanged owned by a famous Brit White Hunter who spent time with Roosevelt on safari, spent most of it's life in Kenya, a .470 Nitro. Buddy has a 1920s .450 No.2 and it's by favorite to shoot. Yes you should buy a double all day.

I would recommend a 9.3 or a .375 H&H or flanged unless you want to hunt Buff or elephant then step up. The .470, .500 and .577 will hit hard, but better than shooting a .300 WM all day. Be warned once you shoot a Buff, hunting anything else isn't the same.

The best option for a new one would be a Heym for sure, below that you have a Chapuis, Kreighoff, etc. I spend a lot of time in this world, any questions feel free to drop me a PM anytime. Chris the owner of Heym USA should be at SCI and DSC this month. Tony who works for him knows more about doubles than maybe anyone alive right now short of JJ Perodeau. Perodeau has a website with a ton of them listed for sale as well, mostly older more fun stuff (H&H, Wesltey Ricards, etc.)

 

[Happy Antelope]

I know this is an older thread but thought I would bring it back to life as I encourage everyone that has interest in owning one to do so. There are some great deals to be made on second hand doubles in the common big bore calibers.
I went through Heym for my first double in 470 and has put 2 buff bulls and 1 cow under its belt thus far, next year Ele bull and hippo if I can get one on land.
One thing most double owners will tell you is that after you get the first you will most likely be looking for a 2nd or 3rd.

This is the truth, he means like looking everyday for the rest of your life.....

 

[Happy Antelope]

Pretty sure there’s a dress code just to get into the H&H show room.

Spartan Precision arranged for my son and I a private 2 hr tour at the factory a few years back. Few fun photos attached, one is of the a .700 Nitro they were making for a customer and the shell next to a .500 Nitro. Another is of Mr. Beterra two 9.3s barrels being made on the workbench.

 

[pacoalcracker]

I'm not much of a DR guy, but Butch Searcy makes some fine DR's at common man pricing. I'm more of a big bore bolt rifle guy, Ruger Alaskans in 375 and 416, Ruger M77Magnum in 458 Lott, CZ Magnum in 505 Gibbs from their custom shop, Model 70 Safari Classic in 375 H&H and 458 Win Mag, MGA Ultralight in 375 H&H, and a custom Ruger #1 in 470NE. Been to Africa and it's highly recommended. Got 7 big bore 475 and 50 caliber single action revolvers too.

 

[Northern Safari]

I'm looking to add a German Double rifle this year in 500NE from either Heym, Krieghoff or Merkel.
One thing I'm finding difficult is determining what the 2024 prices are as the manufacturers don't seem to list them on their websites.

 

[Ralphie]

Heym

But. If buying the double delays Africa I would skip it and go to Africa. Or maybe see if you can use a double that the PH has.

 

[Happy Antelope]

I'm looking to add a German Double rifle this year in 500NE from either Heym, Krieghoff or Merkel.
One thing I'm finding difficult is determining what the 2024 prices are as the manufacturers don't seem to list them on their websites.

Chris Sells is the owner of Heym USA, I have his contact info if you want it Send me a PM. I can also get you a contact for Kreighoff.

 

[Macintosh]

Missed this the first two times around. I support this sort of needless addiction and enjoyed the h&h tour. I know very little about double rifles, but I’ve spent a long time with a similar addiction for double shotguns. I’ve had a couple tours of high-end gun makers that are very, very cool, and learned a ton from them as I dabbled in my own custom work. I’m pretty sure I would give up one of my fingers for a tour of the H&H shop!

 

[Happy Antelope]

Missed this the first two times around. I support this sort of needless addiction and enjoyed the h&h tour. I know very little about double rifles, but I’ve spent a long time with a similar addiction for double shotguns. I’ve had a couple tours of high-end gun makers that are very, very cool, and learned a ton from them as I dabbled in my own custom work. I’m pretty sure I would give up one of my fingers for a tour of the H&H shop!

https://www.invaluable.com/auction-lot/f-w-heym-88b-boxlock-ejector-dangerous-game-2132-c-1cb41719ed?objectID=188749623&algIndex=upcoming_lots_lotNumber_asc_prod&queryID=8dd82b1a408f6b9c01353e199c6ac79d

 

[Macintosh]

Dont be that way, man!
I was going to cop the “LOP is too short” excuse, but its not bad. I’ll go with too much drop and I dont want to deal with bending it. I wont say a word about not having a spare 5 or 8 k lying around.

 

[medvedyt]

like @Wapiti1 i have a walmet 412 with a double express barrel in 9.3x74r, one 12ga/222 rem and one set 12ga/12ga maybe not the best looking for fans of british express but it is a great working tool for what im doing.

 

[TREE ‘EM]

I thought I wanted a double rife until I had a couple… Then I was done with them.

There are some superb values to be had from some of the lesser known British and Scottish makers, which are far superior to any of the continental double rifles out there.

Butch Searcy builds a nice entry level double and a superb single rifle.

 

[wildwilderness]

I thought I wanted a double rife until I had a couple… Then I was done with them.

There are some superb values to be had from some of the lesser known British and Scottish makers, which are far superior to any of the continental double rifles out there.

Butch Searcy builds a nice entry level double and a superb single rifle.

What made you not like them? What brand, calibers did you have?

 

[TREE ‘EM]

What made you not like them? What brand, calibers did you have?

Most are finicky and require an enormous amount of load development to be brought to their full potential. All are close to moderate range rifles at best.
I had a Wilkes, Manton, Wesley Richards and Alexander Henry. I’ve shot a few H&H rifles and wasn’t any more impressed with them.

 

[Happy Antelope]

What made you not like them? What brand, calibers did you have?

Stay away from a Sabatti for sure. B Searcy have a geat reputation and will build doubles close to 100K as well. Used to build on Browning shotgun actions, now I think they make their own? Someone can confirm that as not 100% sure. I think they do both Demi Block and Chopper Lumb barrels, the ladder costs more of course. Cheaper rifles like a Merkel I think are through lump? Demi is strongest and cheaper than Chopper, but Chopper gets the barrels closest together. The bite is another important feature to get to know. The Heym bite is a bit ridiculous and very over engineered. I believe some doubles do not have a bite correct? The side lock which is a bit more finicky than a normal box lock, but the sidelock is a lot more fun to look at of course.

Most are finicky and require an enormous amount of load development to be brought to their full potential. All are close to moderate range rifles at best.
I had a Wilkes, Manton, Wesley Richards and Alexander Henry. I’ve shot a few H&H rifles and wasn’t any more impressed with them.

There would be no reason an H&H is any better shooting of a rifle, you are not really paying for that. No doubt from my conversations with people at the very top of the double world that the Heym is the most over engineered and dependable double. A true workhorse, but lacks all the fun of an H&H or Westley of course. Almost bought few Henrys over the years.

Yes no double is a long range gun of course, and not even sure moderate depending on your definition of course. 50 to 100 yards tops especially if keeping open site which is the way to go.

I have been on tours at both H&H and Heym, 2 very different places for sure. H&H is an artists studio maiking 75 guns a year, Heym is a state of the art shop making barrels for Blaser and all sorts of perfection. Met the guy who regulates every double Heym makes, I have no clue how he still has retinas or a shoulder. Said a .600 might take 40-60 shots to regulate. Nope!

Have pics of the Westley? Any background on it?

 

[Happy Antelope]

Another guy to talk to is JJ Perodeau he is the king. There are a few of these guy left in the world with all this knowledge. There is an older gentleman who works with Chris at SCI and DSC named Tony (Shot the gorilla that escaped at the Dallas Zoo decades ago) who is a walking encyclopedia of big bores. A lot will be lost forever when he is gone someday. Talking doubles with him is beyond fun. He knows who bought 10 actions whom from whom and in 1910 because their wifes were friends or whatever to make some doubles, and every load for everything. If you are serious about a double I would come to SCI, talk to JJ and Tony.

 

[WCB]

Don't know if the OP is still following this or not but no idea how you try to dream/plan 10+ years out and want to drop the coin on a DR...for the price of even the decent ones you could just go do your hunt right now and not wait 10+ years. Could be crippled up, broke, or dead by then. Also, who the hell knows what game populations, travel, import, or firearm laws/restrictions will be in that length of time.