Cardio vs Strength Training

[123efd2]

Hey y'all,

I'm an east coast still hunter getting ready to do my first Idaho elk hunt this fall. What do you think is more important from a training perspective? Strength training or cardio? Why? What types of cardio are best? HIIT vs long jogging biking etc?

 

[*zap*]

tagged.

 

[BeaverHunter]

I’m not a physical trainer or some body builder type but I’ve never been out hiked by anybody. Sometimes my buddies jokingly call me a billy goat. I’m 6 foot tall and I weigh 170 pounds. I go to the gym 3-4 days a week, every week and I eat healthy(lots of fruits and veggies, mostly wild game) besides my beer consumption. I run or put the treadmill on max incline and do not touch the rails 1-2 times per week and lift weights at least 3 times per week. I mainly focus on compound movements(squat, deadlift, bench, pull-ups,etc.). I can’t lift very heavy but I can do a lot of reps. I’m also not very fast if you clock my mile times. I also hike at least once a week on average during the off season with my pack basically set up how it will be during hunting season(shed hunting/scouting). During the summer I will ruck around my neighborhood with about a 50 pound pack. I don’t feel a need to go any heavier as I feel it puts undue stress on my body/joints.

I can go day after day and have never had to quit even after 7 days in the frank church. This is what has worked for me. Not saying it’s the only way and hopefully I don’t sound cocky. Just wanted to share what works for me. I also feel the mental aspect is a big part that most people don’t factor in. The only way to train for that is to go out and do it. Preferably with a heavy load of elk or deer meat.

 

[*zap*]

I find it interesting that almost no one ever lists their age on these type of threads. Age and your starting point (what type of physical condition you are in now) are probably the most important factors when considering conditioning/training options.

 

[BeaverHunter]

I find it interesting that almost no one ever lists their age on these type of threads. Age and your starting point (what type of physical condition you are in now) are probably the most important factors when considering conditioning/training options.

Age 34

 

[Wrench]

You're going to need cardio to keep up the hunt and with the elk. You're going to need strength to keep a loaded pack moving up and post harvest.

You don't get to choose one or the other.

 

[*zap*]

Age 34

Doing all those posterior chain lifting exercises you mentioned on a regular basis would be very good for backpack hiking, imo.

 

[Ross]

If I was to pick one it would be cardio first....especially as you age the heart and lungs need the ability to not gas you....if chasing and calling bulls you will need more stamina than sitting at wallows or trying to intercept them...once they are on the ground strength comes into play to horse them around and then get them to the tailgate....as noted you don’t get to pick one or the other so maybe 65/35 cardio to strength training good luck almost 90 days out 55.5

 

[pods8 (Rugged Stitching)]

I found that JUST running rolling country preseason (even at 5000') just wasn't cutting it for going into the mountains, sure I had lungs but my legs would get torn up moving up steep grades with a pack on it just wasn't the same muscle engagement from running. I'm 6' and long legs so maybe this issue hits me harder on the uphill since the "lever arm" that is my leg is longer? Dunno, I just know my life in the mountains got a lot happier when I looked around for training options suited to the task. I typically do more running in the spring coming out of the winter and then start adding more mountain training as the summer progresses.

I use a lot from the MTI back country hunting program: https://mtntactical.com/shop/big-game-hunting-training-program/ First year I tried to do as much of it as I could and I'd say I completed 70-80% of it when dealing with a fulltime job/travel/side job/family, I felt awesome in the mountains that season. I don't do the mini events anymore, I just try to get 4-6days a week going into the season of the routines in there and I get quite a bit of the benefits I need to go up/down steep stuff with a load on and not fry. The workouts in there do a good job of working the heart/lungs while also loading up muscles in differing ways, some variable intensity based and some grind based.

Currently I'm way behind on fitness, I let winter beers/eating/lazy get compounded by work travel and I'm 30lb over target right now. I'm running a few days a week but feeling slow and weak so I have my work cut out this summer to make up for not maintaining better over the winter. 37yrs, 6', currently 205lb (175lb is a solid cut weight for me).

 

[Ariettabob]

If I was to pick one it would be cardio first....especially as you age the heart and lungs need the ability to not gas you....

Now 34 is aged? Zap and I are screwed

 

[Ross]

If 34 is aged then I’m dead and buried at 55 oh to be in the 30s again only benefit now is a basement full of racks and a nice 401k

 

[RyanC]

Great advice so far. I agree that it really depends on where you're at currently with cardio and strength. Spending too much time on just one of those and you will wish you spent more time on the other when you're half way through your hunt. With that said, I do believe there is what I call a "Floor" and "Ceiling" when it comes to fitness. Simply put, you should be able to lift a minimum amount of weight in all major lifts and complete specific cardio events in a minimum amount of time (The Floor). Exact strength numbers for major lifts is a subjective and some may disagree but my opinion is that if you can bench press your body weight, back squat 1 1/2 x bodyweight, and deadlift 2 x bodyweight, you're probably strong enough to move efficiently through the mountains. Maintain your strength by continuing to lift 3 days per week and work on your aerobic capacity.

Personally I Crossfit in the offseason. It provides a lot of variety in movement modalities and involves cardio in nearly every workout. As season gets closer I get more specific in my training and do a lot of backpacking, weighted step ups, and really focus on legs and lungs.

Ok, I'm rambling now.....reach out if you have specific questions and I'd be happy to help out.

Take care,

Ryan

 

[mb6355]

I am 51, live in New Orleans, and have elk hunted in Montana the last 5 years. Since I am at sea level and I think the highest hill in town is 24 ft, almost all of my cardio is done at an incline, usually the max setting. The best or closest to actually walking up a mountain is a step mill, it is much harder than a treadmill at 15 degrees. But if you're backpack hunting, I would strength train also. Getting an elk chopped up and packed out 5+ miles from some steep canyon is probably one of the harder things most people will ever do, especially if you add snow and alot of deadfall.

Like was mentioned in one of the earlier posts, almost all my strength training is compound movements, usually 3-4 sessions a week. I do cardio almost every morning for 40-60 minutes and in another month or will switch some of the sessions to rucking up and down the levees here with a 40 lb pack. I would not train any heavier than that with the pack, it is alot of stress on the body. If you can comfortably get up and down the mountains with that weight, you can pack the elk out. Figure with 2 people, 3 trips unless you really load heavy. I have done 4 now and really try to limit the load to around an elk quarter plus gear. Getting through the deadfall where I hunt is hard enough without an elk on your back.

The one thing I would stress is the better shape you are in, the more enjoyable it will be (and the better odds of success). We have had few people go that just underestimated (and did not listen) what physical demands are and they just ended up truck hunting after day 1. It is hard for many people in the east to grasp just how hard it is hike and gain elevation vs hiking on level land. Just add 1 or 2 degrees and you will feel the difference immediately. Add snow and many people are done after a mile or so.

 

[fwafwow]

I'm late to this thread, but I'm 49 and was pretty much out of shape. I spent a few weeks getting in shape enough to just work on getting in shape (if you know what I mean). Now I'm about 3 weeks into a 12 week program for backpackers that is a mix of cardio, strength (primarily legs and core) and rucking that is not too difficult (at least so far....). 4 days a week and the workouts are short enough (but not necessarily easy) that you can do two a day (if needed - like one gym session and cardio or rucking). Minimal equipment required. I've dropped about 2% total body weight, but more important (to me) is that I've dropped 4% body fat (from 16.3% to 12.3%) and can already notice better muscle in my legs and less-than-before gut.

If you are interested, PM me and I will send it to you, including pictures/diagrams of the exercises.

 

[pods8 (Rugged Stitching)]

with a 40 lb pack. I would not train any heavier than that with the pack, it is alot of stress on the body. If you can comfortably get up and down the mountains with that weight, you can pack the elk out.

Everyone is different but I don't find this to fit me well, if I only train 40lb I am under prepared and hurt myself in the mountains (got a nagging knee issue from doing just that). My body isn't ready to haul 75-90lb (not the 100+ stuff) if I don't train for it which includes hauling loads like that some (not all) of the time and makes me weak and unstable on uneven terrain and steep stuff with a weight my body isn't used to hauling sometimes, in my experience at least. I'm not a mountain beast with 100+ loads but at the same time being adequately prepared to haul 75-90lb is just practical when talking elk. Even an average bull is 200lb of boned meat, plus head, plus first load you have your weapon system/optics/etc at minimum if just day gear along, you always have the weight of your pack and basic emergency gear (which never leaves my pack when in the mountains regardless off activity) and some water. So 200+20ish for head+20ish ea on weapon/optics/stuff not counting pack/basic gear is at least 260lb for 2 guys to move who pretty much have at least 15lb on them already with the weight of the base pack/gear to be in the mountains safely. With 6 total trips (3ea) you're at ~60lb total pack weight right there but to do it in 4 trips (2ea) would be ~80lb. If its a 5mi packout through mountain terrain I'd rather be trained up and do it in 2 trips and even if doing 3 trips I'd want to feel strong having been ready for the realistic 60lb full pack load in the mountains which I personally think 40lb outside of the mountains leaves me ill prepared for based on my past training with that verse heavier.

Sorry thats so wordy just wanted to illustrate an issue I seem to see about the spread between the too heavy and seemingly too light training I see suggested for mountain hunts. 100+ is for a select set of folks and the average dude shouldn't feel like they must do something like that but on the other end thinking you can stay down around 40lb in my opinion isn't at all realistic. Most guys backpack hunting are over that load and they're carrying it all day. Folks are under prepared for elk in the mountains if that's all they prepare for. $0.02 But that doesn't mean pack 90lb day after day for training either, mix it up but some of that mix should loading your body so all the connective tissue gets used to it before you are stumbling through the mountains with hip flexors frying out, etc.

 

[GraveyardNRSE]

Def do cardio. I went to Mt with a bodybuilding lifestyle and 12% BF. The elevation killed me. I had lactic acid build up constantly and I swore I would never lean more bodybuilding instead of cardio. Since then I’ve dropped 15lbs and I’m enrolled in a cross fit cardio camp for the next 6 weeks. Wind sprints, long distance, box jumps, bear crawl, core lifts. I know this will help immensely. One of my other buddies who I was with is more cardio and also weighs 50lbs less. He was unfazed by the mountains and I was super envious. Like I said, cardio, cardio, cardio!

 

[*zap*]

Now 34 is aged? Zap and I are screwed

I am really screwed, 34+29= older than dirt.

 

[*zap*]

Train as hard as you can, always (you should always want to be the hardest worker in the room, "The Rock").....but pay attention to what your body is telling you. Rest days as necessary if your body says it needs it or active recovery days....swimming is great for active recovery day. Push for a lap or two and then just swim along for a while. Repeat.
Do two a day workouts if you can here and there, I can train hard or long so I train hard and short most of the time.... .75-1.5 hrs a day. Plus work at my home and garden business almost everyday now as weather permits.
Night ruck tonight...

 

[Coach Chris]

Hunting is rucking
Everything you do requires a percentage of absolute strength. The stronger you are the easier everything is.
80% of your training should be strength endurance and endurance training (SPP)
20% of your training should be absolute strength and endurance strength training (GPP)

 

[danarnold]

@52 years and 6' 195# cardio for me, I spend most my time in Missouri/sea level, you can be strong as a mule but when your lungs are scorched on the mountain all that extra muscle is def not your friend